GUILTY OH - Barb Williams for child abuse, Hancock County, 2014

[Cailin Rua]

Well if it's a "very challenging" six year old then nobody should face any negative consequences. Again with the vague references to "insider information".

 

[BD1]

RBBM
Excellent points. Thank you for the thoughtful, tomato-free response. :loveyou:

eta: although, teaching is one of the few professions where your clients bite and spit at you

Yeaaaaaahhhhh, but no. I posted a long while back in this thread. My husband is a teacher. He suffers the same issues you have shared, of course. And they are extremely concerning and problematic. I am an RN in a hospital setting. We share some of those same concerns. But if I was tending to your mom, and she was in a confused state due to her illness (which happens on the daily to some normally very nice people who are hospitalized), what would your reaction be if I said those things to her? If I manhandled her body in the same way? I am willing to bet your very first concern and priority would be that I *was never allowed to do that again to any of my innocent and vulnerable patients*! Much much later, it might cross your mind that there were staffing issues, that the elderly in America are not valued as they should be, that your mom threw poop at me or spat at me or clawed me or threw her IV pole at my head etc (all things that have happened to me, irl.) but even understanding those facts would not change that to you and your mom, this is a never situation.

Again. This is just a never situation. Never.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

ITA. I could never imagine speaking to ANY child in this manner and I have a nephew who would make any other child look like a boy scout. I always speak to him quietly and respectfully and he treats me the same way. :moo:

What bothers me is that this child was doing nothing. I don't care how he acted another day. This day he was doing NOTHING. He walked out of the bathroom and was walking to class and WHAM. He is assaulted.

I have been a mother for 25 years. And the first thing you learn as a parent when your kids are having a meltdown is that calmer you are the better it goes. The more angry and upset you are the worse it goes.

Adults, especially adults in charge of little kids have no right to behave in this manner. This woman is an abuser. She assaulted this child for NO REASON. She should never ever be around children. And if this was my relative she would NEVER EVER be left alone around my children.

 

[BD1]

And can I just add one more thing? This kid, in this moment captured in time, was doing NONE of those things. We *might* be able to surmise, based on the situation, that he was wandering. He *may* have left the room without permission. Beyond that, we just really don't know what the issue was that set this teacher off about this kid, rumors not withstanding. So to even begin discussing how each profession is sanctioned by policy to deal with the 'behaviors' of the clients they are servicing and the effectiveness of such is to veer into the long term and underlying reasons a professional might crack under the pressure. Which is a valuable convesation to have, at some point. After the point is conceded. This teacher should be fired and assault charges pressed.

 

[blue22]

Sigh. This conversation...:scared::scared::scared: :couch:

I'm a step-mom to be...but essentially already a step-mom as child has lived with us more than half-time for the past year, and full time for the past few months. Anyway, it is hard--trying to find one's place in an already-made family...hard for dad to let go a little and let me discipline and have some input, hard for little man to have another adult at dad's house, no matter how much he likes me I'm not his bio mom. And hard for bio mom for various predictable reasons. I've definitely learned a lot and yes, wanted to run screaming into the hills sometimes.

I'm also a teacher. I teach preschoolers, the majority of whom are considered "at-risk" due to issues like poverty, homelessness, parental incarceration, neurological/cognitive issues, abuse and neglect, domestic violence, parental addiction, and so on. Now that is a hard job. One can never be truly prepared for the amount of responsibility and the high level of expectations. Pair that with a low amount of respect, and an even lower wage, and I'm sometimes amazed any of us show up for work at all. "You aren't in it for the money, though." How many times do I hear that one? No, I'm certainly not in it for the money, but there's a huge fundamental issue when my wage qualifies me for the same services offered to the low-income families on my case-load/classroom. (Due to funding cuts the teachers all had a 40-hour/week social services position added to our already overloaded full-time duties). So, while we don't do it for the money, most of us didn't realize that we'd be standing in the food box line screening calls from student loan collectors, either.

Anyway...sorry, getting off-track--emotional issues (eta: I mean these issues are emotionally-charged ones, not that I have emotional issues, although I suppose that's debatable heh)

Teachers don't get the support they need in order to use the tools and strategies they have. Our class sizes get bigger and bigger, our duties increase exponentially, and we go years and years in-between our 0.01% COLA raises, which is sometimes all we can expect. Obviously, this isn't true for every single teacher, but it's certainly been true for me and mine. The amount of students who exhibit challenging behaviors, and the behaviors themselves get increasingly difficult every single year.

Sorry, sorry, getting way off track again (sorry, Salem)

In any case, all that being what it is, I have never touched a child in anger, never threatened a child with vague (eta: or non-vague, just said vague because of the threat in this specific case) bodily harm, and have certainly never assaulted a child. I agree what this teacher did was wrong and she needs to be disciplined--severely. However, it would be great if instead of getting all holier-than-thou, we could recognize this as a learning opportunity and a wake-up call--we need to support our teachers. We can't expect them to be miracle workers with little-to-no resources and then condemn them when they crack under the completely unreasonable pressure we've put upon them.

