VERDICT WATCH OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered - 4 Wagner Family Members Arrested #85

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And if they do, folks here will still be complaining that Billy wasn't allowed to listen to the answers he gave BCI in his interviews before being cross examined.
I don't think that is what ppl on here are saying in reference to George's interview recording. Of course I can't speak for anyone else but my point in it all is that there's definitely something in that interview that the prosecution did not want in front of the jury. And I never insinuated George needed to hear it before his testimony or cross examination - but AFTER. If he was lying and she had the proof of the Audio, why not play it after he lied? And it for sure was available on audio. IMO.
 
It's all Canepa's fault. She refused to let him listen to recordings of his prior interviews so he could keep his story straight.;)
I don't think any one here is saying that at all. The reference to playing the audio is Why not AFTER he lied on the stand to prove he lied by his own words in the audio taping. Geez.
 
I'm upset because I believe George is guilty of Murder Conspiracy right along with his family but that the prosecution may not have presented a Case to the jury beyond a reasonable doubt. They have had 4 years of George sitting in jail while they were sitting on mountains of evidence.

4 years to parlay that evidence into reasonable doubt against George specifically, and I just am not sure if they came through after seeing how George's testimony was handled, amongst other things.

I am not comfortable that it looks like all 12 jurors will have to believe Angela and Jake to get a conviction. Clark Kent said they had enough evidence against him without Jake's testimony. But it looks like it's more important than ever that they totally believe Jake when he says George was with him that night. That they believe Angie when she says George went with them.

I keep saying, if the jury believes beyond a reasonable doubt that George went to the murder scenes that night, they will convict him of Aggravated Murder, Murder Conspiracy, Aggravated Burglary, and Tampering With Evidence.

If the jury has reasonable doubt George was at the murder scenes, there still is the chance the jury will believe beyond a reasonable doubt that George was in on the Murder Conspiracy and at least convict him of Murder Conspiracy.

And that he will get some type of long sentence for that.

COUNT 9, CONSPIRACY
But that mountain of evidence was against jake and Angie.

They really convicted their star witnesses of killing 8 people while not presenting any evidence against george other than the two witnesses they proved beyond a shadow of a doubt killed 8 people.

The jury will have to grapple with confessed and convicted murderers testimony to convict someone who the prosecution has no evidence against. Tough call.

JMO
 
That is normally when a prosecutor will hand the defendant a copy of the interview transcript
George even asked for a transcript to refresh his memory and Canepa refused to give him one and changed the subject.

I don't think this was done which means all the jury has is Canepa saying it. They at least needed the agent who interviewed George to say it, hear it directly from him, that could carry weight with the jury.

No it was not done and maybe they did not call the agent who did the interview to the stand because he would have contradicted what Canepa said, not what George said.

JMO
Exactly what I have been saying over and over. Totally agree.

In reference:
Right. If George said in his border BCI interview that he was up until midnight watching movies, then said on the stand he was in bed at 10 pm, that is a big discrepancy in George's testimony and would make the jury doubt his testimony.

That is normally when a prosecutor will hand the defendant a copy of the interview transcript and have the defendant read it and ask him to explain why he is now changing his story.

I expected this to be done, that there would be transcripts and maybe even recordings of this interview that would prove to the jury that George said things at the border that now he is changing his story on. This is standard 101 lawyering in getting the jury to doubt anything the defendant says on the stand.

You are catching them in lies, you are showing they are making things up, you help the jury distrust what the defendant says.

I don't think this was done which means all the jury has is Canepa saying it. They at least needed the agent who interviewed George to say it, hear it directly from him, that could carry weight with the jury.

The jury might disregard any discrepancies between what George said to LE and what George said on the stand without anything to back it up. With only Canepa saying it.

This is one reason why I will be angry with the prosecution if the jury acquits George. I expected the prosecution to present enough evidence beyond a reasonable doubt. This was important evidence that needed to be proven to the jury. What George said he did that night and the times he said he did them and then to show he completely changed his story about it, matters.

If I was a juror and the prosecution showed proof that George gave several different stories to LE that don't match up to what he is now saying on the stand, I would doubt all of his testimony. I would have reasonable doubt about his testimony. That now he is making up stories just to look good in front of the jury.
That is normally when a prosecutor will hand the defendant a copy of the interview transcript
George even asked for a transcript to refresh his memory and Canepa refused to give him one and changed the subject.

I don't think this was done which means all the jury has is Canepa saying it. They at least needed the agent who interviewed George to say it, hear it directly from him, that could carry weight with the jury.

No it was not done and maybe they did not call the agent who did the interview to the stand because he would have contradicted what Canepa said, not what George said.

JMO
 
I was riveted to his testimony, and have watched and re-watched parts but I felt like the jury was like me, rivited. I heard no snickers or giggles. I did hear Canepa making a high school girl taunting voice that showed her personality shine through even brighter... for an uncountable number of times.
I heard either Junk or Wilson loudly tell Canepa to shut up which she immediately did. It was toward the end of her questioning of George. I wondered what that was all about?

JMO
 
Exactly. Everything they accused other people of doing, they were doing their selves. Think about it, the drugs - yet Rhoden's no drugs, Wagner's drugs definitely. Sexual Assaults, They had 11 year old's sleeping with them boys! Drug the kids - sleepy Kool-Aid. SA victims unfit to care for kids but yet Angela was best to care for kids? Unreal really.
BBM

Can you please clarify what you mean about drugs, especially "Wagner's drugs definitely"

IMO, how can we blame just the Wagner's for underage minors sleeping together? There were 2 sets of "parents" allowing it. JMO.
 
