OK OK - Jamison Family: Truck, IDs and Dog Found Abandoned 08 Oct 2009 - #12

[Dallen]

That they auto filled in that line so they can write in whatever later. I guess it saves like , no time because they have to write it up below anyway and waste some printer ink on every report it doesn't need to be on. IMO.

Yeah, I jumped the gun and posted before I went back and searched for that part to read. Sorry.

 

[Soulmagent]

Seems if they were really lost in the woods ,and walked in there and then sat down and died ,that search dogs would have tracked them . Or if they really walked in there and shot themselves the dogs would have tracked them.

 

[TooCurious]

In one of NS's recent replies on the FTJ website she said they found 1 little pink shoe.
The report to me seems to be missing in "officiality", however the coordinates the ME confirmed for NS seemed to be way to close to the road for 3 people to have never been noticed. No matter what that area didn't seem like it was all that difficult to access from the one side.

Glad you brought that up. I may have misread that post but I thought the little pink shoe was found at the truck area and they weren't sure if it was Madyson's and asked NS if it was hers.

 

[Mitch1]

Glad you brought that up. I may have misread that post but I thought the little pink shoe was found at the truck area and they weren't sure if it was Madyson's and asked NS if it was hers.

The post (reply) was just yesterday and she was responding to someone who asked if they found any clothing and NS said they found 1 pink shoe.
I took it as what was found with the remains-It was just yesterday so maybe we are talking about 2 different posts though. Also in the video her shoes didn't look pink at all, but, seeing that they had so much stuff in the truck, maybe she changed into them

 

[Dallen]

After looking at the topography map from OkieGranny, it sure seems less likely that the family surrendered after getting lost because the remains were on a flat area in close proximity to roads. Given this, it also seems more easily accessible by a perp, either to dump bodies or take them there to kill them. IMO.

 

[TooCurious]

:truce:

The post (reply) was just yesterday and she was responding to someone who asked if they found any clothing and NS said they found 1 pink shoe.
I took it as what was found with the remains-It was just yesterday so maybe we are talking about 2 different posts though. Also in the video her shoes didn't look pink at all, but, seeing that they had so much stuff in the truck, maybe she changed into them

I am sure I read that post way before yesterday as I haven't been to that site in several days. I remember I found it odd that it was never brought up over here. I think they found one near the truck but didn't know if it was hers or not. Then again I may have dreamed it.

 

[Mitch1]

After looking at the topography map from OkieGranny, it sure seems less likely that the family surrendered after getting lost because the remains were on a flat area in close proximity to roads. Given this, it also seems more easily accessible by a perp, either to dump bodies or take them there to kill them. IMO.

Tell me about it, and how did a search team w/dogs miss them. The whole murder thing- it seems like there would be some sign of foul play on at least 1 of the remains. Why did LE constantly say how difficult it was to access, were they trying to keep people away from the scene. Also it seems to me if you didn't have all the teeth and bones you would spend at least 4-5 days (its an entire family) sifting dirt looking for them-they were done collecting the day after they were found-at least thats what the news reports said.

 

[TooCurious]

http://m.newsok.com/mother-believes...klahoma-familys-disappearance/article/3906475

I was wrong, the paragraph under the mention of the shoe talked about the truck.

 

[Pensfan]

Seems if they were really lost in the woods ,and walked in there and then sat down and died ,that search dogs would have tracked them . Or if they really walked in there and shot themselves the dogs would have tracked them.

It rained heavily between the time they went to this spot and when the searchers arrived. The wind never stop blowing in Oklahoma and this makes it very difficult for search dogs.

 

[OkieGranny]

That report told me it was a wooded field . enclosed even. ,I also don't know who is signed the report as it doesn't look like any of the names on the list and it wasn't signed for 11 days and the report was not voted to be shared with the OSBI?

I didn't see any place close enough to those cords to fit the description in the report. Anyone else?

I believe the second signature is that of the sheriff, Jesse James. Can't tell who the first one belongs to. I'm not having any problem with the description. It looks like a wooded field to me. I'll check again on Google Earth and see if I can find any fence around it.

In one of NS's recent replies on the FTJ website she said they found 1 little pink shoe.
The report to me seems to be missing in "officiality", however the coordinates the ME confirmed for NS seemed to be way to close to the road for 3 people to have never been noticed. No matter what that area didn't seem like it was all that difficult to access from the one side.

Looking at the topography, there may be a little bit of a downward slope from south to north right there. I'm not sure it's a steep enough grade for gravity to cause some of the lighter bones to migrate downhill over the years, but heavy rains might wash some of them down, or animal activity might scatter bones to some degree. It does sound like only partial remains were recovered, and I'd guess that the primary resting spot of the remains was at LCSO's coordinates, with more bones recovered along the area between there and the ME's coordinates.

