Identified! PA - Philadelphia - 'Boy in the Box' - 4UMPA - Feb'57 #3 - Joseph Augustus Zarelli

[Friday Fan]

If he was adopted legally there would be a paper trail. This leads me to think they sold him.

Informal adoption is also an option. (Family member etc) Paper trail may be poor or non-existent.
Institutionalization/foster home is also an option. (Yes, there would be records at the time of placement, but those records may be hard to find or may no longer exist)

 

[bears10]

<modsnip - quoted post and response to it removed>

In regards to baked beans, I guess M said that Joseph ate and subsequently vomited up baked beans, and then he was beaten to death for throwing up? I think? And apparently it was a detail that was withheld from the public. I can't find a source where LE corroborates that baked beans were in his stomach though. And if he threw them up, they may not have even been in his stomach. If the account is even true. I think (hope) at this point, LE knows whether or not Ms account is factual.

 

[bears10]

Really feel like the focus should be on the goings on in Martha's neighborhood at the time. If LEO wanted us to discuss the names of the biological parent they would of told us.

They went to her neighborhood in the past and neighbors didn't know of any boy living in the house. Considering how dedicated some of the detectives were to this case, I'd think they did their best to look into that neighborhood. Sadly, most of the adults from that time period are probably dead.

 

[IDK]

Based on other documents, I think the spelling variation is -ella vs. -illa vs. ilia MOO

Could be, I’m just addressing what LE actually said at the press conference. And they didn’t specify it was the surname that had a discrepancy.

 

[steff13]

I actually think you're correct. I think she did accuse them of SA her. Regardless if her version of events is accurate, she pretty clearly had trauma.

In regards to baked beans, I guess M said that Joseph ate and subsequently vomited up baked beans, and then he was beaten to death for throwing up? I think? And apparently it was a detail that was withheld from the public. I can't find a source where LE corroborates that baked beans were in his stomach though. And if he threw them up, they may not have even been in his stomach. If the account is even true. I think (hope) at this point, LE knows whether or not Ms account is factual.

To the contrary, no food was found in his gastrointestinal tract. They estimated that he hadn't eaten in at least two or three hours prior to his death.

 

[steff13]

Could be, I’m just addressing what LE actually said at the press conference. And they didn’t specify it was the surname that had a discrepancy.

It could have been something like the dad's given name was John and he went by Jack, and Jack was on the BC. I think it's unlikely that we will know unless the family comes out with the information. Personally I don't think the birth family had anything to do with it.

 

[bears10]

To the contrary, no food was found in his gastrointestinal tract. They estimated that he hadn't eaten in at least two or three hours prior to his death.

Wonder why and how that baked bean theory grew legs. Because even as I was typing my comment, I realized that if he threw up, they wouldn't be in his stomach anyway. So why did the baked beans thing make her account legit to some? I feel like im missing or forgetting something. Because other than the baked beans, everything else from her account was reported on in the media afaik.

 

[ferretnurse]

I actually think you're correct. I think she did accuse them of SA her. Regardless if her version of events is accurate, she pretty clearly had trauma.

In regards to baked beans, I guess M said that Joseph ate and subsequently vomited up baked beans, and then he was beaten to death for throwing up? I think? And apparently it was a detail that was withheld from the public. I can't find a source where LE corroborates that baked beans were in his stomach though. And if he threw them up, they may not have even been in his stomach. If the account is even true. I think (hope) at this point, LE knows whether or not Ms account is factual.

There seems to be some discrepancy there. Some sources say nothing in the stomach/hadn't eaten in 2-3 hours before death. The "America's Unknown Child" site states there was an unidentified brown substance in his esophagus. Since there's no autopsy report available, it's hard to tell which source is correct.

 

[bears10]

There seems to be some discrepancy there. Some sources say nothing in the stomach/hadn't eaten in 2-3 hours before death. The "America's Unknown Child" site states there was an unidentified brown substance in his esophagus. Since there's no autopsy report available, it's hard to tell which source is correct.

Either way, that doesn't confirm he ate baked beans.

 

[Daphne1972]

PA does not release their birth certificates for 100 years!

We are relying on law enforcement for info about JAZ regarding his vital stats, birthdate, birth certificate etc.

I have my BC from 1956 (I was born PA) that tells what was required (and possibly not required?) on the form.

Aha!

 

[familymem]

I understand the frustration LE must feel about not having access to the confessions given to therapists or priests, but I believe that there's a very good reason they shouldn't.

There is. Therapist and Priests to some extent, are health care professionals. If you knew that either was free to share your confidences, you wouldn't go to them and then they couldn't help anyone. I believe in the case of Therapist if they know their patient is a threat to themselves or others they have to report. But in a case like this, where no one was in danger, that doctor patient privilege is in play.

 

[steff13]

There seems to be some discrepancy there. Some sources say nothing in the stomach/hadn't eaten in 2-3 hours before death. The "America's Unknown Child" site states there was an unidentified brown substance in his esophagus. Since there's no autopsy report available, it's hard to tell which source is correct.

Right, and they thought it was consistent with having vomited. But that doesn't prove that he ate baked beans. I feel like vomiting might be par for the course if you're being beaten to death.

