PA - Panera sued by parents after daughter Sarah Katz, 21, died of cardiac arrest after drinking Charged Lemonade, 2022 - Philadelphia, 23 Oct 2023

[whiterhino]

Canned or Bottled Coffee Drinks.

snipped for focus @whiterhino You are entirely welcome.

Wow, "caffeine, ginseng, taurine and guarana plus vitamins therefore an energy drink."
Yes, seems ^this^ one of your favorites would be in a different FDA classication (re limiting caffeine content & specifying mg's of caffeine) than the "charged lemonade" bevy identified in wrongful death lawsuit. jmo

Your ^list^ of ingredients sounds like a lotta oomph, w caffeine & gaurana being stimulants, but IDK if the other ingredients - ginseng, taurine, vitamins - are actually stimulants. Again, jmo.

Does your can specify mg's of caffeine per serving or per can?
Is a link to the can's label w "Nutrition Facts" handy?

It contains 138mg of caffeine (about 2 large cups of coffee). The nutrition info can be found here (cannot find another source sry):

Amazon.ca

It's interesting, the different standards and rules for contained, sealed beverages and legal amount of caffeine etc. I've heard of body builders using stimulants, caffeine and overloading themselves. It doesn't take much, the heart is fragile.

 

[whiterhino]

I took some photos at the Panera location where I am this morning.

This is an older, smaller Panera. The newer or larger locations have a larger area for the drink station. These dispensers are closer together than most locations because this location is very small.

I see, ty! It's kind of like the drink area in 7-11. Or McDs and Wendys. Which is fine for a drink station until you factor in the caffeine and "plant based energy". I got the wrong size soda with my DD last night, it was half a liter of diet coke. The same serving as the lemonade!

Personally, I think the signage could be bigger and bolder. It's somewhat confusing to me as the lemonade sign on the right is where my eye goes immediately. If I ordered a lemonade and it was self serve, I'd go to that dispenser first.

Then again that is me and I'm unfamiliar. Which makes me wonder what kind of previous experience this customer had with Panera, if they knew what they were doing. (not victim blaming whatsoever I just realized it could be misconstrued). I'm just saying, I'd likely go to the wrong dispenser if they're all set like this one.

 

[IceIce9]

Panera has reduced the amount of caffeine and sugar in their Charged lemonades. I’ve been to three Panera locations this week and all have the reduced caffeine and sugar versions.

Now the amount of caffeine is less than coffee.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Panera Bread’s Charged Lemonade blamed for a second death, lawsuit alleges

Dennis Brown, 46, drank three of the highly caffeinated beverages before suffering a cardiac arrest in October, according to the suit.

www.nbcnews.com

Panera Bread’s highly caffeinated Charged Lemonade is now blamed for a second death, according to a lawsuit filed Monday.

Dennis Brown, of Fleming Island, Florida, drank three Charged Lemonades from a local Panera on Oct. 9 and then suffered a fatal cardiac arrest on his way home, the suit says.

Brown, 46, had an unspecified chromosomal deficiency disorder, a developmental delay and a mild intellectual disability. He lived independently, frequently stopping at Panera after his shifts at a supermarket, the legal complaint says. Because he had high blood pressure, he did not consume energy drinks, it adds...

 

[Dre]

Panera Bread’s Charged Lemonade blamed for a second death, lawsuit alleges

Dennis Brown, 46, drank three of the highly caffeinated beverages before suffering a cardiac arrest in October, according to the suit.

www.nbcnews.com

Panera Bread’s highly caffeinated Charged Lemonade is now blamed for a second death, according to a lawsuit filed Monday.

Dennis Brown, of Fleming Island, Florida, drank three Charged Lemonades from a local Panera on Oct. 9 and then suffered a fatal cardiac arrest on his way home, the suit says.

Brown, 46, had an unspecified chromosomal deficiency disorder, a developmental delay and a mild intellectual disability. He lived independently, frequently stopping at Panera after his shifts at a supermarket, the legal complaint says. Because he had high blood pressure, he did not consume energy drinks, it adds...

YIKES!!! More than one death?!

I would call for Panera to cut the caffeine content, especially if you can get refills!

So sad for these folks’ families! I think in general people need to be weary of caffeine and discuss it, as a barista I’ve had many ignorant customers that had no idea caffeine was hard on your heart.

