OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) #16

[Stippling]

As far as the cars go, there are several things that come to mind.

A car could be used during a crime in another state and hid in plain sight in rural Ohio.
A car could be used during a crime in Ohio or another state, sold cheap, and scrapped out in hours.
A car can be reported as stolen for insurance or to get out of payments and hidden or scrapped out.
Any of the above cars could be brought to another state and sold at an auction.
Selling car parts in Ohio is basically illegal unless you have a licenses to do it in Ohio.
Getting caught with parts on a car that were bought illegally will result in the parts, possibly the whole car, being confiscated.
A salvage title or possibly a clear title can be obtained for a car not picked up or repairs not paid for after a period of time.

Personally, I don't see cars bought at auctions to repair and resell as being a high dollar business. I see a lot of cars that look like they came from high end used car lots get sold as scrap. Legal salvage
yards seldom keep cars over ten years old now. They get crushed and sold for scrap. A car can look like new but used parts can't be found these days...

Detectives trained in auto theft (it is a highly specialized area nowadays) and it involves not only theft deterrence, but trafficking in RFI key duplicators, defeating locks and electronic hacking, theft rings shipping offshore, VIN altering, etc. The insurance industry often partners with and helps fund auto theft operations.

Cars have hidden VIN locations, as do stamped parts, ECUs, engines, etc. One thing they could be attempting is to see if the secret VIN imprints match up with the visible VIN. The secret VIN locations are changed and updated to law enforcement. The locations typically are not shared with the general public.

 

[Betty P]

I find a few aspects of it unusual. The lack of any BOLO or suspect imagery or even a basic perp description.

An information lockdown as tight as I have seen on a case of this magnitude in decades.

I see billboards, but I do not see any ongoing appeals engaging the public for more information.

I don't see a lot of updates to reassure the people in the general area.

In similar heinous murder cases, investigators have often released some parts of a suspect profile if they need public support in tagging a perp. Not here.

And this: Whomever was involved in this will change because of it and that change will be observable to family, close associates and or intimate partners. Perhaps he or she will abruptly leave the area or increase the use of intoxicants/sedatives or become withdrawn. Cases like this have been solved by querying people on changes in friends' behaviors. Sort of surprised they have not reached out more in that area. Or, could be it's solved and they do not need further public assistance and are waiting for the labs to make the public disclosures.

Here only as an interested observer. No connection to this in any way.

The lack of info disseminated to the public about a profile, alerts to watch for people whose behavior may have changed after the murders - missed work, left town, etc.- makes me think the FBI is not being consulted to a great degree. The recent public relations boosting news article about Ohio's BCI also indicates DeWine is bypassing FBI, JMO. There's no mention of collaborating with the FBI.

http://www.11alive.com/news/nation-now/ohio-scientists-work-with-cops-to-solve-rhoden-massacre_/212910503

Ohio BCI doesn't have enough experience in a case of this magnitude, IMO. They are in over their heads, but seem to be intent on locking up all evidence and information. Seems very political.

ETA: It's also been discouraging that, of the scant information they have released publicly (grow ops, investigating cars, cockfighting) , it hints that the victims are to blame for their own deaths. Not good, but that's how many of these politicians roll. No problems to solve if the victims brought their tragedies upon themselves.

 

[CSIDreamer]

Yes, yes, and yes again! We are of the same mind. I thought it was telling that LE basically said that they aren't going to release any info that could hinder this investigation (I'm summarizing here), but they did release the info about the fighting *advertiser censored* and pot plants pretty early on.

“I assume that the people or the person who committed these murders are watching the news coming out of Pike County,” DeWine said. “We don’t want to give the killer or killers any information on where this investigation is going.” from the 4/27/16 press conference with DeWine and Reader

Leads me to believe that releasing info about the pot and roosters was a distraction to get media focusing in a different direction than the case is actually taking LE. Hauling away all those cars, however, indicates that there is something very pertinent to the case involving them. There could be so many crimes associated with car sales. The possibilities are endless and could expose a huge network of crime. What is also apparent about the Rs is that the car business was a family affair. DR and HR were selling a variety of cars and other ATVs, the guys all worked on cars...it's a common denominator and seemed to be a big part of their lives. MOO

If that's the case, it's good news. They announced the marijuana and cockfighting potential from day one. Which means they had a pretty good idea from day one what was really going on.

 

[CSIDreamer]

The lack of info disseminated to the public about a profile, alerts to watch for people whose behavior may have changed after the murders - missed work, left town, etc.- makes me think the FBI is not being consulted to a great degree. The recent public relations boosting news article about Ohio's BCI also indicates DeWine is bypassing FBI, JMO. There's no mention of collaborating with the FBI.

http://www.11alive.com/news/nation-...with-cops-to-solve-rhoden-massacre_/212910503

Ohio BCI doesn't have enough experience in a case of this magnitude, IMO. They are in over their heads, but seem to be intent on locking up all evidence and information. Seems very political.

I'm not sure why the FBI needs to be or can be involved?

