OH - Pike County: 8 People From One Family Dead As Police Hunt For Killer(s) #35 *Arrests*

[kaykay543]

There was a fire at FW's that killed her horse(s), correct? Could it have been caused by an exploding meth lab? Meth manufacturing might explain why there seems to be so much money attached to that farm.

It was back in 1986 so probably not. I truly think it was an accidental fire. If it had been on purpose they would have never left Blue Boy in the barn.

 

[rsd1200]

It was back in 1986 so probably not. I truly think it was an accidental fire. If it had been on purpose they would have never left Blue Boy in the barn.

There was a storm, and a line came down on the barn that night, is what was said. It happens and when a barn goes up, it goes up fast. Horses get freaked out and won't leave the barn, unless you can get their eyes covered, most times. I don't think it was deliberate either. I would guess that one of her main concerns about going to prison would be that the horses and dogs are cared for.

 

[MyBelle]

I agree, the timing of the killings so soon after the birth of HMR's baby seems deliberate. I think it was probably noted by LE when investigating the crime, and strengthened the theory that the whole massacre was centered on HMR.

I don't know anything about paternity testing in Ohio, could JW have forced HMR to get a paternity test on her baby? My sense is, likely not. Note that paternity tests can be done on unborn babies, and she refused to do that and just left the father's name off the birth certificate. She likely didn't want to share custody with whomever was the father, and had probably been assured by her family that she wouldn't need child support.

The W's might have been determined not to miss out on a moment of this child's life if she was, in fact, JWs. In fact, they were facing the likelihood that they might never have any contact with 'their' child at all. The conflict between HMR/JW and therefore the families could have been as much centred on paternity testing this baby, as on custody of SW, since they began planning the massacre when HMR was about 4 months pregnant, ie around the time JW may have learned of it.

JW could have gone to court to establish paternity and requested a DNA test and to receive parenting time. Mothers don't have a choice if the father wants to be part of the child's life if the father goes to court.

But the Wagners wanted full custody and didn't want any of the Rhodens to be part of Sophia's life. That's beyond extreme. I can't even begin to fathom what that little girl has gone thru the past two years. JMO

 

[Willow Knight]

I sure am curious what those documents could be about and if an attorney helped create them. JMO

I'm wondering if the forged documents are what JW used to get little S out of the house the night of the murders. Correct me if I'm wrong, this was not JW's scheduled visitation night? And Dana had an upsetting phone call that night at her job.

 

[MyBelle]

I'm wondering if the forged documents are what JW used to get little S out of the house the night of the murders. Correct me if I'm wrong, this was not JW's scheduled visitation night? And Dana had an upsetting phone call that night at her job.

I wasn't aware JW had a scheduled visitation night but he certainly may have forged court documents to remove the child from her mother's home.

I wish we knew more about the other young child in the Wagners household and any court documents pertaining to that child. JMO

 

[Gracie55]

Try searching the child's name. You'll find links with a little info.

I wasn't aware JW had a scheduled visitation night but he certainly may have forged court documents to remove the child from her mother's home.

I wish we knew more about the other young child in the Wagners household and any court documents pertaining to that child. JMO

's

 

[Owutatangledweb]

**Photo of GWiii Billy Wagner in court as he waived extradition to Polk County Ohio.
Interesting tattoos. Are the 3 triangles a W? idk
Dr. Hillary Lake, WCPO on Twitter **** Quoted from alwaysonmymind




Especially the comment on Nov 14th by KA

Lol. My thought exactly.

 

[OsoTejano]

I’m still trying wrapping my head around all 4 of the Wagner’s being part of the plan and execution of the murders. I had a theory of JW doing it maybe with one or more others possibly GW4 but the whole bunch of them up to their necks in this plan? That would be a seriously f*ed up family dynamic. A whole family of sociopaths... don’t see that very often. And then to get the grannies involved in the coverup...wow

This article about the Summer Inman murder a while back has some similarities in that a man and his parents murdered the man’s ex.

William Inman guilty of killing wife, putting her body in septic tank


The relationship between JW and HMR appears to be at the center of this case. Looks like JW was a controlling man who was probably still thought of HMR as his woman (as in property) even after she appeared to move on after breaking it off with him. At some point JW had to realize that getting back with HMR just wasn’t going to happen. Caught in the middle of this was SW, who JW appears to have tried getting HMR to sign custody over to him. Having sole custody would allow him to control influences in SW’s life. It would allow him to control HMR’s and the Rhodens’ access to SW. This custody arrangement would have given JW a means to control HMR again.

