OH - Three students killed in Chardon High School shooting, 27 Feb 2012

[Stoshie]

No way this was random and that will come out.

Anyone seeing anything about the 911 calls that the police chief talked about? The local PD only got 4 calls and those are the ones they are releasing. The bulk of the 911 calls went to the Sheriff's office and the sheriff didn't mention anything about them.

Also, the other boy. We all thought he was shot in the leg but in court it said he was shot in the neck. That's the one that the teacher ran out and got and dragged back into a classroom. He's the only one still in the hospital now.

I'm really glad to see this community pulling together and getting through this. My prayers are with them all.

I have heard some local "through the grapevine" info about Nick being shot multiple times. It was also mentioned in this article.

http://www.cleveland.com/chardon-shooting/index.ssf/2012/02/post.html


I have also heard some other disturbing stuff, but it is just hearsay. Been a lot of stuff mentioned by callers on local radio. Mostly kids that attend the school.

 

[gxm]

I have heard some local "through the grapevine" info about Nick being shot multiple times. It was also mentioned in this article.

http://www.cleveland.com/chardon-shooting/index.ssf/2012/02/post.html


I have also heard some other disturbing stuff, but it is just hearsay. Been a lot of stuff mentioned by callers on local radio. Mostly kids that attend the school.

Thank you, Stoshie! It sounds like Nick is doing well. That's wonderful news.

 

[gitana1]

He had reason to be there. He was catching the bus to the school he DOES attend. That won't support pre med.

He had no reason to he in the school itself, especially in the cafeteria. He did not attend that school. He had no reason to bring guns and knives to school, either, unless he planned to use them.

Here's what you need in Ohio for 1st and second degree murder, as well as manslaughter:

Ohio Murder / Manslaughter Law

Murder
In Ohio, first-degree murder is the killing of an individual without lawful justification, where the person who performs the act causing death either intends to kill or do great bodily harm to the individual or knows that his act creates a strong probability of death or great bodily harm. The elements of murder are the knowing, intentional, and unlawful taking of another life.


Second-degree murder is similar to first-degree murder, except that the defendant can prove that he was under sudden and intense passion resulting from a serious provocation from the person killed.

Voluntary Manslaughter
A person who unintentionally kills an individual, without lawful justification, commits involuntary manslaughter if he recklessly performs an action which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm. However, if the reckless action that causes death involves a vehicle, then the crime is reckless homicide.

http://www.ohio-criminaldefense.com/practice-areas/murder-manslaughter.htm

Here's another site that explains where premeditation comes in:

Ohio murder, manslaughter and vehicular manslaughter

The following are types of Ohio homicides:

• Murder. Murder is the legal taking of another person’s life without legal justification or provocation. Depending on the degree of murder charged, a conviction can result in long prison sentences and even the death penalty. Ohio murder laws provide for different degrees of murder for which you can be charged.
  • First degree murder. First degree alleges the defendant committed the crime in a premeditated and intentional manner.
  • Second degree murder. Second degree is also intentional but not premeditated. Often second degree murder occurs in the heat of the moment.
  • Third degree murder. Third degree alleges the intention to harm but not to kill.

http://www.thomaskoustmer.com/aop/homicide.aspx

Premeditation can happen quickly. It can be moments before an attack.

The fact is, this kid brought weapons to school that day and then instead of going to his own school or going home, he entered the other school, entered the cafeteria, and used the weapons he brought with him, to shoot people, calmly, in the back of the head. That's an almost text-book example of premeditation.

Lack of premeditation would be, for example, coming home to find the babysitter in the act of abusing your kid, grabbing her and choking the life out of her at that moment.

This case just does not fit second degree.

 

[Nore]

At least he won't be making the rounds on HLN tonight. Is gpa the mom or dad's dad I wonder

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Strawberry the grandparents are the mothers parents. Heard on channel 3.:seeya:

 

[AngelWings444]

Where is the Auburn Career Center? Do they meet in the cafeteria to go to the alternative school and the career center?

Confused...

 

[nursebeeme]

gitana, I think the kids waited in the cafeteria to board buses that would either take them to the career center (where some of those shot were headed) or to lake academy (where TJ was headed)


I am so glad there were cameras in there!

 

[Nore]

I don't believe he will make his career off of this one.There is no DP in Ohio,so what is the deal? He shot and killed three young boys who had a promising future.

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Ohio certainly does have the death penalty. Sowell is condemned to death, we just put one down in January..One shot deal. If he is tried as an adult they said he would be eligible. I heard that on the news earlier.

 

[Inspector Gidget]

Here we go I am sure they will play on the father's domestic abuse.
Court records detail the attack. Lane's father first held his wife's head under running water, then bashed it into the wall, hard enough to leave a dent in the drywall.

Soon after he went to prison, however, his wife wrote asking that he be released early.

