PA - Assassination attempt, shooting injures former POTUS Donald Trump, leaves 1 spectator deceased two in critical condition, 13 July 2024 #2

[Chimera]

snipped

I agree the security coordination seems to be at fault, but I would say the main burden of fault is a young man who brought a gun to the place and used it.

jmo

Yes, that is not in dispute at all.

 

[formerlyme]

Thinking there should be a list of requirements somewhere for such events but I guess it is up to the candidates. A good camera system should be a priority and security staff to monitor the cameras would be important for me.

 

[Inthedetails]

Of course. But the issue is that there are countless others just like him.

So it’s paramount that failures be recognized and addressed, so this doesn’t happen again.

Of course. I would never suggest otherwise. Fix the dang security situation! I'm first in line to say figure out what happened and fix it yesterday.

But let's not forget it was a guy with a gun who caused this wreckage.

It wasn't radicals, it wasn't political foes, it wasn't the press, it wasn't SS who harmed innocents in the crowd. It was some twerpy local kid with a gun.


jmo

 

[CCJD]

I think there was an overly heavy reliance on a small rural police force, that doesn’t commonly deal with events involving high-profile public figures. Butler has maybe 20 uniformed officers. Compare that to Pittsburgh with around 850.

jmo

"... There is not just one entity responsible; the Secret Service plays a key role in protecting, in this case, former President Trump, but they don't act alone. The Secret Service receives support from local police departments."

"There is an immediate ring around Trump, which is manned by the Secret Service, but then, there is a secondary ring further out, which is manned largely by local and state police. The assailant was in that secondary ring."
bbm

Armed Butler Township officer encountered Trump rally shooter on roof, sheriff says

Butler County Sheriff Michael Slupe confirmed that an armed municipal officer encountered shooter Thomas Crooks before he fired shots from a rooftop building.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[fred&edna]

I think there was an overly heavy reliance on a small rural police force, that doesn’t commonly deal with events involving high-profile public figures. Butler has maybe 20 uniformed officers. Compare that to Pittsburgh with around 850.

jmo

And, the US Security Service team should have known that... it seems basic to me.

jmo

 

[vls12345]

No, you can’t fix stupid and a man is now dead. Secret Service says it was the duty of the local police force. Were the police force given adequate training and resources? Should SS even rely on locals unless it’s clear they can handle the task?

The finger-pointing will go on ad nauseum.
The failure needs understood and fixed for the future.

jmo

I am firmly in the camp that the Secret Service was the lead agency, even if "subcontracting" out their work to other LE agencies is SOP. As such, they should have oversight of all plans and ensure groups are briefed and coordinated accordingly. I see this as a Secret Service security failure regardless of what agency was technically in charge of the manufacturing building.

Also, I have said previously that Trump was too exposed too often even once Secret Service was surrounding him. And the fact that others could hear (and later report on) Secret Service conversation and coordination is also appalling. Big, big lapses in multiple areas, imo.

 

[formerlyme]

And, the US Security Service team should have known that... it seems basic to me.

jmo

Who is responsible for requesting the security detail? Can they ask for more or request specific protections? I have never planned such a huge and possibly heated event so I am truly curious . I know some venues have requirements you have to meet.... But ultimately it is the event itself that is responsible .

 

[Elley Mae]

The F.B.I. has not found a manifesto, and Mr. Crooks had never been under F.B.I. investigation. The official confirmed that he did not have an unusual online history for a 20-year-old man. He liked to play chess, video games and was learning how to code, according to a review of his online activities.

He did not appear to have a public profile on major social media platforms including Facebook and Instagram. The messaging platform Discord said it had found an account apparently linked to the gunman, but the company said that “it was rarely utilized and we have found no evidence that it was used to plan this incident or discuss his political views.”

Here’s What Is Known About the Suspect Who Tried to Assassinate Trump

Authorities identified the gunman as a 20-year-old man from Bethel Park, Pa., a town about an hour’s drive from the site of the shooting.

www.nytimes.com

 

[margarita25]

It seems there is a live WH briefing on.

 

[vls12345]

The F.B.I. has not found a manifesto, and Mr. Crooks had never been under F.B.I. investigation. The official confirmed that he did not have an unusual online history for a 20-year-old man. He liked to play chess, video games and was learning how to code, according to a review of his online activities.

He did not appear to have a public profile on major social media platforms including Facebook and Instagram. The messaging platform Discord said it had found an account apparently linked to the gunman, but the company said that “it was rarely utilized and we have found no evidence that it was used to plan this incident or discuss his political views.”

Here’s What Is Known About the Suspect Who Tried to Assassinate Trump

Authorities identified the gunman as a 20-year-old man from Bethel Park, Pa., a town about an hour’s drive from the site of the shooting.

www.nytimes.com

I know it's still early but I am beginning to wonder about the possibility of schizophrenia. Possibly? Idk. Imo.

 

[Knox]

I know I'm late and this has likely been shared many times but this video (starting at 1:19) floors me...

jmo

Oh My God!! He could have taken so many people out, they were yelling "he's on the roof". None of them apparently knew he had a gun until shots were fired. Very chilling footage.

As more and more information comes out, this security breach points straight back to a Secret Service failure, IMO. I don't care if Local Law Enforcement is responsible for "outside perimeters". Someone has to be responsible for driving the bus, not just loading passengers.

They should have had access to that entire facilty limited/under surveillance, let alone the rooftops, and called out in the pre-planning operations document. It's mind boggling they did not. You don't need to be a national security specialist to see the potential danger that existed.

 

[nerosleuth]

In the coming weeks there will be many questions asked concerning the security blunders at the rally which has now become an embarrassing security debacle.