There is a good possibility that JW blamed many of the Rhodens for the demise of his relationship with HMR and had a great deal of animosity towards them. GR was probably collateral damage.

All of that said, how that situation escalated into a sophisticated murder conspiracy and the murders of 8 people is not something that I can recall ever hearing about before. It’s like something out of a 19th century blood feud or something that happens in tribal societies.

Even though the 4 Wagners all have the same charges, there may have been only 1 or 2 of them that actually pulled a trigger. As long as all participated in the planning and execution of the murders they could be found guilty.

 

[altojack]

Before I start let me apologise for any typos, it's coming up to 2am in the UK, my vision is blurring due to eyes trying to close.

I'm shocked and sickened over the Rs murders. I'm sure the Wags have done it before but not 8 at the same time. I'd like to think that LE are looking into any unsolved murders both prior to and afterwards. We don't know but they could have removed someone else since their big kill.

You've got to be a nasty piece of work to go to these extremes, and it doesn't just happen. No, they've been nasty pieces of work all their lives no doubt.

I cried for Len Manley and his family. Poor Len, he looked so broken 2.5 years ago, he had lost so much and not only that James and Bobbie were dragged along into the mess.

Oh those babies, how could a grandma do that, plan to get rid of an entire family just to have control over that sweet little girl who has her mummys looks. It just breaks my heart to know that there is such wickedness, evilness can be in one family. No wonder some of the locals are hesitant to speak on camera or give their name to comments they made to a reporter.

And for now Super Sleuthers I'm outta here, my bed is calling me. Chat away whilst I sleep, but keep the noise down please, lol. Good night.

 

[rsd1200]

BBM

That is starting to become my thoughts too. I realize these people ran a farm which requires the killing of animals from time to time and also avid hunters with all that entails but killing a human is much different than killing an animal. For one thing when you kill an animal the animal usually doesn't know what is coming. An animal is not able to plead for their life either. Plus there is just something sickening about the sight and smell of vast amounts of blood.

For some reason I don't think this was their first rodeo.

I hope BCI and PCSO is looking into other unsolved murders and the W's connections, if any, to them.

JMO

The smell of blood is very distinct. Especially a lot of it. But in hunting, they had to be used to that odor. They probably wore some sort of balaclava hood that covered their nose (and most of the facial area) which may have helped w/keeping out the blood smell, during the massacre.

This was a mission, to wipe out CR1s branch of the R family tree. KR & GR, were part of their plan to throw off LE, I believe.

I can't get over a clan this tight. Taking it from anger, to hate, to fantasy, to first voicing the idea, to obtaining the items & making a plan, and all the way up to murdering, eight people, up close and personal, who you know, one who practically lived with your family, and is the mother of your child, another only 16, and two, sleeping with their six month old, and a toddler in the next room. This is the most deranged thing I've ever seen, with respect to wanting control of a child, and I think it was just that, control. They didn't have it, money couldn't buy it, and threats didn't work, so, they decided to just eliminate what stood in their way.

 

[JusMeJim]

I wonder if it was a drug withdrawal that caused the delay. Maybe he had to be medically supervised and/or went berserk during detox?From the photo in that article (as someone mentioned upthread), Jake is a meth addict. The symptom is scabs on the face.
Jake might not have been in any condition for a court appearance. He also might be in a locked facility that offers appropriate treatment for detoxing, which may not be available in Pike County Jail.
He might be doped up, either because of a detoxing process or because he'd become out of control and has had to be straight-jacketed and sedated.
I dunno if jails detox incoming inmates, but I'm guessing they do.
Could a court do the arraignment from a detox facility, though?

I wonder what else Jake is on? Or was on at the time of arrest?

Actually it was just a matter of the county that he was being held in had put him on the docket to be arraigned, when in fact he was not there prisoner to arraign. They were simply holding him for Pike Co.

 

[LadyL]

The smell of blood is very distinct. Especially a lot of it. But in hunting, they had to be used to that odor. They probably wore some sort of balaclava hood that covered their nose (and most of the facial area) which may have helped w/keeping out the blood smell, during the massacre.

