Omaha double murder

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Shirley's family put up a 50,000 reward? It seems odd to me that no mention of a contribution by the Hunter's. Does anyone else find this odd? Slap my hand if needed but I can't help but wonder why they haven't contributed, if this is true.
 
My understanding is that Shirlee's family put up $25,000, adding to the original fund of $25,000 that was put up by an anonymous Creighton alumnus. Not sure if that is right or if the article is.
I hope someone corrects me if I am wrong but no, I don't think the boy's family have posted anything in the reward fund. I would think they could.
 
I wonder if Tom ever spent the night away from home, either at a friend's house, on scouting or church trips where someone could have attempted to molest him and he was
threatening to report them? I hate to even think about such a thing but someone went to that house for a specific reason that day and was angry enough to kill two people.
 
I just finished reading a detective novel by Lawrence Block 'Hit Man'. I don't want to sound to be trivializing this thing, but some things in that book struck a chord with me and my knowledge of this case.
The main character is a hitman, Keller. He is an anti-hero, a cool hitman who kills for money, however he also has standards. He will not take a case that he doesn't feel right about nor will he ever kill a child. In several of his jobs as desribed in the book, he uses materials at hand for the job. He also makes it look like something else, a robbery perhaps. He will kill another person if they happen to be there. Also he uses ploys such as a delivery person or messanger to gain admittance. See where I am going here?
If this were a hit job, it will be difficult to solve the crime because the perp may have no idea who hired it done. His only contact may have been a go-between he has never even seen and that person may have received the original assignment from yet another person.
These things do not come cheap. At least $10,000 or so would have been necessary for a contracter to have assigned the job. That may eliminate some personalities in this case. It might suggest someone with means who felt angered at something the Hunters did and utilized this to strike back.
YellowDog, your idea has alot of merit and perhaps someone who interacted with Tom in this manner could have hired a killer to silence him. Or it could have been a jealous collegue of the Hunters or an ex patient. If this were a hired killing it eliminates some of the motives such as some nutjob from the internet, etc. Something to think about.
 
A hired killer is a very strong possibility in that the person seen going to the door has never been found, the car had an out of state license plate on it and no one seems to have any idea who this man might be. But, if he was a hired killer, there would have to be a reason and someone who knew one of the victims or their families would have had to hire him. This definitely seems like a vendetta or revenge killing to me. In and out, no lingering, no torturing........just quick killing.
 
OK, here's another stray thought: a lot has been done to try to identify the license plate on the CRV the POI was seen in. Just what if..this car had been borrowed about an hour prior from a car dealer for a test drive? Dealers around here will usually let prospective buyers take out a car for an hour or so so long as you furnish ID. Wittnesses say the car looked clean and new- it was a damp spring day and this car looked to have been washed very recently. This may also explain the issue with the license plate- there wasn't one- it was a dealer tag in the holder.
This would if true speak to the possibility of a professional. Any ID he used would probably be fake as well.
Not sure how long auto dealers would save their survelience tapes but maybe this guy got caught on one somewhere. I am surprised I never thought of this before.
 
YellowDog said:
A hired killer is a very strong possibility in that the person seen going to the door has never been found, the car had an out of state license plate on it and no one seems to have any idea who this man might be. But, if he was a hired killer, there would have to be a reason and someone who knew one of the victims or their families would have had to hire him. This definitely seems like a vendetta or revenge killing to me. In and out, no lingering, no torturing........just quick killing.
Click to expand...

I agree that it was most likely a hired killing- a professional hit. The killer probably had no idea who his victims were.

However, why make the killings so brutal and violent if it was merely a professional hit? Aren't they usually "neater"? And wouldn't they have enough experience to know exactly where to aim to make it as clean and quick as possible?