I’ve had to switch to half-caf espressos since i make myself coffees all day.. caffeine is a drug!
I had to quit for awhile 10 years ago to get to a healthy weight again!

I keep thinking about Long Island iced teas, the misnomer and insane amt of alcohol..

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

I have Long QT Syndrome. Willing to answer any questions.

 

[whiterhino]

YIKES!!! More than one death?!

I would call for Panera to cut the caffeine content, especially if you can get refills!

So sad for these folks’ families! I think in general people need to be weary of caffeine and discuss it, as a barista I’ve had many ignorant customers that had no idea caffeine was hard on your heart.

I’ve had to switch to half-caf espressos since i make myself coffees all day.. caffeine is a drug!
I had to quit for awhile 10 years ago to get to a healthy weight again!

I keep thinking about Long Island iced teas, the misnomer and insane amt of alcohol..

Another case??

It's about the serving size too. The serving size for the Panera lemonade combined with the sugar and caffeine is too much. It's comparable to a Monster energy but the name is deceptive. All IMO.

I agree, Long Island Iced Tea is also deceptive and when made properly, has about 6 kinds of liquor, 7 shots total. It's a sneaky drink IME. I drink black tea all day long, it's a habit. It's strange tho, I've never had palpitations from tea but a large Diet Pepsi made my heart go crazy. I am prone to tachycardia due to a condition so I can only imagine what it would be like to experience something worse.

 

[whiterhino]

I have Long QT Syndrome. Willing to answer any questions.

First, I love your signature, it makes me laugh when I see it lol!

Do you experience palpitations, tachycardia or atrial fibrillation? Do you avoid caffeine and/or sugar? Does medication help if you're experiencing symptoms?

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

First, I love your signature, it makes me laugh when I see it lol!

Do you experience palpitations, tachycardia or atrial fibrillation? Do you avoid caffeine and/or sugar? Does medication help if you're experiencing symptoms?

Glad I can make you laugh!

I do not avoid caffeine or sugar. I drink coffee with sugar every day. When I was originally diagnosed (and still to this day), the only medication I was prescribed was Metoprolol which is a beta blocker meant to keep BP low. They put an AICD in my chest so I don't really get any actual heart symptoms anymore. I originally kept having syncopal episodes due to atrial fibrillation. It happened to me at work one time and someone called an ambulance. While I was in the hospital they were doing a cardiac catheterization to see what was wrong with my heart and I had an episode while on the table. Went into cardiac arrest like 8 times and they kept bringing me back with paddles/defibrillator. When I woke up after the last defib, I was in a hospital room and was diagnosed with LQTS and advised they had put a implanted defib in me.

If my LQTS kicks in, the AICD is supposed to just shock me back to a normal rhythm. Ever since they put it in me I have not had an issue nor has it ever had to shock me back. I have a ton of anxiety about this entire thing and constantly being worried but I'm here!

ETA: I see she had Type 1 LQTS. I have Type 2.
Types

Long QT syndrome type 1 (LQT1)

In LQT1, the potassium ion channels in the heart do not work properly, disrupting the heart’s electrical activity. Emotional stress or physical exercise, particularly swimming, can trigger arrhythmias (abnormal heartbeat) in people with LQT1.

Torsades de pointes (French for ‘twisting of the points), the most dangerous type of ventricular tachycardia, occurs more often in people with LQT1. Although people with this condition may have more episodes of arrhythmia, the episodes usually stop on their own, without treatment. That means the episodes are less likely to be fatal.

Long QT syndrome type 2 (LQT2)

LQT2 results from insufficient potassium ion activity in the heart. This deficiency prevents proper electrical function in the heart and leads to arrhythmia (abnormal heart rhythm).

Emotional stress, surprise, and startling can cause arrhythmias in people with LQT2. A common trigger is sudden, loud noises such as alarm clocks or car horns

 

[whiterhino]

Glad I can make you laugh!

I do not avoid caffeine or sugar. I drink coffee with sugar every day. When I was originally diagnosed (and still to this day), the only medication I was prescribed was Metoprolol which is a beta blocker meant to keep BP low. They put an AICD in my chest so I don't really get any actual heart symptoms anymore. I originally kept having syncopal episodes due to atrial fibrillation. It happened to me at work one time and someone called an ambulance. While I was in the hospital they were doing a cardiac catheterization to see what was wrong with my heart and I had an episode while on the table. Went into cardiac arrest like 8 times and they kept bringing me back with paddles/defibrillator. When I woke up after the last defib, I was in a hospital room and was diagnosed with LQTS and advised they had put a implanted defib in me.