This was a mission, to wipe out CR1s branch of the R family tree. KR & GR, were part of their plan to throw off LE, I believe.

I can't get over a clan this tight. Taking it from anger, to hate, to fantasy, to first voicing the idea, to obtaining the items & making a plan, and all the way up to murdering, eight people, up close and personal, who you know, one who practically lived with your family, and is the mother of your child, another only 16, and two, sleeping with their six month old, and a toddler in the next room. This is the most deranged thing I've ever seen, with respect to wanting control of a child, and I think it was just that, control. They didn't have it, money couldn't buy it, and threats didn't work, so, they decided to just eliminate what stood in their way.

[bbm]

speaking of balaclavas, does everyone think they masked their identities or didn't because they wanted their victims to know who was murdering them?

 

[CIA Team Member]

The smell of blood is very distinct. Especially a lot of it. But in hunting, they had to be used to that odor. They probably wore some sort of balaclava hood that covered their nose (and most of the facial area) which may have helped w/keeping out the blood smell, during the massacre.

This was a mission, to wipe out CR1s branch of the R family tree. KR & GR, were part of their plan to throw off LE, I believe.

I can't get over a clan this tight. Taking it from anger, to hate, to fantasy, to first voicing the idea, to obtaining the items & making a plan, and all the way up to murdering, eight people, up close and personal, who you know, one who practically lived with your family, and is the mother of your child, another only 16, and two, sleeping with their six month old, and a toddler in the next room. This is the most deranged thing I've ever seen, with respect to wanting control of a child, and I think it was just that, control. They didn't have it, money couldn't buy it, and threats didn't work, so, they decided to just eliminate what stood in their way.

Remembering, KR's ex said they probably killed him because KR would've killed whomever did this. GR just happened to be living there at the time.

 

[MyBelle]

Try searching the child's name. You'll find links with a little info.

's

I don't know the child's name.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

JMO
I may be wrong but from what I read yesterday im guessing it was just because there was some sort of phone call record that happened shortly before the murders. It may have been just a bad coincidence for him that a phone call was made or received.

Make was checking to with James Manley by text to make sure that him and all his family was home, Make played James.

 

[rsd1200]

[bbm]

speaking of balaclavas, does everyone think they masked their identities or didn't because they wanted their victims to know who was murdering them?

Masked, and likely in some sort of coveralls, and per the indictments "special shoes". However, I think that they may have revealed themselves to at least DR and I think CR1 knew who he was dealing with that night.

I wonder if the 10:30 timeline that JW first gave, was close to the time that CR1 was killed, and pulled to the back, out of view? A believable cover, just in case someone spotted their vehicle cruising through the area (like CRob) around that time. Then they later realized that this story put him right at the scene that night, so, they tell the reporter that the paper misprinted his story.

 

[IceIce9]

I don't know the child's name.

This article has a photo of the Ws including both children, and mentions the child. Scroll down and see the family photo.

Pike County: Father accused in Rhoden massacre faced prior felonies

 

[Dudly]

[bbm]

speaking of balaclavas, does everyone think they masked their identities or didn't because they wanted their victims to know who was murdering them?

I think the shots in the face was them making sure the victims saw who was shooting them. My opinion only...

 

[rsd1200]

I'm wondering if the forged documents are what JW used to get little S out of the house the night of the murders. Correct me if I'm wrong, this was not JW's scheduled visitation night? And Dana had an upsetting phone call that night at her job.

HMR would have probably called her Dad, and 911, if he tried to take her without her consent. She'd have known that they hadn't had a hearing in family court. They had nothing to hide at DR's home (which I think, is why CR1 got it for them). There were no weed grows there. He'd probably been so sweet to her, since they started laying out their plans, that sugar wouldn't have melted in his mouth. I hope he breaks and rolls on the rest.

 

[RickshawFan]

Actually it was just a matter of the county that he was being held in had put him on the docket to be arraigned, when in fact he was not there prisoner to arraign. They were simply holding him for Pike Co.

The rest of my questions in the post, I think, would also be worth some input. E.g. does anyone know if an arrestee gets detoxed when they are put in jail? As in, medically supervised? Or are they just tossed in with general population and expected to go through withdrawal with no supervision? Crazy and dangerous, if so.