 

[TooCurious]

By the time the search took place the bodies should have been decomposing (assuming they died on the day of or day after the 8th). The smell and buzzards should have alerted searchers, not to mention the dogs. Searchers should have traveled that road, probably multiple times.

 

[Pensfan]

By the time the search took place the bodies should have been decomposing (assuming they died on the day of or day after the 8th). The smell and buzzards should have alerted searchers, not to mention the dogs. Searchers should have traveled that road, probably multiple times.

The Eufaula, OK daytime weather in late November wasn't warmer than your refrigerator and near 32 degrees at night. There bodies weren't decomposing enough to attract buzzards since they were being "frozen" every night.

 

[Pensfan]

Is there any other case like this in the general area with the same MO?

No. Most families in Oklahoma recognize the danger of "crazy" (mentally illness) and wouldn't let their unstable loved ones fend for themselves especially when they have a young child.

Proud graduate of The Univ of Oklahoma College of Nursing!
verified psychiatric mental health nurse

 

[Pensfan]

As far as the over/under on when the remains will be ruled out or identified as the Jamisons, I'm going with 3 months and will reference the Charles Crowder case-his remains were sent to Texas for DNA analysis and 3 months later they had a match, also LE had suspected that the remains where Crowder's.

Since the remains found (at least the skulls) had no evident trauma, this leads me to think, if they were murdered: they were strangled, stabbed or had throats slashed. Its unlikely anyone is going to kidnap an entire family using a knife. So lets say a gun was used to get these 3 to the location they were to be murdered. (whether on foot or vehicle). This also suggest a scenario that requires 2 people and what motive would 2 people have to murder an entire family especially if they ran into each other by chance. If by chance what are the chances the murders had the means to murder a family without the primary weapon being a gun. That person(s) would've had to have brought a knife, a gun and a rope and the chances of 1 person carrying around all 3 is unlikely. Once that person(s) got them to the location they were murdered and didn't shoot the 1st one and instead strangled or used a knife to murder them (if only 1 purp) if the other 2 were not in some way bound up there would be an immediate attempt to fight or flight as well as some screaming. The chances of 1 murder being able to overcome all these obstacles seems unlikely.

LE describe's the area of the remains as difficult to access and obviously in close proximity-which says to me that (1) there where 2 purps, and to me, thats unlikely if it ends up being the Jamisons, NOT if its 3 other people involved with drugs-deal gone bad (2) these people are not related and murdered separately- probably strangled (like serial killer/rapist/kidnapper) and bodies dumped later, or (3) people who decided to take there drugs (maybe meth) into the woods, get high and died due to OD or even bad batch of drugs.

Where can I read a report stating that the skulls did not have trauma? tia

 

[Mitch1]

Where can I read a report stating that the skulls did not have trauma? tia

Recent post by NS on the FTJ website

 

[Pensfan]

Recent post by NS on the FTJ website

Thanks for sharing that info. I'm going to wait for the Medical Examiner's report.

 

[TooCurious]

The Eufaula, OK daytime weather in late November wasn't warmer than your refrigerator and near 32 degrees at night. There bodies weren't decomposing enough to attract buzzards since they were being "frozen" every night.

They went missing in early October, the temps the week of truck discovery (8 or 9 days after last time they were confirmed alive) were well above freezing.

http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KMLC/2009/10/15/WeeklyHistory.html

 

[Soulmagent]

Is there any other case like this in the general area with the same MO?

http://www.nytimes.com/1998/03/29/us/killings-illuminate-culture-of-white-supremacists.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm
There are more of these type cases ,more recent and closer.

I don't really know with what M.O you mean. I promise I can provide a link for just about any one you pick.

 

[Mitch1]

Thanks for sharing that info. I'm going to wait for the Medical Examiner's report.

No problem, glad I could help!

 

[TooCurious]

I just don't see how this could be murder/suicide. In that type of terrain it would take at least couple of hours to reach where they were found. It would be slow going and they would be getting hot and sweaty. So, are the murder/suicide supporters think she held a gun on them the whole way? From the time she made them get out of the truck until they got to the area? LE takes scenarios and by way of eliminating they state why it isn't this or that scenario. Anyone care to try this here?
Why ISN'T it
A) murder/suicide
B) exposure
C) murder (by as of yet unknown assailant(s))
D) WPP (for u Mitch)
E) drug OD

Here is mine
A) As stated above
B) I can't rule this out yet
C) I can't rule this out yet
D) 3 bodies, 1 pink shoe
E) No evidence they were using drugs, except prescription.

Anyone care to do this and see what logical scenarios we can come up with?