If my LQTS kicks in, the AICD is supposed to just shock me back to a normal rhythm. Ever since they put it in me I have not had an issue nor has it ever had to shock me back. I have a ton of anxiety about this entire thing and constantly being worried but I'm here!

ETA: I see she had Type 1 LQTS. I have Type 2.
Types

Wish I had a banana stand!

Interesting! A family member takes Metoprolol and I take Bisoprolol. We both have atrial fibrillation, arrhythmia and tachycardia. I've also experienced syncope a few times, that's always scary.

I wonder how much lemonade Sarah had before she experienced negative effects? Or maybe that doesn't make a difference?

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

Wish I had a banana stand!

Interesting! A family member takes Metoprolol and I take Bisoprolol. We both have atrial fibrillation, arrhythmia and tachycardia. I've also experienced syncope a few times, that's always scary.

I wonder how much lemonade Sarah had before she experienced negative effects? Or maybe that doesn't make a difference?

I'm not sure. My doctor had not said anything to me about caffeine. Actually, when I was in the hospital, they would use your doctor's orders to determine what you were and weren't allowed to order for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I would request coffee every day and I got it with no problem. I remember my ICU roommate asking for coffee and being told their doctor has orders in that they aren't allowed to have caffeine, so I don't think it was an issue for me (and that's like immediately following surgery to implant the device).

Syncope was definitely the scariest part of it. I remember one time I fainted walking out of Little Caesar's and I smacked my head on the edge of a brick. Another time I could feel myself getting lightheaded so I sat down on the stairs in my apartment stairwell. Thought I was safe since I was able to get off my feet for a moment. When I came to I was at the bottom of both sets of stairs and my glasses were smashed into 10 pieces. I already had generalized anxiety disorder and OCD and this did not make those any easier, plus added PTSD to the list.

 

[PrairieWind]

I drink lots of coffee. But I don't understand the appeal of these drinks. Not only the ridiculous amount of caffeine, but look at how much sugar is in these drinks. Holy cow!

 

[IceIce9]

YIKES!!! More than one death?!

I would call for Panera to cut the caffeine content, especially if you can get refills!

So sad for these folks’ families! I think in general people need to be weary of caffeine and discuss it, as a barista I’ve had many ignorant customers that had no idea caffeine was hard on your heart.

I’ve had to switch to half-caf espressos since i make myself coffees all day.. caffeine is a drug!
I had to quit for awhile 10 years ago to get to a healthy weight again!

I keep thinking about Long Island iced teas, the misnomer and insane amt of alcohol..

a

Another case??

It's about the serving size too. The serving size for the Panera lemonade combined with the sugar and caffeine is too much. It's comparable to a Monster energy but the name is deceptive. All IMO.

I agree, Long Island Iced Tea is also deceptive and when made properly, has about 6 kinds of liquor, 7 shots total. It's a sneaky drink IME. I drink black tea all day long, it's a habit. It's strange tho, I've never had palpitations from tea but a large Diet Pepsi made my heart go crazy. I am prone to tachycardia due to a condition so I can only imagine what it would be like to experience something worse.

Panera has already reduced the amount of caffeine in these drinks. I get one nearly every day and the amount of caffeine has been greatly reduced.

Red Bull is still on the market and it has allegedly contributed to ten or more deaths.

Unpopular opinion, but I am a fan of personal responsibility. The amount of caffeine posted or labeled don’t drink it if you are sensitive to caffeine. Just the same as a person who is allergic to shellfish or peanuts or chocolate would be report to eat shellfish or peanuts or chocolate. But I don’t want to see peanuts, shellfish, or chocolate taken off the market. JMO

 

[PrairieWind]

a
Panera has already reduced the amount of caffeine in these drinks. I get one nearly every day and the amount of caffeine has been greatly reduced.

Red Bull is still on the market and it has allegedly contributed to ten or more deaths.

<modsnip>

I think most of us here are in the personal responsibility camp. I just wonder if these drinks are labelled well enough so that a customer knows what he/she is getting.

 

[LordMo]

I wonder if the "Free refills" part makes a kind of psychological error in judgment, where someone who normally wouldn't drink more than one energy drink or a few cups of coffee a day subconsciously bargains in their mind "well, I already paid for the cup, it wouldn't hurt to maximize my value" and BAM equivalent of 12 cups of coffee in one sitting.