No one wanted this to happen. I can't imagine the teacher is proud that this will be the defining moment in her career, and obviously the child and his family are rightfully upset. But it'd be super awesome cool if we could all pull out some compassion and realize this didn't happen in a vacuum, and perhaps there's more to it than an "evil teacher" and/or a "misbehaving child," but more of a result of a system that isn't working. IMO, of course. Let the tomatoes fly lol :couch:

Actually, the "system" has a no tolerance policy. If a child had done the same thing, they would be kicked out and if old enough, charged with a crime.

But the teacher gets compassion. Go figure.

 

[Linda7NJ]

This male teacher was arrested and charged for doing the exact same thing ...to a 13 year old.

http://m.wcvb.com/news/cops-rhode-island-teacher-assaults-student-over-cookie/25208556


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[screecher]

Well if it's a "very challenging" six year old then nobody should face any negative consequences. Again with the vague references to "insider information".

"very challenging" or meek as a lamb six year old, the person with the 'power', Barb Williams, ought to wield that power with a fair mindfulness and consistent behaviors which are driven by the premise that all children, in any setting, have an innate right to be treated with respect that fosters a love of learning in an environment where one feels safe.

Barb Williams, using her power, chose to do the opposite. I believe she has abused her power many, many times with this student. And other students she felt 'challenged' with. It's time Barb Williams pays the piper for abuse of power.

The reference to "insider information"...huh? There is no verified so-called "insider information" only RUMORS.

 

[flourish]

Yeaaaaaahhhhh, but no. I posted a long while back in this thread. My husband is a teacher. He suffers the same issues you have shared, of course. And they are extremely concerning and problematic. I am an RN in a hospital setting. We share some of those same concerns. But if I was tending to your mom, and she was in a confused state due to her illness (which happens on the daily to some normally very nice people who are hospitalized), what would your reaction be if I said those things to her? If I manhandled her body in the same way? I am willing to bet your very first concern and priority would be that I *was never allowed to do that again to any of my innocent and vulnerable patients*! Much much later, it might cross your mind that there were staffing issues, that the elderly in America are not valued as they should be, that your mom threw poop at me or spat at me or clawed me or threw her IV pole at my head etc (all things that have happened to me, irl.) but even understanding those facts would not change that to you and your mom, this is a never situation.

Again. This is just a never situation. Never.

I never indicated this was anything but a "never" situation. Teaching is one of the few professions where your clients spit and bite you. Nursing is another. We agree here, this teacher was wrong and should be disciplined.

 

[flourish]

Actually, the "system" has a no tolerance policy. If a child had done the same thing, they would be kicked out and if old enough, charged with a crime.

But the teacher gets compassion. Go figure.

Lol, um, no, students are not just kicked out. My post clearly indicated all the humans in this situation deserve compassion, but that is being overlooked. Go figure.

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[ScarlettScarpetta]

Well if it's a "very challenging" six year old then nobody should face any negative consequences. Again with the vague references to "insider information".

Um... no...

No matter what is up with the 6 yr old, The teacher is still the one who has to remain in control and behave accordingly.
We know in this instance he walked out of the bathroom and he was assaulted. He was not being challenging. He was assaulted while kindergartening.

There is no insider information. There is no back story. This is about this act. And this act alone is enough to charge her with assault and battery.
She is a menace and an abuser.

If I did this to my child on the street, My butt would be arrested and thrown in jail. Teachers should be held to the same standard.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Im posting this again.. People need to see the assault. Then she takes him into a private area who the heck knows what she did there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vH46floJQRk

She is a beast. I gotta tell you if that was my child, I would be in jail right now. I would not be able to not give her some of her own medicine.

 

[screecher]

This male teacher was arrested and charged for doing the exact same thing ...to a 13 year old.

http://m.wcvb.com/news/cops-rhode-island-teacher-assaults-student-over-cookie/25208556


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Yes. Someone does have the ability to know and follow the law.

 

[blue22]

Lol, um, no, students are not just kicked out. My post clearly indicated all the humans in this situation deserve compassion, but that is being overlooked. Go figure.

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Why should adults who assault children, get compassion? Seriously, why? Because they are a teacher? Boohoo. Hundreds of thousands of people are teachers and only a select group physically assaults students. I'm sick of teachers getting a pass, because their job is hard. It doesn't matter what your job is. It doesn't matter how hard it is. If you can't do your job without threatening and assaulting, you don't deserve your job or compassion.

And yes, they do get kicked out for a time. (Suspension or expulsion, moved to a different school, put in alternative school, etc.)

 

[blue22]

This male teacher was arrested and charged for doing the exact same thing ...to a 13 year old.

http://m.wcvb.com/news/cops-rhode-island-teacher-assaults-student-over-cookie/25208556


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It's a man. The double standard does not surprise me, unfortunately.