ETA: Didn't mean to sound snotty there! Unless they uncover evidence of organized crime or some type of federal offense, they've already offered to help, have helped per news reports. The FBI doesn't handle local murder cases.

Here's an overview of what they do:

https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/what_we_investigate

 

[Betty P]

I'm not sure why the FBI needs to be or can be involved?

They're much more experienced at examining crime scene evidence than Ohio BCI. They also have more resources at their disposal.

They're also better at profiling perps and interviewing potential suspects and monitoring activities of gangs/ criminals

If this crime involves some level of drug/marijuana trafficking (federal crimes), it likely requires investigation outside of Ohio and collaborating with other states to gather info and build a federal case. FBI and DEA are better equipped to do that, as are US attorneys.

If there's possible involvement of corrupt LE, FBI/DOJ is also preferred to investigate.

Just a few things for starters. Probably many more reasons why FBI collaboration would be very helpful.

 

[Betty P]

I'm not sure why the FBI needs to be or can be involved?

ETA: Didn't mean to sound snotty there! Unless they uncover evidence of organized crime or some type of federal offense, they've already offered to help, have helped per news reports. The FBI doesn't handle local murder cases.

Here's an overview of what they do:

https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/what_we_investigate

This likely needs to be an interstate investigation of drug trafficking, etc. FBI does get involved in that, is likely already involved in investigating activities of possible suspects.

Check the list at your link, you'll see they do investigate these things: gangs, public corruption, violent crime, etc. DEA handles the drug trafficking with them.

 

[357magnum pi]

I agree that without more info we're getting to a cold case state of mind. Either the LE has nothing and are stumped or they know what happened and are trying to make a huge far reaching case to make Dewine look good...

or they moved the command center away. The tip was probally followed by several questions, the question Asked to tipster would be nice to hear. Today I think they've had a general group of suspects from the beginning and may be moving towards collecting and observing the individuals associates but they had a well planned and organized system to hide who accuall killers where. Out of all the individuals that's got interviewed who acted like they screwed up and got in over there head and generally looks like they have remorse. I had to watch the interview several times. also seemed to have the best alibi for the night also. Thanks to another sluether he put in the time and found another avenue. But do beleive police are trying to put them behind bars on other charges and have one of the suspects under close watch. due to rules can't say more but you may have to dive deep into a rabbit hole and leave the Victims family to the side and beleive they are victims as I beleive they are.

 

[rsd1200]

Has there been any confirmed connections to opiate sales/heroin sales? I belong to various support groups ( I have a family member that got involved with this god awful drug). On many days there are posts "Kill your local heroin dealer". I can't remember which victim's fb page I visited (a female) but there was a post about an addict. I can't remember exactly what it said, Something about loving an addict being hell (it was a meme) Addict is meth or heroin in my opinion. I know for a fact Ohio and Kentucky heroin use is pretty widespread. I'd be curious if there were any overdoses around this time. If this is inappropriate, delete..

One of my theories, and yes, there was.

 

[Ann99]

One of my theories, and yes, there was.

Was it across the Ohio River?

 

[CSIDreamer]

This likely needs to be an interstate investigation of drug trafficking, etc. FBI does get involved in that, is likely already involved in investigating activities of possible suspects.

Check the list at your link, you'll see they do investigate these things: gangs, public corruption, violent crime, etc. DEA handles the drug trafficking with them.

I know what the list says. But unless they have evidence it falls into one of their niches .... they are not going to investigate. I mean, to us, we plainly see all this stuff. Or so we think. Haha. We also don't know what's going on behind the scenes. For all we know, they've uncovered evidence that has opened the door for the FBI to get involved. Or not.

 

[rsd1200]

Was it across the Ohio River?

The one I stumbled across was not. I've run this case by a couple people in my family, we're from the Appalachia region, and first thing that came to mind is that this family, had done something, to someone that the other person(s) considered so egregious, that they have wiped out that family branch, and those associated with what happened.

 

[OsoTejano]

The lack of info disseminated to the public about a profile, alerts to watch for people whose behavior may have changed after the murders - missed work, left town, etc.- makes me think the FBI is not being consulted to a great degree. The recent public relations boosting news article about Ohio's BCI also indicates DeWine is bypassing FBI, JMO. There's no mention of collaborating with the FBI.

http://www.11alive.com/news/nation-now/ohio-scientists-work-with-cops-to-solve-rhoden-massacre_/212910503

Ohio BCI doesn't have enough experience in a case of this magnitude, IMO. They are in over their heads, but seem to be intent on locking up all evidence and information. Seems very political.

ETA: It's also been discouraging that, of the scant information they have released publicly (grow ops, investigating cars, cockfighting) , it hints that the victims are to blame for their own deaths. Not good, but that's how many of these politicians roll. No problems to solve if the victims brought their tragedies upon themselves.

I think that the tight control of information from the investigation is a good thing for a couple of reasons for not wanting to show their cards.

1 - This case is going to have to be prosecuted at some point and it is likely going to be a highly circumstantial case with aggravated murder charges(same as capital murder in other states). That said, the release of details could compromise the ability of the investigators to vet information that they are getting from tips.