Thinking along the professional killer line....perhaps we should start examining who would have the means to hire a professional killer? What are the "type" who usually hire professional killers? I don't have a lot of experience in studying this area, but four different "situations" I can think of off the bat that have made use of the services of a professional hit man:

-divorces (esp. those where a lot of money is involved)
-mafia (esp. Russian refer to my posts above)
-drug/gambling debts
-corrupt government/business dealings (conspiracies if you will)

For some reason, I just don't think a cover-up for molestation was the motive....just a feeling.
 
Snick1946 said:
OK, here's another stray thought: a lot has been done to try to identify the license plate on the CRV the POI was seen in. Just what if..this car had been borrowed about an hour prior from a car dealer for a test drive? Dealers around here will usually let prospective buyers take out a car for an hour or so so long as you furnish ID. Wittnesses say the car looked clean and new- it was a damp spring day and this car looked to have been washed very recently. This may also explain the issue with the license plate- there wasn't one- it was a dealer tag in the holder.
This would if true speak to the possibility of a professional. Any ID he used would probably be fake as well.
Not sure how long auto dealers would save their survelience tapes but maybe this guy got caught on one somewhere. I am surprised I never thought of this before.
Click to expand...

But the killings were reportedly very violent and "messy". If this is so, he MUST have gotten at least a bit of blood on him...right? I just don't see how he could have committed a double murder with knives and walked away completely clean.

If it was a brand new car from a dealer, wouldn't he most likely have gotten blood on him, thus getting the interior of the car a bit bloody? The dealer would have immediately noted this upon return and (hopefully) notified police.....just speculating on your speculation.
 
SnowAngels said:
I agree that it was most likely a hired killing- a professional hit. The killer probably had no idea who his victims were.

However, why make the killings so brutal and violent if it was merely a professional hit? Aren't they usually "neater"? And wouldn't they have enough experience to know exactly where to aim to make it as clean and quick as possible?

Thinking along the professional killer line....perhaps we should start examining who would have the means to hire a professional killer? What are the "type" who usually hire professional killers? I don't have a lot of experience in studying this area, but four different "situations" I can think of off the bat that have made use of the services of a professional hit man:

-divorces (esp. those where a lot of money is involved)
-mafia (esp. Russian refer to my posts above)
-drug/gambling debts
-corrupt government/business dealings (conspiracies if you will)

For some reason, I just don't think a cover-up for molestation was the motive....just a feeling.
Click to expand...


Or desperation to silence someone.
 
I've poured over the little evidence we have been given for months now. I keep it in a portfolio. I also keep all those close to me informed of my activities here because there is something dark and unnerving about this case IMO. Even our dear snick received an intimidating threat 'thru the grapevine' from OPD. I am very sorry that this happened to snick, who's only desire was to be a good citizen. I wish OPD would realize that online crime forums are a tool for solving crimes that is used by many LEA's through out the country. This is the 'new age' of crime solving.....we are in the 'Age of Aquarius' now.

Here are my latest thoughts on this case.

Tom played computer games. The PS3 hooks up through a phone line and players wear a headset and talk with peeps from all over while playing. Players get to know others who excel at the game and they form an alliance and choose the same ones for teams because they feel they know one another. Like some of us sleuths, friendships are formed and the players get to know one another on a more personal level.

Players get upset if someone is suspected of 'cheating'. If a player advances his man too quickly then other players become quickly suspicious. Cheating is highly looked down upon.

What if Tom had developed some tricks to beat the game and one of his 'comrades' had found him out and knew enough personal information about him that this person was bribing him in some way. The person could have threatened legal ramifications if Tom was found out but promised to keep quiet if Tom complied with his request.

What could the request be? We know the perp carried a laptop bag into the home. Why? Did he need a laptop to verify that Tom was handing over what the perp was after? I just always assumed that he brought knives in the bag and Mrs. Hunter's statement that 'the perp left knives behind' (paraphrased) infers the knives were brought in and left behind by someone, but JMO.

The person who put out the hit was probably someone from another town but another player could have taken him up on the opportunity to make some $$$ to pay Tom a visit and it ended in double murder.

