Oscar Pistorius - Discussion Thread #69 *Appeal Verdict*

[sinth]

According to Pistorius' version, where was the gun on the night of the incident?

I've tried to find on youtube where it was discussed but it was taking too much time and all I managed to find was their sleeping locations. Reeva was on the right hand side (i.e. closest to the balcony)

I didn't watch the trial in great detail the first time through but I have always wondered about these exact details.

 

[soozieqtips]

According to Pistorius' version, where was the gun on the night of the incident?

I've tried to find on youtube where it was discussed but it was taking too much time and all I managed to find was their sleeping locations. Reeva was on the right hand side (i.e. closest to the balcony)

I didn't watch the trial in great detail the first time through but I have always wondered about these exact details.

Normally he kept it next to the bed on the bedside table, but on this particular occasion it was under the bed (somewhere he never kept it according to ex Sam Taylor). But if it had been in its normal position, he could never have explained how he didn't see Reeva wasn't in bed. It was hard enough for him to explain how he didn't not see while he was fumbling under the bed (in the dark) so in any of his versions, he couldn't have the gun where it was usually kept.

 

[sinth]

Normally he kept it next to the bed on the bedside table

and normally he slept on the right hand side of the bed too right ? Didn't they swap on the night of the murder because he had a sore shoulder/arm ?

but on this particular occasion it was under the bed

On the left hand side of the bed ?

and final question, where was he when he first heard the alleged intruder ?

 

[ApplesInMyBra]

and normally he slept on the right hand side of the bed too right ? Didn't they swap on the night of the murder because he had a sore shoulder/arm ?


On the left hand side of the bed ?

and final question, where was he when he first heard the alleged intruder ?

Yes, he normally slept on the right side of the bed, and yes apparently they swapped because of this shoulder.
He first heard the intruder while he was putting the jeans over the blue LED light on the sounds system at the foot of the bed.

 

[mhiforme]

Has anyone heard how long it might take before we hear back as to whether the CC will take Oscar's case?

 

[Interested Bystander]

Hi mrjitty,

Brian Webber has relocated to the US but I'm unaware of the reason why. However he flew back to SA for the appeal. Andrew Fawcett has now taken over the reins and will be acting for OP.

JJ, I wonder whether anything can be read into Webber not returning to see this trial through? Just a thought.

 

[jilly]

We should see what the Prosecution has to say on this Appeal, by Monday, right?
Apparently, they had 10 days to respond.

 

[soozieqtips]

Just watching Big Fat Quiz of the Year 2015:

"Oscar Pistorius was convicted of murder and then released on house arrest... that's where he's most dangerous - in a house."

I did smile

 

[Belgarion]

We should see what the Prosecution has to say on this Appeal, by Monday, right?
Apparently, they had 10 days to respond.

Apparently, now that’s the key word in this case…..

Apparently, OP thought Reeva was still in the bedroom

Apparently, OP can scream like a woman and a man at the same time

Apparently, Masipa concluded that it is wrong to consider that OP having fired 4 expanding bullets at body height into a small space where it is known a person is trapped should think he might have caused some harm.

Apparently, ammunition self-discharges at times in SA and can also be mysteriously deposited into a safe by a person with whom the safe owner is not on speaking terms

Apparently, forgetting the names of ‘witnesses’ is quite common for OP

Apparently, OP is conveniently ‘unstable’ on his stumps in court but can ‘run’ when being filmed

Apparently, this is a case of GAD that never was

etc, etc

 

[JudgeJudi]

JJ, I wonder whether anything can be read into Webber not returning to see this trial through? Just a thought.

I personally wouldn't read anything into it. There's no reason why Webber should feel he has to put his life on hold for OP who is, after all, just another client. He obviously reached a point where he chose to move on ... and out of SA. Good luck to him. He would have worked extremely hard in getting this matter to trial let alone during the trial itself. Lawyers don't get the glory that counsel do, but believe me, they work like Trojans.

 

[Interested Bystander]

I personally wouldn't read anything into it. There's no reason why Webber should feel he has to put his life on hold for OP who is, after all, just another client. He obviously reached a point where he chose to move on ... and out of SA. Good luck to him. He would have worked extremely hard in getting this matter to trial let alone during the trial itself. Lawyers don't get the glory that counsel do, but believe me, they work like Trojans.

Thanks JJ. I did wonder whether it was unusual for a lawyer to leave a case before its end and knew your experience would provide the answer. I half thought he might just have had enough of all the deceit and lies and opted out, ie a lawyer with a conscience. If he has moved on and out, so to speak, I agree with you, good luck to him.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

https://twitter.com/johncoxonmedia

John Coxon ‏@johncoxonmedia 7 Std.Vor 7 Stunden
Deadline today for #SCA Heads of Argument countering #OscarPistorius challenge to its spurious verdict reversal.

