Oscar Pistorius - Sentencing - 7.6.2016

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JJ, on the odd occasion I have wanted to use one, I drop it into Word and edit it.

Thanks IB. I've tried that before and it does work in Word, however it doesn't copy the tweeter's name or time. I can always type the name in, and time doesn't matter. At least it doesn't have all those other problems.

You were right about what happened tonight. If I didn't hear it, I wouldn't have believed it. She has a lot to answer for. I posted earlier about a man who stole goats and cattle and was sentenced to 80 years but Reeva was only worth 6. It's beyond tragic.
 
The SC decided what OP did was murder and convicted him of that. The sentence needs to follow the guidelines of that conviction. Masipa's sentence does not follow the minimums. OP 'losing everything important to him' is not the point. He hasn't lost his freedom for more than a couple years with this sentence, which is exactly the point. His feeling sorry also isn't the point. He committed a murder and nothing is going to change that. The sentence needs to reflect the gravity of the conviction, otherwise why bother convicting him at all? In essence what she's done is give him another lax culpable homicide sentence, in contradiction to the SC conviction.


Whether or not he feels remorse was very relevant to her decision, actually, as she found it mitigating, as was the price he's already paid, for the same reason.

She has sentencing discretion and she exercised it.
 
I think she was also thumbing her nose at the general public who had continued to heap so much criticism on her ever since her first verdict and judgment. I think Tillie the Manatee turned into Thokozile the Black Mamba.

^: :bowdown:

:snail: to :snake:





need to get through these emojis before the thread gets closed down ;) lessens the pain
 
By the way,

I posted a couple of days ago, wtte, if Masipa goes easy on him, ok he gets to serve whatever derisory sentence she gives, but once complete, he actually has to PAY all over again.

OP is forever stuffed :turkey:
His surroundings maybe lavish, but he's still stuffed with this sentence.

Due to it's very leniency (if there is no legal correction through Appeal) he will forever be the murderer who got off lightly.

So there is some bizarre retribution in this injustice after all. She has just condemned him to a life-time of ignominy where he will never be seen to have paid his dues.



Anyway
I cannot begin to imagine how badly the Steenkamp family are feeling

even Nel, I have heard Prosecutors say , how it's taken them years to get over some cases that didn't get the right outcome.


Shorter sentence or full, OP was always going to walk out of prison as a murderer who the public loathes.
 
Whether or not he feels remorse was very relevant to her decision, actually, as she found it mitigating, as was the price he's already paid, for the same reason.

She has sentencing discretion and she exercised it.

Just a starting point for you.



"‘It has been held, quite correctly, that a plea of guilty in the face of an open and shut case against an accused person is a neutral factor. . . There is, moreover, a chasm between regret and remorse.
Many accused persons might well regret their conduct, but that does not without more translate to genuine remorse.

Remorse is a gnawing pain of conscience for the plight of another. Thus genuine contrition can only come from an appreciation and acknowledgement of the extent of one's error.
Whether the offender is sincerely remorseful, and not simply feeling sorry for himself or herself at having been caught, is a factual question. It is to the surrounding actions of the accused, rather than what he says in court, that one should rather look. In order for the remorse to be a valid consideration, the penitence must be sincere and the accused must take the court fully into his or her confidence.

Until and unless that happens, the genuineness of the contrition alleged to exist cannot be determined. After all, before a court can find that an accused person is genuinely remorseful, it needs to have a proper appreciation of, inter alia: what motivated the accused to commit the deed; what has since provoked his or her change of heart; and whether he or she does indeed have a true appreciation of the consequences of those actions.'
 
Thanks IB. I've tried that before and it does work in Word, however it doesn't copy the tweeter's name or time. I can always type the name in, and time doesn't matter. At least it doesn't have all those other problems.

You were right about what happened tonight. If I didn't hear it, I wouldn't have believed it. She has a lot to answer for. I posted earlier about a man who stole goats and cattle and was sentenced to 80 years but Reeva was only worth 6. It's beyond tragic.

JJ, I guess I must have a different Word Version to you as I have three options to paste, one being text only but it does include the Tweeter and the time.

I saw your earlier very apt post. It really does beggar belief, especially when lawyers are disturbed by today's decision.
 
From your link:
And, according to our eagle-eyed legal expert Llewelyn Curlewis, a former acting judge and also chair of the Law Society Criminal Law Committee, under Section 276 (3) (a) ii of the Criminal Procedures Act, there is a possibility that the Paralympian could be out of jail after serving just one year of his new sentence.


JMO
The entitlement family has had their eye on the free bird prize the moment Reeva took her last breath.


Im just catching up with this thread. Ive just read this post and im literally in a heap on the floor!
OP could be released just after 1 of serving his sentence?
What a slap in the face for RS family good grief that is horrendous! 😬

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk
 
That's a very different attitude to the one displayed on the Jodi Arias thread in a case where it could be strongly argued that the victim's choices played a much larger role in his murder than going to the toilet in the middle of the night. I recall that some people there were incredibly distraught, to the point of weeping, when she didn't get the death penalty that they and the family wanted.


