OK OK - Jamison Family: Truck, IDs and Dog Found Abandoned 08 Oct 2009 - #12
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mysticrose
The key to change... is to let go of fear
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I need to go back and get a refresher again. Wasn't the bodies found about 3 miles from the truck as the crow flies? I think they were killed where they lay, walked up the trail and killed there. I'm tossing the truck around, if they drove it there or if it was put there because it is so odd how it was left, how it was parked.
SchoolgirlShamus
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A month?? No...just days.
Like... three, maybe. Depending on temperature and humidity they could be skeletonized, or nearly so, well before a month was over. It's fast. So much faster than many people realize.TV drives me crazy with its totally inaccurate portrayal of the decomposition rate of unburied bodies. Even the better "true crime" shows depict a woman who has supposedly been lying in the woods for a month looking as if she'd been lying there maybe 24 hours. They also always show bones as clean and white. I guess they don't want to get too gruesome but I think it misinforms people.
Decomposition for unburied bodies is fast, fast, fast, unless they are frozen or dessicated. I can't emphasize this enough.The Jamisons' vehicle was found 8 days after they apparently went missing... when was the first large-scale search done, again...?
wfgodot
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The first search was basically between 18 Oct and 24 Oct (when suspended for black powder hunting season). Sheriff IB issued a news release on 30 Oct scaling back all ground searches. Then about 12 Dec cadaver dogs were on the mountain, not sure how long this search lasted.
TDoc72
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I had a big post (#868 in this thread) about my theory in the case. But this morning, I found myself thinking about the Jamisons and can't believe I never thought about the possibility of them being killed by a stranger/s where the remains were found and the killer/s moving their truck to where it was later found. Not sure how the killer would know where they were looking for land & put the truck in the right spot though, unless the Jamisons had been talking to someone up there.
Either way, I definitely still think they met with foul play & were killed by a stranger/s.
Either way, I definitely still think they met with foul play & were killed by a stranger/s.
A month?? No...just days.
TV drives me crazy with its totally inaccurate portrayal of the decomposition rate of unburied bodies. Even the better "true crime" shows depict a woman who has supposedly been lying in the woods for a month looking as if she'd been lying there maybe 24 hours. They also always show bones as clean and white. I guess they don't want to get too gruesome but I think it misinforms people.
The Jamisons' vehicle was found 8 days after they apparently went missing... when was the first large-scale search done, again...?
SchoolgirlShamus is correct in my opinion. Sometimes dead things just don't draw attention or last very long. Mother nature can clean things up very fast.
This unlucky deer got tangled in the wire when it jumped over the gate. I'm not positive how long it hung there before I noticed it, but it was less than 2 days and possibly even less than 24 hours. The skeleton was very intact except the skull and front legs had been torn off, the remaining meat was still pink, and there was little odor.
This occurred about 100 yards from my front door and about 10 yards from a road. The top rail of the gate is about 66 from the ground and the deer probably weighed less than 100lbs. I didn't notice it until I was walking along the fence row and caught a glimpse of a rib cage in my peripheral vision about 2' away. The odor of decomposition played no role in my discovery of the skeleton. I let down the skeleton and in less than a week there was nothing visible above the grass except the skull.
I'm not saying that a person would disappear so quickly because deer are part of the natural diet of the animals that live in the woods whereas people are not, and most wild animals have a natural fear of people. But if this deer had been laying in the grass on the other side of the gate rather than hanging in plain sight, it is very possible that I never would have noticed it even though I would have passed within 15 yards of it on a daily basis. Decomposition had little to do with the disappearance of this deer and therefore the odor of decomposition was not what one would expect from a 100 lb animal.
Although this is not in the area where the Jamisons disappeared I'm guessing that the wildlife in that area is similar to the wildlife in the area of this unlucky deer.
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SchoolgirlShamus
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I've read that when left outdoors in hot weather with high humidity, and depending on the particular type of animal and insect activity in the area, bodies can become skeletonized in less than a week. I had no idea until I looked it up in regards to another case (in which folks were wondering why no one noticed a smell, and I began wondering how long the smell might last). The knowledge was surprising to me. I thought the process was much slower, given the unreliable tutors of movies and TV.
Obviously, given the time of year and temperatures, it would have been somewhat slower for the Jamisons than hot/humid temperatures, but I have no idea how much slower. Maybe not a lot. Rain may have expedited it, again depending on temps.
Exposure in a hot/warm moist environment is the fastest situation for decomposition; disposal in water slows down the process; burial slows it down even more; burial in a tarp even more than that; etc.
Poor deer.
I'm glad you honored its death with your compassion, even if it wasn't aware of it. It's one of the good things about being human.
OkieGranny
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Yeah, me too, but we've already worked over every known detail ad nauseam and are desperately in need of fresh info. If only we could send a mole into the Latimer County SO to sneak us a copy of the case file...
Is this the Panola Mountain PC? May she rest in peace.
http://www.mcalesternews.com/obituaries/x1280771679/Margaret-Peggy-Ann-Cook
Dallen
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Only 61. Young.
Is this the woman who took people around the area if they were interested but the Jamisons only wanted GPS coordinates but talked to her for over an hour and a half on the phone? Or am I combining 2 different people?
I'm a latecomer to this forum, and I don't know much about any of the people who were interviewed by LE during the investigation.
According to this old article from back in Nov, it looks like LE may not even be working on this case at this time.
http://newsok.com/jamison-family-wa...anishing-records-show/article/3909260/?page=2
I wonder what theories Sheriff James is considering in this case if no foul play is suspected? I wish he was more vocal.
http://newsok.com/jamison-family-wa...anishing-records-show/article/3909260/?page=2
Tulessa
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How big was the hole in the skull? If someone was shot in the eye with a hollow point bullet , and it exited the skull, it would leave a huge hole. Just thinking to myself here....
