Can you please tell me where one would go to look through those records? Every place I have looked do not have information that recent (archives.gov, fold3.om, ancestry, Marine Battalion website, etc.) I will gladly search anywhere at this point since the records we received were redacted.
OK OK - Stephen “Steve” Lee Murphy, last seen in Claremore sometime in 1976, not reported missing until July 2022
- Thread starter subaw0067
- Start date
- Status
The National Archives II are located off Adelphi Road. Just south of New Hampshire Avenue ln College Park, Maryland.
It is in Prince George's County which borders Washington. DC.
Archives Researchers are anyone who wishes to sign up and go through their short training course.
You can probably look at the Archives website to get an idea of the kinds of records that are stored there. Some types of records are searchable on line - IF they were scanned or digitized, but there is such a vast amount most searches like the one you are interested in would have to be done in person.
There are, of course, full time archivists and subject matter experts there to assist.
Archives II is well away from downtown DC, and easily accessible by car. Parking is in safe covered garages and is free. A free shuttle bus can take you to the old main Archives in DC. and return.
If you decide to go there for research, be sure to do your homework in advance, so that you have all your info available and written down to help you focus your efforts. You are very restricted as to what you can bring in with you.
There are, of course, full time archivists and subject matter experts there to assist.
Archives II is well away from downtown DC, and easily accessible by car. Parking is in safe covered garages and is free. A free shuttle bus can take you to the old main Archives in DC. and return.
If you decide to go there for research, be sure to do your homework in advance, so that you have all your info available and written down to help you focus your efforts. You are very restricted as to what you can bring in with you.
I have looked through the National Archive records. They do not make any form of service records public until at least 62 years following the end of service. This includes archived and non-archived records. They have an index on their website describing in detail what records are available.
Any service records prior to that date can only be obtained by the service person themselves, or a family member, who must show proof of death. This was also explained in the letter that is posted with the service records above.
There are a limited number of “Morning Reports” available, but only for the Army.
I have been through all available yearbooks, photos, etc
What you say in regard to individual service records is true, but no where in my post did I mention them.
I understand the need to find the service member's service numbers and/or his social security number in order to even request his Individual Service Record. And that request would be made to the National Military Personnel Records Center (NMPRC) in St. Louis, MO.
The records I was referring to are UNIT records, which often contain various rosters or lists of persons serving in, or attached to the unit.
For example, if the person you seek was known to be wounded and sent to the Philadelphia Naval Hospital, then his name, rank, and service number (or SSN) would be on a monthly list of all personnel (staff and patients) in the records of that hospital. The same could be true of any other known military unit.
If a unit was awarded an award such as a Meriterious Unit Citation, there would have been a list of persons authorized to wear the ribbon on their uniforms. Those rosters always contained identification numbers with the names.
You have to go into the Archives with some very good information to start with. Knowing the full name, home state, birth date or age, military service specialty, rank, etc. All help to narrow down the search. Specific duty stations, units, and dates are important as well.
A couple quick updates/possible clarifications:
-Steve went AWOL multiple times. In Feb, Apr, and Nov of 1976 he voluntarily returned to duty after being AWOL. There is a separate code for when a Marine is captured off base while AWOL and returned to duty. There is no mention of him being captured and returned to duty. In order for the story of him being caught by MP and escaping, he would have then voluntarily returned to service.
-Steve's Uncle said Steve said not to worry about him and walked away...which was the last time he was seen or heard from. Either this occurred in the last days of November/December 1976, or his Uncle was not the last person to see him alive.
-Steve was stationed at the most northern part of Camp Pendleton near the west coast. I talked through the possibility of him heading to Mexico and starting over with someone who was previously stationed at CP. He would have needed to leave the area around CP to avoid being caught. Given the location, it would have been easier to head north, then back south. Also, unless he knew Spanish, the changes of surviving in Mexico are very unlikely.
-The time lapse between classification as a deserter in 11/1976 and discharge in 1984 are very likely due to file sitting on someone's desk. Head of Battalion had the authority to release him.
-There is no record of a court martial in his file.
-His treatment once joining could have been tougher because his circumstances changed according to my friend. When he enlisted he was a young, single male. When he showed up, he was married with a child. This is two extra dependents (increased cost), means he would need to live off-base with family (they want them on base), distraction (he was in ground unit that is one of the first in if there is a conflict. They want young guys with no attachment who aren't going to second guess or be cautious, if that makes sense). This is absolute speculation, but comes from someone who was in the miliary around that time and stationed in that area.
-Two UIP's I previously posted are very unlikely to match. We went over the map in detail and there are multiple places someone could 'hide a body' very close to base where they would never be found. It would not make sense to transport someone through the City of Los Angeles to the Angeles National Forest.
-Randy Kraft has not been ruled out. Around this time, he had been on a hiatus due to being in a relationship. He had also started moving further north along the coast. However, he started at Camp Pendleton, so the area is known to him. The next person on his 'kill list' was 2-3 weeks after Steve disappeared from CP. That person's body was never recovered.
-Steve went AWOL multiple times. In Feb, Apr, and Nov of 1976 he voluntarily returned to duty after being AWOL. There is a separate code for when a Marine is captured off base while AWOL and returned to duty. There is no mention of him being captured and returned to duty. In order for the story of him being caught by MP and escaping, he would have then voluntarily returned to service.
-Steve's Uncle said Steve said not to worry about him and walked away...which was the last time he was seen or heard from. Either this occurred in the last days of November/December 1976, or his Uncle was not the last person to see him alive.
-Steve was stationed at the most northern part of Camp Pendleton near the west coast. I talked through the possibility of him heading to Mexico and starting over with someone who was previously stationed at CP. He would have needed to leave the area around CP to avoid being caught. Given the location, it would have been easier to head north, then back south. Also, unless he knew Spanish, the changes of surviving in Mexico are very unlikely.