2 - This case really looks like a contract hit and just getting the people responsible for executing the hit is not enough, the people behind it also need to be prosecuted. Best to get them at the same times as the animals that carried out the murders.

MOO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Ann99]

The one I stumbled across was not. I've run this case by a couple people in my family, we're from the Appalachia region, and first thing that came to mind is that this family, had done something, to someone that the other person(s) considered so egregious, that they have wiped out that family branch, and those associated with what happened.

I see a possibility in what you say, and I can see a situation where I can make a general association to support it.
however,
I accidentally stumbled across another, and I don't have all the facts I need, specifically, a cause of death. Need that.
I am working on several assumptions, so it may be false.
But it would involve drugs, in both instances.

 

[ginestra]

If I had a child, in their prime of their life, that od'd on heroin, oxycontin, fentanyl, etc. I would probably be capable of horrible things. I have NO DOUBT I would fantasize hurting, bringing down the person who provided the deadly dose. Yet, that wouldn't be so neat, seems it would be sloppier.....

 

[24Roses]

I find a few aspects of it unusual. The lack of any BOLO or suspect imagery or even a basic perp description.

An information lockdown as tight as I have seen on a case of this magnitude in decades.

I see billboards, but I do not see any ongoing appeals engaging the public for more information.

I don't see a lot of updates to reassure the people in the general area.

In similar heinous murder cases, investigators have often released some parts of a suspect profile if they need public support in tagging a perp. Not here.

And this: Whomever was involved in this will change because of it and that change will be observable to family, close associates and or intimate partners. Perhaps he or she will abruptly leave the area or increase the use of intoxicants/sedatives or become withdrawn. Cases like this have been solved by querying people on changes in friends' behaviors. Sort of surprised they have not reached out more in that area. Or, could be it's solved and they do not need further public assistance and are waiting for the labs to make the public disclosures.
Here only as an interested observer. No connection to this in any way.

BBM-LE has said almost the same words in the Lyric and Elizabeth case in Iowa. However, it has been almost 4 years and no arrest(s). However, in both this case and the Rhoden's, I feel someone does know something but is either scared to turn in a loved one or is scared for their own safety. :moo:

 

[Stonepat1219]

Please delete if not allowed.
The last post made by HHG in her FB page reads
"If im not needed or wanted then I'll leave! 😠👍👌"

Was there trouble brewing between her and FR? Or someone else?

I just find find this chilling, that the next day she WAS gone

Did she have more than one FB page? I cannot find this on the one I'm looking at. Thanks!!

 

[rsd1200]

I see a possibility in what you say, and I can see a situation where I can make a general association to support it.
however,
I accidentally stumbled across another, and I don't have all the facts I need, specifically, a cause of death. Need that.
I am working on several assumptions, so it may be false.
But it would involve drugs, in both instances.

What I stumbled across was specifically an o.d. and it was just very sad. There is, a possible connection to GR, I've not made it firm yet, but we do know now that GR had a problem with harder drugs, at least in the past, and it is unlikely, imo, that he could stay clean in being around that environment. I'm not talking about marijuana, but some of the customers that would probably come around, would most likely have some of the same problems that GR had. If a person asked GR to score something for them, and he did, and they died, their family could see that as they murdered their child. This is just a theory. I've no hard facts other than GR's past issues w/shooting up in a parking lot w/his stepfather (that's is two people with problems imo), and a very thin connection to a person who o.d.'d not long before the murders.

 

[rsd1200]

If I had a child, in their prime of their life, that od'd on heroin, oxycontin, fentanyl, etc. I would probably be capable of horrible things. I have NO DOUBT I would fantasize hurting, bringing down the person who provided the deadly dose. Yet, that wouldn't be so neat, seems it would be sloppier.....

We don't know what kind of background any of the people had though.

 

[Ann99]

What I stumbled across was specifically an o.d. and it was just very sad. There is, a possible connection to GR, I've not made it firm yet, but we do know now that GR had a problem with harder drugs, at least in the past, and it is unlikely, imo, that he could stay clean in being around that environment. I'm not talking about marijuana, but some of the customers that would probably come around, would most likely have some of the same problems that GR had. If a person asked GR to score something for them, and he did, and they died, their family could see that as they murdered their child. This is just a theory. I've no hard facts other than GR's past issues w/shooting up in a parking lot w/his stepfather (that's is two people with problems imo), and a very thin connection to a person who o.d.'d not long before the murders.

Sounds like we are thinking along same lines. But you say the o.d. person was not in Ky? Right?
One of mine was.

 

[Ann99]

If I had a child, in their prime of their life, that od'd on heroin, oxycontin, fentanyl, etc. I would probably be capable of horrible things. I have NO DOUBT I would fantasize hurting, bringing down the person who provided the deadly dose. Yet, that wouldn't be so neat, seems it would be sloppier.....

The actual family could 'employ' others who could get the job done.
There are people like that who can be found, especially with connections.