I am still torn whether they were after Tom's game tricks or something more, like the ability to aquire pills or something through his parents' association with Creighton. What ever it was, I think Tom had second thoughts and didn't want to give it up resulting in his and Shirlee's murder.

All speculation and MOO!

wm
 
I'm continuing here because I was afraid the first post was too lengthy. But here's what we now....

Tom's computer game was on pause downstairs.
Tom's body was found in the dining room.
Shirlee's body was found near the stairs.
Tom was smart.
Tom played computer games.
Mrs. Dr. Hunter was in Hawaii.
Mr. Dr. Hunter was at work.
A large amount of money was in Shirlee's purse.
Nothing was missing from the home.
Shirlee's car was parked in an unusal way. (Could Tom have been expecting a visitor and called her to come back so he wasn't home alone? Why wouldn't he have called his dad if he felt threatened?)

Just some thoughts and questions which lead me to the above scenario.

This is all JMO of course!

Thoughts?

wm
 
My feeling has been that it was a hit. However, a hit usually involves a clean shot to the head. The bloodiness of the murders bothers me. However, I can see the perp coming from behind to do the stabbings. There wouldn't be as much blood on the perp if it were done in that way. People usually die faster with stabs to the throat. They usually can't scream, and it is quieter than a gun.

Also, if the knives came from the home, there would be less of a footprint as far as a weapon. Assassins often use available weapons.
 
Claycat said:
My feeling has been that it was a hit. However, a hit usually involves a clean shot to the head. The bloodiness of the murders bothers me. However, I can see the perp coming from behind to do the stabbings. There wouldn't be as much blood on the perp if it were done in that way. People usually die faster with stabs to the throat. They usually can't scream, and it is quieter than a gun.

Also, if the knives came from the home, there would be less of a footprint as far as a weapon. Assassins often use available weapons.
Click to expand...

The article which interviewed Dr. Claire Hunter quoted her as saying the killer left behind knives. She never says the knives came from her home. I've always had reservations about the knives coming from the Hunter home. What professional killer would leave it up to luck to find the weapons he needed for a "hit" job in the victim's home? How could he be sure he'd find the knives in time? I think the knives were in the satchel or briefcase. I think the reason he used knives is because they are harder to trace than a gun and are sold in many, many places and don't have to be registered.

IMO, this guy was cunning and came prepared. I think the killer and Tom had a prearranged meeting for some purpose and that is why Tom was upstairs.
The killer probably didn't even know Shirlee was in the house until she appeared and he had to kill her too because she was the only witness. He wasn't a thief because the home was probably full of valuable items. For some reason, I keep thinking blackmail was involved in some way.
 
I imagine you are right about the knives, Yellow Dog. I was in a jury where someone had used a knife from the victim's kitchen to kill her, so I guess I was thinking along those lines.

Blackmail is certainly a possibility.
 
My guess is knives were used as the killer did not have access to a gun. A student from another country might fit this profile. Technically not the criminal kind, no access to illegal firearms or legal ones, he used what he had. I'm still think revenge killing.
 
The perp was a grown man who apparently knew that Tom would be home from school at this time. I'd bet my bottom dollar that Tom played his video game at the same time each day so the perp knew his routine. Also, the perp was seen stopping and starting as he was talking to someone on his cell phone. I suggest Tom was playing with someone he didn't know but who was considered an ally by Tom and this person was relaying information to the perp by cell phone.

Tom, being a young kid, would certainly be afraid if someone online were threatening to turn him in if he broke the gaming rules.(resulting in a blackmail attempt) Or Tom could have discovered someone was cheating and threatened to turn him in. (resulting in a revenge killing.

I still can't forget this perp brought a laptop bag. I am assuming it held a laptop and if so, why bring a laptop along when you plan to kill someone? I think Tom had something this perp wanted and the Dr.'s Hunter are prolly not even aware of it. Sure wish we knew if the knives came from the home or not. If they were from the home then my assumption would be that there was a laptop in the bag. If the perp brought them then maybe the bag was part of a disguise.