-The time lapse between classification as a deserter in 11/1976 and discharge in 1984 are very likely due to file sitting on someone's desk. Head of Battalion had the authority to release him.
-There is no record of a court martial in his file.
-His treatment once joining could have been tougher because his circumstances changed according to my friend. When he enlisted he was a young, single male. When he showed up, he was married with a child. This is two extra dependents (increased cost), means he would need to live off-base with family (they want them on base), distraction (he was in ground unit that is one of the first in if there is a conflict. They want young guys with no attachment who aren't going to second guess or be cautious, if that makes sense). This is absolute speculation, but comes from someone who was in the miliary around that time and stationed in that area.
-Two UIP's I previously posted are very unlikely to match. We went over the map in detail and there are multiple places someone could 'hide a body' very close to base where they would never be found. It would not make sense to transport someone through the City of Los Angeles to the Angeles National Forest.
-Randy Kraft has not been ruled out. Around this time, he had been on a hiatus due to being in a relationship. He had also started moving further north along the coast. However, he started at Camp Pendleton, so the area is known to him. The next person on his 'kill list' was 2-3 weeks after Steve disappeared from CP. That person's body was never recovered.
Stunned
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Aug 6, 2014
- Messages
- 6,437
- Reaction score
- 45,127
I have a question about AWOLs. Do you get reported for being AWOL for going on a couple of day bender? How long do you have to be gone before you’re in trouble L sorry if this has been already been discussed, I’m old.
Absent without leave (AWOL) also known as Unauthorized Absence (UA) are terms which are very military in nature.
In civilian employment situations when someone is late for work, or absent for a period of time, an employee can be counseled or fired. But under the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ), absence from duty without permission (or proper reason) is considered a legal offense to be dealt with. It can range anywhere from a brief absence to more serious offenses like desertion in the face of the enemy.
AWOL/UA is probably the most common UCMJ violation. While the book spells out certain required proofs and maximum sentencing guidelines for trials by court martial, this infraction is dealt with in many ways short of court martial.
Each military unit holds muster at specific times. If someone is missing, an effort is made to locate or account for him or her. If that service member remains missing after a reasonable time, they are reported AWOL/UA as of the time the absence was first noted.
There are a number of administrative procedures that begin to take place in an attempt to locate the missing person. After the 30th day of Unauthorized Absence the service person is declared a Deserter. That is an "administrative" determination, not a criminal conviction.
When declared a Deserter, the missing service member is placed on a list and his individual service records are forwarded to thr National Military Personnel Records Center (NMPRC) in St. Louis, MO.
No one in a Deserter status is given a discharge from the service. This can only be done after the absence is resolved in some manner. This can be done either administratively or by court martial.
I’ve discussed this at length with several service members of varying branches and ranks, that served in different decades. The consensus pretty much was that either he was never officially declared a deserter. There was so much going on at the time it’s possible his paperwork was lost then re-discovered in 1984. Or he was included in the large number of administrative discharges that were given to draft dodgers and deserters related to Vietnam if they agreed to perform civil service. Given everything going on at the time and the lack of technology we have today for record keeping, it is almost certain the delay was due to misplaced paperwork.
Stunned
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Aug 6, 2014
- Messages
- 6,437
- Reaction score
- 45,127
Thank you, great explanation.
Snoangel26
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2022
- Messages
- 382
- Reaction score
- 3,678
Thank you
Snoangel26
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2022
- Messages
- 382
- Reaction score
- 3,678
I received a reply from the detective. Nothing helpful.
Jerri Blank
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2012
- Messages
- 430
- Reaction score
- 440
i guess my confusion on this is that his record you were sent does say he was a deserter as of 11/22/76, or does that mean he was just referred to the powers that be for desertion for being AWOL/UA? (sorry for the probably obvious question... i am just trying to reason out how a person in the service could just disappear!)
From what I understand, the Battalion Commander has the authority to make determinations like that, even to discharge people...which should have been done if they were not going to court martial him. It seems like unless there are suspicious circumstances, the military assumes they wanted out and left intentionally. Since there was no missing person report until @Snoangel26 filed one, I'm guessing the military never knew he was missing.
Laughing
Rarely Speechless
- Joined
- Jan 4, 2010
- Messages
- 15,584
- Reaction score
- 60,766
@Snoangel26 , will this record provide you with his health history, addresses, Social Security number?
Thank you for sharing this all with us. You are one brave & person!
Thank you for sharing this all with us. You are one brave & person!
Snoangel26
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2022
- Messages
- 382
- Reaction score
- 3,678
I was hoping his military record would provide me with more information. The record the detective received is the same one @megs1477able to provide to me. Which didn't have any identifying information. I did send a letter along with other copies to archives in st louis. Just waiting to hear back
Laughing
Rarely Speechless
- Joined
- Jan 4, 2010
- Messages
- 15,584
- Reaction score
- 60,766
My military friend suggested having an attorney send the request for the military records. If your current attempt is unsuccessful, I should be able to make that happen. I'm also going to put together a video and try to get some publicity as soon as I finish with the Paul Harrod case.
Laughing
Rarely Speechless
- Joined
- Jan 4, 2010
- Messages
- 15,584
- Reaction score
- 60,766
Perhaps your Congressional Representative or Senator could obtain the entire record for you at this point?
Snoangel26
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2022
- Messages
- 382
- Reaction score
- 3,678
I was emailing with a rep from my congressman office. But haven't heard anything in while
- Status
DNASolves
Staff online
-
WS AdminAdministrator
Online statistics
- Members online
- 180
- Guests online
- 572
- Total visitors
- 752