OK OK, Veronica Butler 27 & Jilian Kelley 39, Vehicle Abandoned, Texas County, 30 Mar 2024 #2 *Arrests*

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otto said:
I agree with earlier comments that this criminal disappearance is higher profile in the media because Jilian Kelley is the wife of a religious leader in Veronica's city of Hugoton. If it was only Veronica, people might view it as a domestic issue - especially if true that the region is made up of large landowners with similar values.

There is enough history of allegations against Veronica that she lost custody and was restricted to supervised visitation. If she disappeared, with those allegations on record, large landowners may have ignored her disappearance - with or without blood or shattered window.

This investigation is for Jilian Kelley, mother of four young children and wife of a religious leader in Hugoton. I would expect that those large landowners would be straight up when it comes to murdering a mother of four because the kidnapper couldn't figure out how to get Veronica alone.

If large landowners know something about a small landowner who was involved in the murder of a young mother, wouldn't they speak up? The only reason they might not speak up is that the kidnapper is one of the large landowners. The alternative is that those large landowners dismiss the murder of the wife of a community leader - and what does that say about their values?

The kidnapper wanted one person, and organized it when another, unrelated person was there - so both were intentionally taken. That should get the attention of everyone, because anyone could easily be the next accidental victim.
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Why did they not just disappear her somewhere around the Kansas town? Just seems their whole plan would have been easier with much less publicity.
 
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nhmemorymaker said:
Why did they not just disappear her somewhere around the Kansas town? Just seems their whole plan would have been easier with much less publicity.
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It definitely would have been. But then they wouldn't have had the home field advantage that I'm sure they were counting on. If they went to Kansas, they wouldn't have been sure of all the locations of cameras, nosy neighbors, etc. By doing the deed in Oklahoma, they knew there wasn't a soul around, no cameras, and a very short distance between the crime scene and wherever they had planned to take the body or bodies - cattle incinerator, well, pre-dug grave, or wherever. The further away from your familiar home turf you go, probably the more likely it is you'll get caught because you just don't know where the potential traps are. And the longer you have to drive with a body in your vehicle, the more potential you have to get in an accident, etc.

I imagine they looked at all of the different variables and decided that if an innocent bystander mother-of-four had to die as well for them to pull off their plan as quickly and easily as possible, then... oh well. Collateral damage. :(
 
Universecalling said:
That makes sense, and I think you’re right about location and the scope of influence.

Yet, they took the absolute shortest route to become suspects.
Like they asked themselves “how can we make this as obvious as it can be that we are the perps?” And then said “yep, that’s the one!”
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Doesn't it make you wonder just how powerful they think their influence is in Texas County? I'm wondering if this case won't require a change of venue for a fair trial? Or could the authorities get one? Which judge makes that decision?
 
Universecalling said:
That makes sense, and I think you’re right about location and the scope of influence.

Yet, they took the absolute shortest route to become suspects.
Like they asked themselves “how can we make this as obvious as it can be that we are the perps?” And then said “yep, that’s the one!”
Click to expand...

Or somebody took advantage of the obvious, obvious suspects and situation in order to commit a crime that nobody would think to link to them?
 
After reading the previous threads, a possible scenario…
VB and JK were en route to the pick up point that was agreed upon at a set time. “Someone” was supposed to scare them, make them uncomfortable enough to turn around and go home, possibly following them. This was supposed to cause VB to miss visitation appt., disapponting children, TAs ammo for custody hearing. JK calls husband, concerned/scared.
VB possibly recognizes vehicle or person harassing them. She stops,confrontation ensues. JK witnesses and becomes second victim. Harming them may have not been the plan, they were just supposed to be scared off and leave. Plan goes wrong. Women/bodies taken and disposed of. Car left because there was not enough time to deal with it.
 
It's curious that almost everyone posting is doing so under the assumption it's the same person/persons responsible for the disappearance of these ladies. While it does appear at first look, a nasty custody case may point to a particular person (motive), it's also worth asking the question, what if that particular person had literally nothing to do with their disappearance at all?

I mean, folks go through terrible family court issues all day long, every day of the year. Most folks however, don't resort to disappearing and/or killing family members because of it. Of course it happens, but it's incredibly rare (thankfully).

jmo
 
Ontario Mom said:
It's curious that almost everyone posting is doing so under the assumption it's the same person/persons responsible for the disappearance of these ladies. While it does appear at first look, a nasty custody case may point to a particular person (motive), it's also worth asking the question, what if that particular person had literally nothing to do with their disappearance at all?

I mean, folks go through terrible family court issues all day long, every day of the year. Most folks however, don't resort to disappearing and/or killing family members because of it. Of course it happens, but it's incredibly rare (thankfully).

jmo
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Truth is, people will kill for less.
 
Elley Mae said:
nypost.com

Missing Kansas moms may have been shot, pools of blood found near their car: report

Veronica Butler, 27, and Jilian Kelley, 39, have been missing since March 30.
nypost.com nypost.com
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So if true regarding the "puddles of blood" outside the car. Does that indicate they weren't shot in the car? If you were moving bodies that were shot inside a car, to transport them elsewhere. Would you have puddles of blood outside the vehicle if you were moving them quickly? Thinking about the mechanisms of all that and what it could indicate about what took place.
 
I'm unsure whether this was mentioned previously, but if either woman reached someone on her phone, I would think the first thing she'd have said -- out of pure instinct -- was what type of vehicle was following them. And if so, LE surely is working with this information.
 
nhmemorymaker said:
I think this region and rich powerful figures could easily get a hit set up.
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I have got an opposite view. Money buys a certain amount of privelage in any society and in any area. Small town "big fish in small pond" types in my town have:

- Arranged for a son to receive a reduced sentence after killing a woman while reckless driving, had a son found not to be "fully involved" in a vandalism spree with trailer park youth (the TP kids went to jail).

- Have gotten development / building permits "expedited", obtained disproportionate use of public money for improvements in their area, and worst of all (wink nod).....

- Summoned police a-mazingly fast and had me booted out of a public creek after I confirmed via the game warden that posted "no trespassing" signs were illicit. The city attorney confirmed it was public but it took time. I fish the creek today. The illicit signs have been allowed to stay up to discourage others. But, I am not on a crusade, so I dont insist they be taken down

Needless to say, all of the above falls far short of arranging double murder hits easily. Likewise, it fall far short having enough pull to intimidate others into silence regarding a double murder that included as @otto emphasized, was a pastor's wife and thus an "establishment" victim.

In short, I think suggestions of a Cartel level High Plains Mafia in the area are from Youtubbers looking for content. If the local are not talking, its because they simply dont know. Not because they are afraid to talk.
 
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Knox said:
www.ksn.com

OSBI arrests four on suspicion of murder in missing Kansas women case

The Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation has four people in custody in connection to the disappearance of Veronica Butler and Jilian Kelley.
www.ksn.com

Here it is folks!!! On my phone so all I do is link.
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Great news. That news nation reporter on the ground tweeted and deleted a couple hours ago about today being the day.

I was expecting 3 arrests at minimum, so this sounds exactly right.
 
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