If this had been a man, people would want his head. But this poor, overworked, stressed out teacher deserves compassion. :banghead:

 

[Cailin Rua]

Um... no...



No matter what is up with the 6 yr old, The teacher is still the one who has to remain in control and behave accordingly.

We know in this instance he walked out of the bathroom and he was assaulted. He was not being challenging. He was assaulted while kindergartening.



There is no insider information. There is no back story. This is about this act. And this act alone is enough to charge her with assault and battery.

She is a menace and an abuser.



If I did this to my child on the street, My butt would be arrested and thrown in jail. Teachers should be held to the same standard.

I was being sarcastic. Someone brought up the term "very challenging" (child) as a mitigating factor for the teacher's behavior, [modsnip]

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I was being sarcastic. Someone brought up the term "very challenging" (child) as a mitigating factor for the teacher's behavior, [modsnip]

Shewwwww.... :loveyou:

I got scared there for a moment..

 

[Flutterby80]

I think some very good points have been made here regarding how this child was treated vs how people expect adults to be treated. It is true that if an adult was grabbed and threatened in this manner, there would be legal consequences. It's not socially allowable to assault and threaten an adult. Why is it more ok to do so to a child? And don't give me any bullcrap about children needing to be restrained. He wasn't doing anything wrong!!!

 

[screecher]

Yeah, I don't get the mindset it's perfectly acceptable (and to be expected in fact) to assault a child (you know, if the kid peed and wandered off or just because). Now, I'm getting the sense it's supposedly expected and totally accepted a TEACHER doing it is in the best interest of the classroom. Not to mention the kid.

It blows my mind. Still wanting to know what Barb Williams did to the little tyke when she pulled/dragged him out of camera's eye. There's a reason she did that. UGH.

 

[blue22]

Yeah, I don't get the mindset it's perfectly acceptable (and to be expected in fact) to assault a child (you know, if the kid peed and wandered off or just because) by someone. Now, I'm getting the sense it's supposedly expected and totally accepted a TEACHER doing it is in the best interest of the classroom.

It blows my mind. Still wanting to know what Barb Williams did to the little tyke when pulled/dragged him out of camera's eye. There's a reason she did that. UGH.

Yep. That wasn't just a coincidence.

 

[screecher]

...corporal punishment... I don't see how in the world this teacher could be convicted of assault....

RSBM

Corporal punishment is ILLEGAL in Ohio. Grounds for assault.

What charges would you have teachers in school districts that are okay with corporal punishment face? That's an honest question.

Lawful answer:

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2014/05/15/caught-tape-ohio-teacher-barb-williams-grabs-kindergartner-face

... If there is evidence supporting charges and arrest,....

RSBBM

If? Have you not seen the video?

Looking at Ohio's assault laws, I don't think this meets the standard of simple assault....

RSBM

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2014/05/15/caught-tape-ohio-teacher-barb-williams-grabs-kindergartner-face

...

ETA: IF she chose not to have hearings, than it could go pretty quickly. I guess I feel like a lady who assaults a kid and threatens to rip him apart...doesn't seem like someone who is going to just slink away. I'd love to be wrong. Heck, I'd love if she is charged with a crime and gets kicked to the freaking curb.

RS and BOLDED BM

Particularly when supposedly 'supported' by the majority of other residents of the district. UGH.

...

And for parents, the discrepancy is even much broader and assaults are allowed to occur that specifically do NOT fall under "domestic violence" in Ohio.

RSBM

Not so. Corporal punishment is illegal in Ohio. Period.

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2014/05/15/caught-tape-ohio-teacher-barb-williams-grabs-kindergartner-face

Without going into specifics about any particular case,...
Again, I really want to keep that question generic and don't want to go into specifics of any case.

Snipped by me

Why post a 'generic' scenario when this thread is specific to a teacher assaulting a student???

I think some very good points have been made here regarding how this child was treated vs how people expect adults to be treated. It is true that if an adult was grabbed and threatened in this manner, there would be legal consequences. It's not socially allowable to assault and threaten an adult. Why is it more ok to do so to a child? And don't give me any bullcrap about children needing to be restrained. He wasn't doing anything wrong!!!

BBM

IMO, it has to do with leadership. Barb Williams, for all intent and purpose is a "leader". A good leader will:

https://www.upworthy.com/a-ted-talk...into-a-feminist-its-pretty-fantastic-7?c=ufb4

Yeah, I know some will think/feel this is irrelevant, children, the elderly, the mentally impaired, ect., have all been placed where it's acceptable to be ignored, be abused, be assaulted...we can have all the statutes in the the world to insure otherwise, truth is, if this ^ doesn't happen, we all are doomed.

Who has the POWER? In this particular case, Barb Williams had/has the power.

Please click this link. https://www.upworthy.com/a-ted-talk-...astic-7?c=ufb4 From 10 mins on is so spot on. Perhaps it may bend some minds.

Good educators will/ought speak against student assault/abuse. I believe most educators are mindful.