OK OK - Jamison Family: Truck, IDs and Dog Found Abandoned 08 Oct 2009 - #12

[Dallen]

It was the Eufaula Indian Journal. Not online, but zollie posted pics of the article.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ndoned-08-Oct-2009-12&p=10129636#post10129636

Where did we read that all 3 were face down? I don't remember, its been so long ago. But this makes it seem that the bones were scattered, no rhyme or reason (probably from animal activity), which would make much more sense for the area that they were discovered.

 

[OkieGranny]

Where did we read that all 3 were face down? I don't remember, its been so long ago. But this makes it seem that the bones were scattered, no rhyme or reason (probably from animal activity), which would make much more sense for the area that they were discovered.

It's in the article at that link. Start reading from the top of the third column on the first page, just to the left of Bobby's picture.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I still don't see where it said they were in a line, but he did say they were face down. His description of his wife leaving seems to indicate she found another set of remains down the hill.

...I called to Sherri and said I found a human skull she came up and sure enough it was a human skull, she took a step and found a femur bone I glanced to my right an found another one , Sherri says lets get the hell out of here, my wife took off down the first hill and found another one.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ndoned-08-Oct-2009-12&p=10129636#post10129636

BBM

 

[watcher9]

It is confusing the way this article was written.
The way I read it was that "all he could see was the back of their heads" which would put them near each other in his line of sight. As they were running back down the hill later, they kept spotting more femur or other bones.
It is possible that part of the info we gathered back then was from some of the other newspaper articles because I seem to remember more about the story than what was in this article.

 

[Ghostwheel]

I still don't see where it said they were in a line, but he did say they were face down. His description of his wife leaving seems to indicate she found another set of remains down the hill.

...I called to Sherri and said I found a human skull she came up and sure enough it was a human skull, she took a step and found a femur bone I glanced to my right an found another one , Sherri says lets get the hell out of here, my wife took off down the first hill and found another one.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ndoned-08-Oct-2009-12&p=10129636#post10129636

BBM

I got that two of the skulls were close together and one was partway down a hill. Whether or not all of them were actually face down, the one was, and to me that is unusual. Most skulls have teeth that protrude out in front, which makes it want to roll to the side, or if the jaw is missing, sit face up. Face down would not be the norm if just laying on the ground with animal activity. (not to be too graphic, but the back of the head is not what the animals want).

 

[Soulmagent]

As, to name just two, I don't think I've holla'd at these long-time Jamison-case savants in awhile, HAPPY NEW YEAR LITTLE AND SOUL!! (And to everyone here, too, all each of you.)

Happy New Year to you !!

Last year caught Morgan's killer ,this year is looking good for the Lyons sisters. Hopefully we will find out what happened on this mountain one day!

 

[Dallen]

It is confusing the way this article was written.
The way I read it was that "all he could see was the back of their heads" which would put them near each other in his line of sight. As they were running back down the hill later, they kept spotting more femur or other bones.
It is possible that part of the info we gathered back then was from some of the other newspaper articles because I seem to remember more about the story than what was in this article.

I agree. I remember a lot more detail, so we had to have read it somewhere.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I got that two of the skulls were close together and one was partway down a hill. Whether or not all of them were actually face down, the one was, and to me that is unusual. Most skulls have teeth that protrude out in front, which makes it want to roll to the side, or if the jaw is missing, sit face up. Face down would not be the norm if just laying on the ground with animal activity. (not to be too graphic, but the back of the head is not what the animals want).

There isn't only the animal activity to take into account. Weather, soil conditions, incline, and various other factors play into the position they would eventually fall.

There was definite animal activity according to the ME. How would you explain it if the skulls were facing down and in a line? They weren't buried and the remains were scattered throughout the area as expected except for the skulls?

 

[justthinkin]

However unlikely this may be, if not foul play or falling temperatures could the Jamison family have been attacked and killed by a mountain lion or possibly up to 3 mountain lions, a mama and one or two large cubs? Imight offer more on this depending on the answers I get.

 

[Dallen]

However unlikely this may be, if not foul play or falling temperatures could the Jamison family have been attacked and killed by a mountain lion or possibly up to 3 mountain lions, a mama and one or two large cubs? Imight offer more on this depending on the answers I get.

This thought has crossed my mind, but I would think if this were the case, the bones would have been scattered all over the mountain. But then again, we don't really know how many were found and in what vicinity. I think it's a possibility. Not farfetched at all, IMO.

 

[justthinkin]

At least now I know I'm not alone in that thought. Apologies if I missed you. If a cougar's not disturbed it will eat at will, usually drag it's kill into some brush cover it with leaf debris and some dirt until it comes back. Mountain lion kills are much rarer than attacks, yet I wonder... The cats have been seen in states where they haven't been seen in a long time. Their numbers are growing, and Oklahoma is surrounded by states with known populations.

 

[ZooSleuth]

A mountain lion is possible, but here are my reasons I don't think it was a mountain lion:

#1 - As you stated, mountain lion attacks are rare, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_cougar_attacks_in_North_America
#2 - It was a group of 3 people. I don't see any instance on that wiki article where 2 or more people were killed by a mountain lion at the same time.
#3 - A mountain lion attack doesn't explain what the family was doing so far away from their vehicle.
#4 - Not sure if mountain lions would leave evidence on the bones, but we never heard that was the case.

