I agree with the plausibility of the hookup thing as well, but I am offended at the generalizations that were made above about the gay community. Proud2beme does NOT speak for Joey or the gay community. I seriously almost threw up after reading those posts...not appropriate!
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Very repectfully,
We are adults. We are discussing the death of a young gay male. Grindr, crusing and sex are the core issues in the sitution.
Any discussion IMO, regarding sexual behaviors in the gay community are imo "appropriate", in that they seem to be the crux at what happened here. I think some folks think - that discussing a young gay male who might be sexually active is a negative connotation of the Joey. It only is for those who think a sexually proiscious young male is negative.
Especially in the gay community, being promsicous , for many, is the ideal place to be. Not all. However IMO it fair to come to the conclusion,based on facts presented, that Joey was fine with being a sexually active.
I think promiscious gets thrown in more becasue there is no intent, by two particpating parties, of dating - it is what is -- sex, see ya, dont want your number, when ya ask me not giving ya mine - needs met, was clear that I was not looking to go dining with you later, and in a lot of instances that is just understood and quite the way both want it .Thanx and bye! (in the old days name did not matter!)
I did not find any posts inapproriate here -- its a sex related murder moo
The Union restroom is crowded and cramped. The idea he used the restroom to douche or whatever is silly. He probably had to pee.
We know Joey's phone was pinging for a while after he left Union. He must have known his cousins we're going to leave soon.
My hunch is someone he was at least acquainted with (even if just casually) drew him out of the bar and onto the street.
Someone placed Joey's body in the river. That is a crime so someone did do something wrong at some point.
It seems like CPD is as baffled as anyone else about the COD and the events leading up to it. But I keep coming back to the still frames that CPD randomly decided to release. Was the taller balding guy a clue CPD was hoping would be recognized? Shrug.
Does it def look like to you guys that the bald guy at J were talking with one another?
I may be stating the obvious here, but here goes. I think that Joey inhaled or ingested something and had a negative reaction to it. The 'big' question is whether it was done voluntarily (in order to conform and be social) or taken involuntarily.
Those dating apps are a combination of people seeking real dating, those seeking dating but will have/open to sex until the right person comes along, and those seeking hookups only. It varies as much as people vary.
Most of the guys on those apps, in my personal experience, are seeking hookups. Those who are seeking real dating will get deterred away from such an atmosphere, leaving those guys seeking hookups as the remaining people left on the site. Which one of the 3 above Joey was seeking out, i am not privy too. I do know that my relatives would be shocked to find out the things that i have done over the years.
Those are my thoughts anyways.
That is the sense I get from my neighbor who is 22. He uses a lot. Only for hookups. And to be quite honest the few I have met , well lets say dont bring home to mommy!
What I observe with people about 1-2 decades behind me is a more casual attitude or philosophy about sexual acts. Sex is likely to be viewed as fun, healthy, and recreational. I don't think young people being "promiscuous" is devaluing or objectifying, rather, I think it's a new generation perhaps coming up in an age where sex isn't tied up into religion, rigid mores, or judgments. Much like the increasing mainstream acceptance of gender as a social construct or sexuality being on a spectrum, I think sexual activity is much more viewed as a healthy, positive expression of trust and connection, but doesn't necessarily require a level of intimacy that generations past have demanded of "legitimate" relationships. I don't think this is a bad thing. Eventually, those who desire a more intimate or exclusive relationships generally find one another. I do have concerns about the increase in STDs, however. Also, I have to say although I am not gay, my nieces and nephews have many friends (late teens and 20s) who are gay, and amongst their circle of friends, committed, monogamous relationships are the rule rather than the exception. Again, maybe a generational trend? In any case, I wish eventually there will be some answers for his family and friends. It's tragic enough that he's dead, but not to have hows or whys must be additionally excruciating.
I am in late 50's, and was lucky enough to expericne my lifestyle pre aids for 15 years when there were far more opportunites and settings to meet. Aids took a while to grasp . I knew about it when it was called GRID - Gay Related Infection Disease, long time before it was actually identifeid as what it is now.
It was intially San Fran and thought to be linked to poppers. Poppers was a party entity (!) whose orgins came up via amyl nitrate - a RX deal that was sniffed during a heart attack.
It was marelvous darling! Loved poppers! So did everyone else. They were awesome on the dance floor and in bed - everything heightening. Little brown bottles, you inhale. The "effect" lasted about three minutes.
once they real amyle took off , companies started to make rip offs that were very dangerous, legal, and remained in very high use.
Digress.
I think I am a generation ahead of this poster, and they were very very promsicious years. We were far enough after Stonewall where the community had places to go and the bathhouses were very popular.
Very. Bath houses were solely for sex. Basically think of a hotel with doors open and men inviting those interested in for some sex , then a shower, and you were on to your next conquest!
This went on endlessly. They were open 24/7/365, were all over the country (like a franchise - think McDonalds and your there!)
Certain gay parks in every city were gay, where crusing and sex happened. They were very wild years sexually.
Although very limited interaction now with crusing etc - I think that , as far as gay promsciity it went
70-s 80's - wild
80 -90s sex became a scary entity, toned down a bit
90 20 on the rise, were behaviors that could be engaged in safe ways
20 - now internet has taken it back somewhat to promiscious - there is however , always looming in the background for this generation, a boogie man which results , in reality, it being nothing like the true freedom and celebration promiscuity afforded those of lucky enough to eperinced the 70 - 80 as young men in our prime.
Hostorically IMo it was the best time to be in ones prime sexuality wise
Just mo meeting thro a keyboard as oppossed to three feet away is different. The male drive in 20's has not changed, but I think the apps give a much falser notion of knowing someome than face to face.
One could argue that (baths excluded obvioulsy) talking to someone face face for 15 minutes and finding a place for some sex, and saying goodbye is no diff than Grindr.
Behavirally true. But in the face to face for 15 minutes there was much more real "data". Tone of voice, eyes, etc . On a 4" screen easier to be someone else.
The issue IMO, is when the choice to meet is reached there is more of an illiusion that one knows the person much more so than in reality, which might result in putting oneselves, in more danger.
Sure it has happened - but the liklihood of getting killed in a bathhouse are lower than in having someone to your house or going there.
If that makes sense.
Would you please explain what you mean by this? T
And asserting that gay-identified folks are very promiscuous is indeed painting with quite a wide brush - sounds tantamount to saying that some childless people don't know how much babies like bananas.
ETA: yes, it's an odd analogy but I am leaving it. Think about it first.
Quite an analogy!!!!!!!!!!!!
I agree on many of these points. When you're young and have been drinking, it is totally plausible that he would sneak out for a hook up even though he was hanging with a couple family members.
OR, things took a suprise evil spin - imo the last text was a cry for help
Two points:
1) I met my partner on a gay dating app and we are in a monogamous relationship. It does happen, but it is rare.
2) I would think the police would have analyzed any online activity and found nothing. That means a person they can't track (unlikely but possible) or an in-person meeting without first contact on line.
OR
Someone saw him leave, or ran into him outside, and had things to "work out" so there is no internet footprint regarding who he was with at the end????
Hmmmmmmmmmmm.... did he leave a jacket with cousins? interesting to find that out - intent to return soon? When they finally released actual video , in a bar setting, it def looked like he was preparing to "leave" . He went through crowd quickly, and with a destination IMO. He was not cruising, or stopping to chat. The pace in the bathroom hallway appears to me , to be last piss before leaving. By that I mean it was quick pace , if that makes sense