"She had divorced Thomas Lane, but said in the letter that he was always a good father to their twin daughters and a son she had before they married," The Plain Dealer reports

http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/306217/20120228/tj-lane-ohio-school-shooting-chardon-domestic.htm

 

[~n/t~]

Watched the PC and I see some of you are also skeptical about the random part. Why do you think the prosecution would say it was random? The police chief would not comment on what Lane told him. It sounded like he felt it wasn't random.

There is some conflict there....wondering what it could mean legally and for this case.

 

[AnaTeresa]

IIRC, a SCOTUS decision removes DP option from all cases involving a defendant under 18 at the time of the crime. Yes?

IMO, with three HS students murdered execution style, TJ will probably get a life sentence. But after the Anthony fiasco, I no longer have much confidence in the outcomes of seemingly clear cut cases.

Things generally run as expected here in Ohio as far as sentencing goes in most cases. When it comes to murder and more serious crimes, even if there is a plea, it's going to be a steep sentence. And with this sort of case, with national attention, a plea may not even happen. For small cases with only local media attention, if the media's too hot, the prosecutors often will not bend much here in central Ohio - and that's for smaller things like DUIs and bar fights. When you get into the bigger cases, the prosecutors tend to play hardball, even when negotiating a plea.

Given that there's no question he committed this, I'm guessing there will be an eventual plea, unless there are some strong mitigating factors which could sway the jury down to a more lenient sentence (significant years vs. life sentence). Juries are unpredictable - in cases like this, it's better to try and make a deal, since you know what you're getting. With a jury, it's a crapshoot. With a black and white case like this, unless you have strong mitigating factors, you take the deal. The attorneys I work with call cases like this a cadaver, since it's basically dead on arrival.

 

[Bravo]

I'm sure the Defense will spotlight Family dysfunction. I know i cant dismiss it and anything else violent in Lane's life. We cant ignore it and need to keep digging if there are ever any answers to be found. The more common denominators with these kids perhaps one day it will save lives. We can hope.

 

[AngelWings444]

Watched the PC and I see some of you are also skeptical about the random part. Why do you think the prosecution would say it was random? The police chief would not comment on what Lane told him. It sounded like he felt it wasn't random.

There is some conflict there....wondering what it could mean legally and for this case.

Maybe he meant "some" of the bullets were random, he did shoot "randomly" in the hallway and at the coach? He did say the boy is ill, but I think he is SICK, not in the insanity way! JMO

BTW, the coach that chased him out of the cafeteria, and the teacher who pulled a student to safety = HEROES!! God Bless them!

 

[mywarmbluefleece]

Where is the Auburn Career Center? Do they meet in the cafeteria to go to the alternative school and the career center?

Confused...

Auburn Career Center is nearby. It's a program where kids from a bunch of different districts go to learn trades. The high schools in a lot of Ohio are pretty small so it's hard to have specialized programs. The Career center has a lot and has kids from many different districts.

I was from a district nearby and the kids waited in the gym for the busses to career centers and other programs, so I assume that was the case here and that is why he was in the cafeteria.

 

[Nore]

Or just a District Justice. At least that's what they call them here in PA

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It is Juvenile Court. If they go for insanity they will have a rough time. Ohio is one of the hardest States to prove insanity. :seeya:

 

[~n/t~]

Maybe he meant "some" of the bullets were random, he did shoot "randomly" in the hallway and at the coach? He did say the boy is ill, but I think he is SICK, not in the insanity way! JMO

BTW, the coach that chased him out of the cafeteria, and the teacher who pulled a student to safety = HEROES!! God Bless them!

No that wasn't how he answered the question. I don't recall the exact words but he said it was random and Lane didn't know his victims which I find hard to believe.

 

[Nore]

I'm seeing tweets right now that the 3rd victim has died (which we already knew) and the gun was purchased legally? Looking for links (not very good in twitter).

Has anyone heard that the gun was purchased legally? And by who?

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I heard tail end ~ gun was stolen from an Uncle. I dont know if it was legal, they didnt say.

 

[AnaTeresa]

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It is Juvenile Court. If they go for insanity they will have a rough time. Ohio is one of the hardest States to prove insanity. :seeya:

Yeah, I would be really surprised if they tried it. The attorneys I work for seem to that that's basically a non-starter.

 

[i.b.nora]

The prosecutor was in the hearing outlining the circumstances of the arrest of Lane, and said that Lane had told the police that the shooting was random, he did not target anyone, and that he did not know the people.

By the time of the press conference, there had been a gag order imposed, so the prosecutor was still able to say just a little bit because the press conference had already been scheduled, but he could only say a little and none of the others were allowed to say anything. The police, for example, could not confirm any of Lane's statements.

 

[Nore]

no pictures of TJ's face

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No pictures of familys faces either. I dont know if that was just in Court.
Defense requested this for family.:seeya:

 

[AngelWings444]

No that wasn't how he answered the question. I don't recall the exact words but he said it was random and Lane didn't know his victims which I find hard to believe.

Maybe we will get a transcript later. I would like to hear it. I don't believe it was random either. The town only had 5000 people in it. Can't be that many high school kids, even if they were busing kids from one location to multiple places. They were friends on his Facebook too. He knew them.

JMO