I have many questions myself about how the shooter was able to get his weapons through in the first place and accessing the rooftop undetected.

With the various LE agencies that were all at the rally, I wonder if there were delays in radio communication with the command center due to different tactical radio channels used by the LE agencies?

For instance local LE's on one channel, the rooftop swat team on another channel, and the SS security detail team on another channel.

 

[Leopard]

Wondering if he was active on Reddit. Most of the communities there are viewable even without an account.

 

[fred&edna]

Who is responsible for requesting the security detail? Can they ask for more or request specific protections? I have never planned such a huge and possibly heated event so I am truly curious . I know some venues have requirements you have to meet.... But ultimately it is the event itself that is responsible .

How does the Secret Service "protect" the president?​

In order to maintain a safe environment for the president and other protectees, the Secret Service calls upon other federal, state and local agencies to assist on a daily basis. The Secret Service Uniformed Division, the Metropolitan Police Department, and the U.S. Park Police patrol the streets and parks nearby the White House. The Secret Service regularly consults with experts from other agencies in utilizing the most advanced security techniques. The military supports the Secret Service through the use of Explosive Ordnance Disposal teams and communications resources. When the president travels, an advance team of Secret Service agents works with the host city, state and local law enforcement, as well as public safety officials, to jointly implement the necessary security measures.

Frequently Asked Questions About Us

The United States Secret Service, one of the nation's oldest federal investigative law enforcement agencies, was founded in 1865 as a branch of the U.S. Treasury Department.

www.secretservice.gov

In reading the above the US SS works WITH other agencies, they don't hand protection over to the other agencies. DJT was the "target", and another few inches and DJT would likely not be alive.

Sadly, because the former president wasn't protected by the US SS (Their PRIMARY job) DJT and others were injured or killed.

The US SS leadership of coordinating WITH other agencies failed.

jmo

 

[Seattle1]

I wasn’t saying buying Ammon or a rifle is wrong or unusual. He was seen carrying a rifle on the grounds. Isn’t that unusual?

Of course it would be highly suspect! I've also read that TC was seen near the magnetometers acting nervous but it doesn't follow that he'd be walking around grounds carrying an AR slung over his shoulder -- especially not near the clearance entrance. Did TC arrive early and have the rifle stashed near a building? Typically, once grounds are swept, the venue security is locked down tight until the gates are opened for the public. But I guess things was typical on Saturday in Butler, PA for this event. JMO

 

[formerlyme]

How does the Secret Service "protect" the president?​

In order to maintain a safe environment for the president and other protectees, the Secret Service calls upon other federal, state and local agencies to assist on a daily basis. The Secret Service Uniformed Division, the Metropolitan Police Department, and the U.S. Park Police patrol the streets and parks nearby the White House. The Secret Service regularly consults with experts from other agencies in utilizing the most advanced security techniques. The military supports the Secret Service through the use of Explosive Ordnance Disposal teams and communications resources. When the president travels, an advance team of Secret Service agents works with the host city, state and local law enforcement, as well as public safety officials, to jointly implement the necessary security measures.

Frequently Asked Questions About Us

The United States Secret Service, one of the nation's oldest federal investigative law enforcement agencies, was founded in 1865 as a branch of the U.S. Treasury Department.

www.secretservice.gov

In reading the above the US SS works WITH other agencies, they don't hand protection over to the other agencies. DJT was the "target", and another few inches and DJT would likely not be alive.

Sadly, because the former president wasn't protected by the US SS (Their PRIMARY job) DJT and others were injured or killed.

The US SS leadership of coordinating WITH other agencies failed.

jmo

So , effectively the protectant has a team of Secret Service which are his core protection but they rely on local authorities for the extra protection, so this is normal practice and Secret Service did its job. And the lesson learned is that the practice needs improvement and change. In my opinion. Current state of affairs would benefit from a larger presence.

 

[Leopard]

I wasn’t saying buying Ammon or a rifle is wrong or unusual. He was seen carrying a rifle on the grounds. Isn’t that unusual?

During an event like this, it would absolutely be noteworthy. Just because guns are common in PA doesn't mean it's regular to open carry something that size in a public place.

 

[vls12345]

You don't need to be a national security specialist to see the potential danger that existed.

RSBM.

So true. Heck, all they needed to do was watch some Gerard Butler movies and they would have been better prepared.

Given that so many bystanders knew and pointed out that there was an issue, it was an epic fail on security's part.

Imo.

 

[Chimera]

"... There is not just one entity responsible; the Secret Service plays a key role in protecting, in this case, former President Trump, but they don't act alone. The Secret Service receives support from local police departments."

"There is an immediate ring around Trump, which is manned by the Secret Service, but then, there is a secondary ring further out, which is manned largely by local and state police. The assailant was in that secondary ring."
bbm

Armed Butler Township officer encountered Trump rally shooter on roof, sheriff says

Butler County Sheriff Michael Slupe confirmed that an armed municipal officer encountered shooter Thomas Crooks before he fired shots from a rooftop building.

www.cbsnews.com

Red emphasis mine.
Thanks for linking this !

Going to ask this hypothetical question; aimed at the local and state police, and the secret service :
Did the perp have a rifle in his hands or possibly disassembled and concealed under his shirt ( Prob. not-- too difficult to hide, imo ) ?
If not -- did TC hide it in a tree besides the large building from which he fired ?
And if so -- why didn't they find it earlier, when doing their security sweep ?
Just so many missed opportunities.
Omo.

 

[formerlyme]

I am sure security was active on their communication devices as the bystanders were yelling, I doubt they were clueless. That would all be available to the investigation correct?