I was riveted to his testimony, and have watched and re-watched parts but I felt like the jury was like me, rivited. I heard no snickers or giggles. I did hear Canepa making a high school girl taunting voice that showed her personality shine through even brighter... for an uncountable number of times.
I might add that if someone in the galley snickered or did eyerolls during testimony of any witnesses the judge would have had them removed from the courtroom. He made that plain before the trial started and during when he had a reporter escorted out.
JMO
 
I heard either Junk or Wilson loudly tell Canepa to shut up which she immediately did. It was toward the end of her questioning of George. I wondered what that was all about?

JMO
I heard something said at the end but I know she wrapped up very quickly. I think everyone was shocked to see him take the stand, even her, and she was unprepared.
 
AC said they didn't need him either but w/o him how would they have found the buckets in the pond? Maybe eons later. Without his testimony, how'd they have found the truck? Without his testimony, they had zip. He gave it all up to keep from dying b/c he said he knows he's going to hell when he dies. He's self-centered, and the fav of the family. Do you think it was happenstance he confessed on the anniversary of the murders? No. No way.

Prosecution was clear they, the prosecution, deliberately picked the 5th anniversary of the murders to have Jake plead guilty. Of course I don't think it is happenstance.

He pled guilty because his trial was 4 months away, he knew he would be found guilty then get the death penalty. He wanted to avoid the DP.

That is what most DP defendants do. Their lawyers job is to save them from the DP and their lawyers help convince them to plead guilty in order to get the DP dropped.
 
Wasn't it SW who told them they had given Bullvine some medicine Kool aid?
I am wondering about a possible connection between the cough medicine AW bought at the Walmart (the same day she purchased the shoes) and the 'Kool Aid' medicine SW described.

How would SW even know what 'Kool Aid' medicine is? Was it because AW had given her 'Kool Aid' medicine before?

What better way to mask the taste of cough syrup than to mix it with with sugary Kool Aid? Maybe AW used that to calm the children down before?

Just thinking out loud and catching up.

JMO
 
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Jmo I will be honest prior to George testifying I thought he was guilty of something not sure what but the state hadn’t proved it. But after he testified and the state called no rebuttal witnesses I can’t even believe he was guilty of planning or killing. I believe George came out and asked Jake while cleaning up those trailers like he said.
 
BBM

Can you please clarify what you mean about drugs, especially "Wagner's drugs definitely"

IMO, how can we blame just the Wagner's for underage minors sleeping together? There were 2 sets of "parents" allowing it. JMO.

True, all parents were aware the girls were underage, (as was GW at one point) however only one family consistently made ugly claims about s-abuse against everyone and their brother while allowing it to blossom & grow under their own roof. AND, only one ENTIRE family lost their lives over those claims.

That's how we can blame them.
 
Can someone tell me what the meaning of selling a pregnant chicken means? Why was it so funny to Jake/family?
Yes, I'm a city dweller.
All chickens lay eggs. So yes, she'd get eggs, and if the chicken had been with a rooster, you'd get fertilized eggs. Maybe he thought the woman thought that the chicken gave birth to chicks... She probably just thought he was a goof and tells a story about a village idiot who thought he had a pregnant chicken. :rolleyes:
 
Jmo I will be honest prior to George testifying I thought he was guilty of something not sure what but the state hadn’t proved it. But after he testified and the state called no rebuttal witnesses I can’t even believe he was guilty of planning or being there at all. I believe George came out and asked Jake while cleaning up those trailers like he said.
 
He's going away, guilty of conspiracy or not.

I am not convinced of that. He took the stand against all odds and did a really good job. If the jury paid attention to the evidence I think they are going to come back with a NG.

JMO
I think he did a good job too, but if there are only one or two holdouts, the majority will pull them over the line, or the judge will "encourage" them. A hung jury would be a disaster.
 
I don't think any one here is saying that at all. The reference to playing the audio is Why not AFTER he lied on the stand to prove he lied by his own words in the audio taping. Geez.
If the prosecution had it, then the defense had it and George already read it. The prosecution must hand over everything they have to the defense in discovery.
JMO
 
Prosecution was clear they, the prosecution, deliberately picked the 5th anniversary of the murders to have Jake plead guilty. Of course I don't think it is happenstance.

He pled guilty because his trial was 4 months away, he knew he would be found guilty then get the death penalty. He wanted to avoid the DP.

That is what most DP defendants do. Their lawyers job is to save them from the DP and their lawyers help convince them to plead guilty in order to get the DP dropped.
Jake chose when to come clean and make his deal. It would land on or near then. As for the prosecution saying they chose that date, then if I were the victim's family, I'd not be happy about that.
 
One thing I have been thinking about. Angie planned and carried out the arson of every house they owned. I am wondering why she did not plan and carry out arson of the Peterson Rd house? Maybe because it was in George's name and he told her no way?

Something to think about.

JMO
Valid question. One rationale, though, could be the murder investigation made them more cautious. After the murders, there are no other crimes I think that any of them have been alleged to be a part of, I think
 
Jmo I will be honest prior to George testifying I thought he was guilty of something not sure what but the state hadn’t proved it. But after he testified and the state called no rebuttal witnesses I can’t even believe he was guilty of planning or killing. I believe George came out and asked Jake while cleaning up those trailers like he said.
I admit, I'm still on the fence. I guess I believed it for so long that its hard to let go of the fact that I think he did something, at some point, but I just didn't feel they'd proven it, then he testifies and I'm kinda wondering, maybe he truly had no role for the to prove.
 
I heard something said at the end but I know she wrapped up very quickly. I think everyone was shocked to see him take the stand, even her, and she was unprepared.
IMO she has been unprepared from the beginning of this trial. This was the most disorganized trial I have ever seen I think it is because she tried to put on all the evidence against Jake and Angie instead of concentrating on just George. But that is just my opinion.
 
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