Like, even if I'm not thirsty I'll grab a free refill of my drink before I leave just because it's there. I could see myself having a day where I'm not thinking things through and forget/don't realize in the first place just how caffeinated these things are.

 

[IceIce9]

I think most of us here are in the personal responsibility camp. I just wonder if these drinks are labelled well enough so that a customer knows what he/she is getting.

When you click on “beverage” on the Panera app (any beverage even soda, water, etc) you get a popup warning. There are signs in the stores and on the menu.

Short of having a people greeter at the door to inform every customer I don’t know what other warning you need?

 

[IceIce9]

I wonder if the "Free refills" part makes a kind of psychological error in judgment, where someone who normally wouldn't drink more than one energy drink or a few cups of coffee a day subconsciously bargains in their mind "well, I already paid for the cup, it wouldn't hurt to maximize my value" and BAM equivalent of 12 cups of coffee in one sitting.

Like, even if I'm not thirsty I'll grab a free refill of my drink before I leave just because it's there. I could see myself having a day where I'm not thinking things through and forget/don't realize in the first place just how caffeinated these things are.

Coffee is free refills too and know when I spend a morning working on my laptop at Panera I see other people refilling their coffee cups all morning long.

Probably the next thing is to ban self serve coffee refills and make customers pay for each cup

 

[ch_13]

When you click on “beverage” on the Panera app (any beverage even soda, water, etc) you get a popup warning. There are signs in the stores and on the menu.

Short of having a people greeter at the door to inform every customer I don’t know what other warning you need?

I think a large part of the problem is that we think we know what's in lemonade and don't expect to find caffeine or other stimulants in it. Until this lawsuit, I certainly had no idea that caffeinated lemonade was a thing. The name "Charged Lemonade" doesn't make me think it has an additive, it just sounds like typical marketing-speak.

And even if there's signage up, people may not pay a whole lot of attention to it. Especially with familiar things, how many of us really read all the fine print (or medium-size print) that's all around us? I can say that I close any pop-up that appears on my screen automatically without reading it. Just too many attempts to upsell or get my email or tell me I need to turn off .

I agree though. I don't know what Panera can do to make people aware that their lemonade is really an energy drink.

 

[Dre]

I think since they have already lowered the caffeine content and label it, how much more can they even do?
I definitely read “charged” as caffeinated

 

[whiterhino]

I'm not sure. My doctor had not said anything to me about caffeine. Actually, when I was in the hospital, they would use your doctor's orders to determine what you were and weren't allowed to order for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I would request coffee every day and I got it with no problem. I remember my ICU roommate asking for coffee and being told their doctor has orders in that they aren't allowed to have caffeine, so I don't think it was an issue for me (and that's like immediately following surgery to implant the device).

Syncope was definitely the scariest part of it. I remember one time I fainted walking out of Little Caesar's and I smacked my head on the edge of a brick. Another time I could feel myself getting lightheaded so I sat down on the stairs in my apartment stairwell. Thought I was safe since I was able to get off my feet for a moment. When I came to I was at the bottom of both sets of stairs and my glasses were smashed into 10 pieces. I already had generalized anxiety disorder and OCD and this did not make those any easier, plus added PTSD to the list.

Oh my gosh! I wasn't allowed to have coffee in hospital bc of my palpitations. Tea as well! It was so upsetting lol. They were not taking any chances I guess (liability).

I also have a large scar on my forehead from fainting. I came out of a shop, went to use a payphone (yes I am that old lol) and fainted, right on my face. When I came to, there was blood all over my jacket and no one in sight. It was in the evening and by the time I came to the store had closed. I guess no one saw me in the parking lot? I was 15 at the time, no one knew what had happened, even me! It's happened a few times since. I once "woke up" in my kitchen on the floor. I had fallen onto our garbage can, it fell over and I came to in a pile of trash

It's incredibly distressing to say the least! FWIW I have never been advised against caffeine, alcohol or sugar and I have RAE.

The victim in this case is deceased. It's the parents who are suing, not the victim. Personal responsibility? Sarah died. If Panera is not at fault then why change their menu items or the caffeine content in the beverage Sarah drank that day? To me, this indicates some level of responsibility which I believe could give the parents more grounds to sue if Panera is acting out of guilt. JMO.