I'm just trying to think of scenario's which fit the clues we've been given.

All MOO of course.

wm
 
waltzingmatilda said:
The perp was a grown man who apparently knew that Tom would be home from school at this time. I'd bet my bottom dollar that Tom played his video game at the same time each day so the perp knew his routine. Also, the perp was seen stopping and starting as he was talking to someone on his cell phone. I suggest Tom was playing with someone he didn't know but who was considered an ally by Tom and this person was relaying information to the perp by cell phone.

Tom, being a young kid, would certainly be afraid if someone online were threatening to turn him in if he broke the gaming rules.(resulting in a blackmail attempt) Or Tom could have discovered someone was cheating and threatened to turn him in. (resulting in a revenge killing.

I still can't forget this perp brought a laptop bag. I am assuming it held a laptop and if so, why bring a laptop along when you plan to kill someone? I think Tom had something this perp wanted and the Dr.'s Hunter are prolly not even aware of it. Sure wish we knew if the knives came from the home or not. If they were from the home then my assumption would be that there was a laptop in the bag. If the perp brought them then maybe the bag was part of a disguise.

I'm just trying to think of scenario's which fit the clues we've been given.

All MOO of course.

wm
Click to expand...


I was told that Tom had an X-box gaming system. I too would be interested to know if he was set up to play online. I wonder if LE utilized that fully as a clue, perhaps they could have determined who he was in contact with.
The idea that someone could be murdered over a video game is astounding but that is reality these days to a lot of people.
That would take this crime out of the realm of being a contract killing and into that of being done by a highly intelligent young man with an obsession. Maybe Tom downloaded some cheat that woould beat the system and the guy killed him to seal the secret. I still think this thing is about the best avenue for LE to follow.
On the subject of the car- I believe LE checked out a few car rental places but not any auto dealers, and nothing at all over the river in Iowa. Just another fact that sometimes makes me wonder if they really wanted to go to the bother of solving this case? Sometimes I think they reognized from the outset that there was a possible hit man involved and decided it was just going to be too hard to resolve and just put it to one side.
 
Snick1946 said:
I was told that Tom had an X-box gaming system. I too would be interested to know if he was set up to play online. I wonder if LE utilized that fully as a clue, perhaps they could have determined who he was in contact with.
The idea that someone could be murdered over a video game is astounding but that is reality these days to a lot of people.
That would take this crime out of the realm of being a contract killing and into that of being done by a highly intelligent young man with an obsession. Maybe Tom downloaded some cheat that woould beat the system and the guy killed him to seal the secret. I still think this thing is about the best avenue for LE to follow.
On the subject of the car- I believe LE checked out a few car rental places but not any auto dealers, and nothing at all over the river in Iowa. Just another fact that sometimes makes me wonder if they really wanted to go to the bother of solving this case? Sometimes I think they reognized from the outset that there was a possible hit man involved and decided it was just going to be too hard to resolve and just put it to one side.
Click to expand...

BBM
Or Tom created a new cheat and someone wanted it.
 
KAE- yes that would work as well, maybe better. Tom beat the game, this other guy dropped by with his laptop to discuss with Tom or maybe get a zip file with the cheat to beat the game on it. Tom changes his mind and they argue, the guy grabs a knife from the Kitchen block...
LE supposedly pulled the drives on the computers at Tom's home and Shirlee's. But what about the X-box? Maybe someone who does gaming can tell us, would there be any record on this, maybe on the hard drive of the family computer that the modem was linked to via a router maybe?
 
My dear SIL has a PS3 which is attached to the Tv and thru a land line which allows players to converse during the game. Games sure have changed these days. I had no idea that players communicated like this til I saw him playing. I asked my DD about it and she told me he talks to peeps from all over the US and Canada.

Although I don't know how it works, it seems that phone records might be helpful since a land line is involved.

IDK if Tom's game worked in this way but it is something to think about.

MOO

wm
 
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