I don't know, that just doesn't ring true to me because of the nature of vomiting. If he ate the baked beans and then threw them up it's unlikely that every trace of baked beans would have been gone from his stomach or gastrointestinal tract. If he ate them and then threw them up so immediately that they were not in his gastrointest intestinal tract, wouldn't they have still been partially intact? I think if the substance even is vomit.

 

[bears10]

My husband was born in the 60s. His mom was very abusive (pushing down the stairs, making him eat his own vomit, etc). But he was always well groomed and hygenic. I know LE said Joseph was well groomed and appeared to be taken care of. The reason I bring this up is because sometimes I think about how badly things could have gone if my mother in law just took it too far one time. He could have been Joseph.

Teachers questioned my husband once or twice, but dropped it once he lied and said his injuries were from sports, even though they clearly weren't. However, none of his family ever stepped in, despite how close knit they were. Still to this day, it infuriates me how everyone just brushes it under the rug and acts like nothing happened. I know for sure no one said anything back then when it was happening. I'm from a different generation where this would NOT fly, so it's mind boggling to me. But it proves to me there was a cruel reality where abuse was excused and not talked about.

 

[ferretnurse]

I actually think you're correct. I think she did accuse them of SA her. Regardless if her version of events is accurate, she pretty clearly had trauma.

In regards to baked beans, I guess M said that Joseph ate and subsequently vomited up baked beans, and then he was beaten to death for throwing up? I think? And apparently it was a detail that was withheld from the public. I can't find a source where LE corroborates that baked beans were in his stomach though. And if he threw them up, they may not have even been in his stomach. If the account is even true. I think (hope) at this point, LE knows whether or not Ms account is factual.

There seems to be some discrepancy there. Some sources say nothing in the stomach/hadn't eaten in 2-3 hours before death. The "America's Unknown Child" site states there was an unidentified brown substance in his esophagus. Since there's no autopsy report available, it's hard to tell which source is correct.

Right, and they thought it was consistent with having vomited. But that doesn't prove that he ate baked beans. I feel like vomiting might be par for the course if you're being beaten to death.

I don't know, that just doesn't ring true to me because of the nature of vomiting. If he ate the baked beans and then threw them up it's unlikely that every trace of baked beans would have been gone from his stomach or gastrointestinal tract. If he ate them and then threw them up so immediately that they were not in his gastrointest intestinal tract, wouldn't they have still been partially intact? I think if the substance even is vomit.

Honestly, without reading the actual report, it's hard to tell what the truth is. Neither report discusses what is found in the small intestine. Regardless, whether the general public believe M's story or not, I believe that she experienced some form of trauma in her childhood.

I think LE has a pretty good idea about who did what to Joseph, but can't prove it.

 

[non_ducor_duco_]

Did anyone notice the update to the Newsweek article? It initially said Philadelphia PD would be releasing a photo of Joseph later Thursday and now says “The Philadelphia Police Department shared a photo of Zarelli with Newsweek and said individuals who believe they may have information related to the case should contact the department's Homicide Division.”

 

[Milly1357]

Did anyone notice the update to the Newsweek article? It initially said Philadelphia PD would be releasing a photo of Joseph later Thursday and now says “The Philadelphia Police Department shared a photo of Zarelli with Newsweek and said individuals who believe they may have information related to the case should contact the department's Homicide Division.”

I think they meant the constructed photo of him

 

[Alleykins]

Did anyone notice the update to the Newsweek article? It initially said Philadelphia PD would be releasing a photo of Joseph later Thursday and now says “The Philadelphia Police Department shared a photo of Zarelli with Newsweek and said individuals who believe they may have information related to the case should contact the department's Homicide Division.”

I posted that Newsweek article link, I think on the previous thread as it came out on the day his ID was announced.
I have checked every day since, looking for that photo. The only one I've seen is his pm reconstruction, which isn't new, so I'm wondering if Newsweek is mistaking that photo for an actual photo of him. News outlets might not know the difference if they haven't been following the case. Did they actually publish a real photo of him?

 

[steff13]

There seems to be some discrepancy there. Some sources say nothing in the stomach/hadn't eaten in 2-3 hours before death. The "America's Unknown Child" site states there was an unidentified brown substance in his esophagus. Since there's no autopsy report available, it's hard to tell which source is correct.

Honestly, without reading the actual report, it's hard to tell what the truth is. Neither report discusses what is found in the small intestine. Regardless, whether the general public believe M's story or not, I believe that she experienced some form of trauma in her childhood.

I think LE has a pretty good idea about who did what to Joseph, but can't prove it.

We haven't seen the report, but it says they examined the gastrointestinal system, which I believe includes the small intestine.

 

[csa29]

I know i’m going back on not harping on M comment, but is it possible her mother was invested in this case for another reason(maybe volunteered with abused children) and she developed false memories because of it?

I will say i have not seen M photos when she was younger, but as an older lady, she did seem like she could be confused for another gender when wearing a hat and not hearing/seeing her clearly. jmo

 

[non_ducor_duco_]

I posted that Newsweek article link, I think on the previous thread as it came out on the day his ID was announced.
I have checked every day since, looking for that photo. The only one I've seen is his pm reconstruction, which isn't new, so I'm wondering if Newsweek is mistaking that photo for an actual photo of him. News outlets might not know the difference if they haven't been following the case. Did they actually publish a real photo of him?

They did not. While I acknowledge that the wording is not 100% clear, to me it sounds like they were shown a photo of him in life. MOO.