John Coxon ‏@johncoxonmedia 20 Std.Vor 20 Stunden
#OscarPistorius Why Constitutional Court appeal failure would herald handicapping citizens from defending themselves

John Coxon ‏@johncoxonmedia 22 Std.Vor 22 Stunden
I uploaded 26 infographics - the many factual concerns re #OscarPistorius case as miscarriage of justice https://goo.gl/NrOnnB
(VOLUNTARY ON LINE SUPPORT FOR PARALYMPIAN OSCAR PISTORIUS)


Please look at twitter to see the added texts. I don't know how to copy.

 

[Marfa Lights]

https://twitter.com/johncoxonmedia

John Coxon ‏@johncoxonmedia 7 Std.Vor 7 Stunden
Deadline today for #SCA Heads of Argument countering #OscarPistorius challenge to its spurious verdict reversal.

John Coxon ‏@johncoxonmedia 20 Std.Vor 20 Stunden
#OscarPistorius Why Constitutional Court appeal failure would herald handicapping citizens from defending themselves

John Coxon ‏@johncoxonmedia 22 Std.Vor 22 Stunden
I uploaded 26 infographics - the many factual concerns re #OscarPistorius case as miscarriage of justice https://goo.gl/NrOnnB
(VOLUNTARY ON LINE SUPPORT FOR PARALYMPIAN OSCAR PISTORIUS)


Please look at twitter to see the added texts. I don't know how to copy.

FG-- judging from his Twitter posts he appears to be a vulgar old crank.

The other link took me to Coxon's Facebook page-- where, despite his claims to be a "professional", the quality of the photography work he posted appears to be at a very amateur level IMO, and his photos of OP as an athlete show a much younger Oscar. Coxon claims that the "humble" young man he met and photographed could not have committed murder. Many people who knew Oscar in the early days of his career have commented on a change that overtook him as he met with more fame and financial rewards. Perhaps Coxon only knew Oscar before success went to his head.

Anyway, strikes me as a fan-boy (and a serious crank) who was grateful that a world-class athlete gave him the time of day.

Just my impression.

 

[WilliamMunter]

@karynmaughan: BREAKING: state has filed affidavit opposing #OscarPistorius attempt to overturn his murder conviction in Constitutional Court @eNCA

@karynmaughan: BREAKING: state says #OscarPistorius has "no reasonable prospect of success" in his appeal bid @eNCA

@karynmaughan: NPA: #OscarPistorius appeal arguments are "without merit and contrived" @eNCA

@karynmaughan: NPA: it's in the interests of justice that #OscarPistorius is sentenced "on the crime he has committed" @eNCA

@karynmaughan: NPA adamant that Appeal Court made right decision in convicting #OscarPistorius of murder - and made "no errors of law" @eNCA

@karynmaughan: NPA: there exists no credible explanation from #OscarPistorius for the killing of Reeva Steenkamp @eNCA

@karynmaughan: NPA has urged Constitutional Court not to give #OscarPistorius the chance to argue his murder appeal. @eNCA

@karynmaughan: NPA has rubbished #OscarPistorius lawyers argument that Appeal Court exceeded its jurisdiction when it convicted him of murder @eNCA

https://twitter.com/karynmaughan

 

[Tortoise]

Sounds like they laughed at his appeal

 

[Mr Fossil]

The State's response in full opposing the application to appeal. Andrea Johnson has provided the written argument.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/296591638/Oscar-Cc-Final-Papers-Aj-Monday-25-Jan-Respondent

Also available here:

https://www.enca.com/south-africa/state-oscar-appeal-has-no-reasonable-prospect-success

 

[Tortoise]

I'm having a good old giggle here reading the State's reply. It's brilliant.

 

[Mr Fossil]

17.9 The two forms of dolus and, with respect, the correct and accepted definition of dolus eventualis were dealt with at paras [26]—[27]. Although this will receive further elucidation, it is perhaps apposite at this point to question the Applicant’s contention that there exists a so-called, or purported, “second component’ for dolus eventualis, namely that of knowledge of unlawfulness. The Applicant eschews any possible support that this definition for dolus eventualis has received in case-law and even in recognized and respected legal writing.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/296591638/Oscar-Cc-Final-Papers-Aj-Monday-25-Jan-Respondent

 

[Tortoise]

April doesn't feel so far away after all.

 

[Mr Fossil]

Now that the State has filed its response, we're at the step where the ConCourt must decide whether to grant the application or throw it out. I recall someone posting that this decision typically takes about one month but there is no time scale defined.

19[.6] Appeals
a. The Court shall decide whether or not to grant the appellant leave to appeal.
b. Applications for leave to appeal may be dealt with summarily, without receiving oral or written argument other than that contained in the application itself.
c. The Court may order that the application for leave to appeal be set down for argument and direct that the written argument of the parties deal not only with the question whether the application for leave to appeal should be granted, but also with the merits of the dispute. The provisions of rule 20 shall, with necessary modifications, apply to the procedure to be followed in such procedures.

See http://www.constitutionalcourt.org.za/site/thecourt/rulesofthecourt.htm for full rules.