Not sure how her trial/penalty is relevant here, as virtually every aspect of the cases differ. Most notably for most, I think, the urge for the DP was due to CMJA's relentless attempts to cause maximum damage and pain to her victim's family, and her malicious post-murder attacks on the victim she drove 1,000 miles to murder.
 
Soft spot? Or maybe she sees the matter more holistically than most. OP has in fact lost everything that was important to him, just as she said, and has no chance of ever regaining his reputation or a livelihood based on what he once was.

The State overreached in accusing him of premeditated murder, and there was zero evidence of DV. OP shot recklessly at what he thought was an intruder. He deserves to be punished for that recklessness, and he has been, and will pay more in time behind bars.

True only if you believe the one witness even this ::cough:: judge said was a poor witness. I believe that every day will be like dog years for poor ole pitiful Pistorius in jail, and that gives me a bit of peace with this. He is is own worst enemy and is the sole reason he will never regain his "reputation". He has been completely repugnant in his actions, words and deeds that night and since. I also believe that Nel will appeal and the Supreme Court will need to be the final voice in this ridiculous farce of a trial.
 
Just a starting point for you.


A starting point for what? The judge made a determination that OP is remorseful, which she considered mitigating, which led to a reduced sentence. Thems the facts, as is the fact the public's doubt about his remorse was irrelevant to her decision, thankfully.
 
What do you make of this remark by Masipa (if it has been transcribed correctly)-- "closer to dolus eventualis"? Closer to??

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-oscar-pistorius-to-hear-his-sentence-20160706

According to the State, the court should still deliver a long sentence, as the crime bordered on dolus directus. I disagree.

The finding of the SCA was that the accused had been found of a crime closer to dolus eventualis. (Emphasis mine)

UL. Yes that's odd. Sloppy wording from her again

I Hadn't seen this link, it has the full drivel in it, not quite a transcript but fullest account I've seen so far.
 
I agree, he will be a pariah and a target once he is on the street again. I can see lots more fights in the future.
Maybe for the next decade or so after he's out. Eventually memories will fade and attention will turn elsewhere. It's inevitable, ultimately.
 
Im just catching up with this thread. Ive just read this post and im literally in a heap on the floor!
OP could be released just after 1 of serving his sentence?
What a slap in the face for RS family good grief that is horrendous! 

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

Relax, that provision of the statutes is VERY rarely used and even more rarely successful. As it stands OP will sit there for the next three years at a minimum, after that who knows but parole is not just handed out freely. So now we wait for Nel and the NPA to let us know if they will fight on, I think they should.
 
Im just catching up with this thread. Ive just read this post and im literally in a heap on the floor!
OP could be released just after 1 of serving his sentence?
What a slap in the face for RS family good grief that is horrendous! 😬

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

Welcome Gigi,

It could be 3 years before he is paroled - conflicting reports.

It's a shocker isn't it. Plus it took her 3 weeks to write it too!

this link has a fuller account of what she said today

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-oscar-pistorius-to-hear-his-sentence-20160706
 
Maybe for the next decade or so after he's out. Eventually memories will fade and attention will turn elsewhere. It's inevitable, ultimately.

Yes, I am sure you are right but it will give him a few years to take on board just how despised he is.
 
Whether or not he feels remorse was very relevant to her decision, actually, as she found it mitigating, as was the price he's already paid, for the same reason.

She has sentencing discretion and she exercised it.

Sentencing guidelines also stated admission of guilt as a condition for mitigating sentence.
But Masipa also cautioned that just because the "accused" is untruthful does not mean you can't believe him.
 
Not sure how her trial/penalty is relevant here, as virtually every aspect of the cases differ. Most notably for most, I think, the urge for the DP was due to CMJA's relentless attempts to cause maximum damage and pain to her victim's family, and her malicious post-murder attacks on the victim she drove 1,000 miles to murder.

Original post: The most basic truth here is no different than in any other case in which an innocent is dead and a family grieves: there isn't any justice available that can fix or change what matters most.

It is not the similarity in the cases I was noting it is the difference in the attitude towards the given sentences. To say on one hand that no sentence can ever change what matters most and on the other to personally want the death penalty for Arias suggests to me that personal opinions on these two particular perpetrators are clouding any impartiality when it comes to apt sentencing. Besides which, I believe that CMOP knowingly murdered Reeva Steenkamp so should also have been facing a much harsher sentence than the paltry year or two he has received.
 
Maybe for the next decade or so after he's out. Eventually memories will fade and attention will turn elsewhere. It's inevitable, ultimately.

What , like OJ was a pariah for only 10 years? I think we're talking generations.

I can't see it Madeleine, it'll last longer than that. I only just finished the OJ series and there's another one on air now that I haven't seen.

Sure he will still have some cronies to party with, get married , have kids etc.

But definitely I agree, he'll be on TV again soon, people will watch just like they're often drawn to the "aftermath" of a multiple pile-up on the motorway. He can be the auteur of different kind of freak show if he chooses.
 
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