Also, my brother was murdered with a 30.6, a shot to the head. They couldn't repair him enough to have an open casket funeral.
Also, my brother was murdered with a 30.6, a shot to the head. They couldn't repair him enough to have an open casket funeral.
Anybody consider that someone on the sheriff's department at the time might have been involved? The way that they had left the truck and their phones sounds like they taking orders from someone they believed to be a law enforcement authority. They may have thought there was some misunderstanding of some kind and they would be returning to their truck shortly when things were "cleared up" and off in the nice deputies (or game warden) truck they went.
Those who have read my post on TOPIX know about my experience with the sheriff's department. I was looking at 40 acres in the southern part of the county when a couple of locals blocked my exit and accused me of trespassing. I was on the access to the property. When I was explaining to them why I was there and what I was told by the real estate lady they started to become enraged. I finally gave up and drove around them to get out and the driver threw his vehicle in reverse and tried to ram me. I relayed this to the real estate person and she said she would take care of it. After a couple of days of not hearing from her I emailed Sheriff James and relayed to him what happened. No response. This was the second weekend in February 2013.
A month later I returned to Oklahoma to look at some more land and while I was there I contacted the real estate person (she had never got back with me). She told me that the property was actually under contract a month before she sent me to look at it.(??????). Then she told me that another property owner had bought all the land around the parcel I wanted and had blocked access to it and was forcing the owner to sell at a lower price. I assume these was the guys who blocked me and attempted to ram me. When I returned home I sent another email to Sheriff James updating him. After the first visit I had researched law regarding right of ways, and property access. I knew that easements do not terminate when the property that it crosses is sold unless it is agreed to jointly and changed at the courthouse. The whole story sounded like BS. I still received no response from Sheriff James. This is the first week in March 2013.
Another month passed. It is around the middle of April and by this time I had started to find out about the Jamisons. I tracked down and called the actual land owner to find out if the story the real estate agent told me was true, and to my surprise she confirmed it. WOW! I sent one last email to Sheriff James and told him that the land owner had verified the real estate agent's story. I also told him that that would be the last email he would receive from me, but please remember my contact information in case the people blocking the road killed someone, or someone killed one or both of them so that the family of the person murdered or the person who had killed in self defense needed information for the lawyers. Sheriff James responded with one line: "I will investigate this".... That was April 2013....still waiting for someone to tell me what they found out.
The property that I wanted and had money in hand for and would have paid the asking price, stayed listed for a couple of months with no indication of being under contract then disappeared. Then reappeared again with no changes in description around September. After looking at land for the past 5 years I thought that I had found the perfect place to build my observatory when I retire. My hobby is astronomy and I have been taking some college classes to maybe get a teaching certificate when I retire. My goal throughout my working career was to return to SE Oklahoma. I am afraid that I am now looking other places to spend the second half of my life.
When I look at the similarities I thought LE enforcement would have more interest in my incident, but I guess not. The Jamesons were looking at forty acres of land in Latimer. Same as me. Indications are they were blocked on their exit. Same as me. I was able to get around the people blocking me, they apparently could not. After considering the number of people who seem to disappear in SE Oklahoma (still have not heard anything new about Heather Patrick) and seemingly apathy on the part of LE, I decided despite my love of OK from having lived there 30 years ago, there was no way I was going to move back there.
A month later I returned to Oklahoma to look at some more land and while I was there I contacted the real estate person (she had never got back with me). She told me that the property was actually under contract a month before she sent me to look at it.(??????). Then she told me that another property owner had bought all the land around the parcel I wanted and had blocked access to it and was forcing the owner to sell at a lower price. I assume these was the guys who blocked me and attempted to ram me. When I returned home I sent another email to Sheriff James updating him. After the first visit I had researched law regarding right of ways, and property access. I knew that easements do not terminate when the property that it crosses is sold unless it is agreed to jointly and changed at the courthouse. The whole story sounded like BS. I still received no response from Sheriff James. This is the first week in March 2013.
Another month passed. It is around the middle of April and by this time I had started to find out about the Jamisons. I tracked down and called the actual land owner to find out if the story the real estate agent told me was true, and to my surprise she confirmed it. WOW! I sent one last email to Sheriff James and told him that the land owner had verified the real estate agent's story. I also told him that that would be the last email he would receive from me, but please remember my contact information in case the people blocking the road killed someone, or someone killed one or both of them so that the family of the person murdered or the person who had killed in self defense needed information for the lawyers. Sheriff James responded with one line: "I will investigate this".... That was April 2013....still waiting for someone to tell me what they found out.
The property that I wanted and had money in hand for and would have paid the asking price, stayed listed for a couple of months with no indication of being under contract then disappeared. Then reappeared again with no changes in description around September. After looking at land for the past 5 years I thought that I had found the perfect place to build my observatory when I retire. My hobby is astronomy and I have been taking some college classes to maybe get a teaching certificate when I retire. My goal throughout my working career was to return to SE Oklahoma. I am afraid that I am now looking other places to spend the second half of my life.
When I look at the similarities I thought LE enforcement would have more interest in my incident, but I guess not. The Jamesons were looking at forty acres of land in Latimer. Same as me. Indications are they were blocked on their exit. Same as me. I was able to get around the people blocking me, they apparently could not. After considering the number of people who seem to disappear in SE Oklahoma (still have not heard anything new about Heather Patrick) and seemingly apathy on the part of LE, I decided despite my love of OK from having lived there 30 years ago, there was no way I was going to move back there.
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