 

[justthinkin]

I don't know of one either, but a single lion attacked a pipeline crew in Canada and injured two workers. Not severe injuries at all
http://www.outdoorhub.com/news/2015...cks-canadian-pipeline-crew-fought-bare-fists/

The Jamisons did have several things going against them. Bobby while tall was slim; so was Sherilyn. He had back problems, though I don't know how bad it was; and they both seemed to have some mental issues. And little Maddy was only six. I'm not at all saying this is what happened to them. We may never know. I'm just saying I don't think they would've been able to defend each other if anything like that happened. I can't remember if we can post videos from YouTube. here, so I'll just post the title and anyone who wants to check it out can. Man has close encounter with mountain lions.I I'm certain this is a mother cougar and her two off-spring, about to be sent off to fend for themselves, but a little before the December to March mating period so she hasn't run them off just yet. I have seen 3 cougars in my life in this combination, though the cubs I saw were large, they weren't this large.

Jamison's could have gotten turned around and lost their way back to the truck.

You're correct beyond the mention of animal activity nothing else has been said about that.

 

[watcher9]

I don't think it was an animal that attacked the Jamisons.
I would be more inclined to believe a lightning strike to kill all three at once, if we are trying to exclude murder.

 

[wfgodot]

Humankind is the most dangerous game.

 

[salgtrn]

Exactly. There are certain things I would have expected to have been stated and were not.

Like why in the world would they at least not say specifically that they did not see any sign of bullet or knife wounds to the skull or other bones?

Was the skulls found ?

Were the skulls intact?

Was there a weapon found near bodies?

How complete or incomplete were the amount of bones uncovered?

Were all the bones separated from the body or were some of the skeletons fairly intact?

How far were the bones spread if they were separated?

I am so upset with that type of report. How incompetent can they be or is someone trying to suppress information. A simple layperson with no medical examining skills could have done a better job than that report.

Oh, and the disease statement is just ridiculous. Because of the child being found with them and the circumstances of their deaths. Its not like Ebola was going around at the time of their deaths. Its fine if they cant figure it out but at least tell people the answers to those obvious questions above and dont throw in some silly statement about disease that hit all 3 people at exactly the same time including a healthy young child.

Oh, and theres that little statement from the eye witness that found the remains that seemed to imply holes in skull(s). Not many animals would cause a nice clean hole in the skull when raviging the remains. I realize his statements were not very clear either as to what he saw but he did imply a hole in skull(s). I sure wish he would have took pictures of the remains and turned them over to a private investigator or the newspapers.

JMO, Im still of the opinion some foul play occurred. Money, vehicle placement, cash on hand, dog in vehicle, location of bodies. Possible hole in skull, rumor of another bag of cash that may have been taken, etc.
It could have been people in area not wanting the land purchased or some sort of drug involvement who knew they had cash. Im not outruling suicide/murder either would be my 2nd vote but then the weapon should have been found and ME should have been able to tell some of that from wounds to the skull/bodies and location of last victim.

Something is not right with the lack of info in this case. Even before they were found, there was just silence and so little info ever talked about them. I have never understood the lack of interest and lack of reporting about these 3.

I keep thinking how odd it is that there is nobody talking about this case in the family, people on the mountain, etc. openly. What about all of the people on the mountain in the area? If they really wanted to help why didn't we see them on camera talking to the press or anyone? What's the big hiding thing? Too much secretiveness. I can tell you that if my family, friends, community, etc. had something like this happen there would be some hell raising going on. How and why does the State of Oklahoma LE and ME offices get away with doing shoddy reports and investigations? I would still be outraged and screaming from the highest mountain to who ever would listen, and be hiring PI's, continue going to the press, bugging neighbors, acquaintances, the land people, the mountain people, the church people, drug connections, the criminally connected part of the family, etc. and basically raising hell, like I said earlier. I would want details!! Still wondering about the "fear factor" as part of the reason there is not much being talked about or done.

Btw, this is not intended to mean that no one has done this, just that I would still keep doing it until some answers came forth.. and continue to sleep with my gun. JMHO as always....

 

[Dallen]

Humankind is the most dangerous game.

I do agree. I don't think an animal attack is what took the Jamisons, but nothing is black and white in this case.

 

[Stella]

One thing that bothers me about the murder angle is why didn't the killer or killers go back to the Jamison's car, search it thoroughly (that money!) and then dispose of the vehicle? I would think a murderer would want to cover their tracks as much as possible. I wonder if they just got lost in the dark and got snake-bit by something venomous attracted by their body warmth.

 

[Dallen]

One thing that bothers me about the murder angle is why didn't the killer or killers go back to the Jamison's car, search it thoroughly (that money!) and then dispose of the vehicle? I would think a murderer would want to cover their tracks as much as possible. I wonder if they just got lost in the dark and got snake-bit by something venomous attracted by their body warmth.

IMO, it seems unlikely that a non-human predator would be able to take down all 3 victims together.
Also, robbing and disposing of the vehicle would probably have given more time for their disappearance to be discovered, but it would throw more red flags that this was intentional and indeed a homicide. If this was a murder, then they did themselves a favor by not doing anything with the vehicle. IMO, of course.
Both theories are definitely not something to be overlooked, though, as we have learned that every angle and theory of this case can be discussed and debated until you're back at square one.

 

[Soulmagent]

IMO, it seems unlikely that a non-human predator would be able to take down all 3 victims together.
Also, robbing and disposing of the vehicle would probably have given more time for their disappearance to be discovered, but it would throw more red flags that this was intentional and indeed a homicide. If this was a murder, then they did themselves a favor by not doing anything with the vehicle. IMO, of course.
Both theories are definitely not something to be overlooked, though, as we have learned that every angle and theory of this case can be discussed and debated until you're back at square one.

I hate the square one loop. I often blame the investigators for square ones.

I think the dog being left in the truck is contradictory to the whole walk in the woods . I am now just speculating on reasonable assumptions. I think.