PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #15

[J. J. in Phila]

I don't think this violates policy, but there is a Twitter source that claims that the son of former PSU Board member Karen Peetz said that Paterno "had to," in the words of the Tweeter, be involved in RFG's disappearance. It is confirmed by Scott Paterno, Joe's son and a lawyer, that the comment was made. https://twitter.com/ScottPaterno?ref_src=twsrc^tfw

Again, I have not seen a connection and Paterno was at football practice in the afternoon of 4/15/05.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I would also note that I expect additional information regarding the 1998 investigation to come out either in the trial or contemporaneous with it.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

It has been determined that suicide can have a genetic component. https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/10/111007113941.htm

LE does have RFG's DNA. They could check against the chromosomes that could show a genetic propensity for suicide,

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Just a thought, here. I am writing this now on my work laptop, which is far more convenient than the large desktop in my home office. If I were retiring, I would need to get rid of a lot of personal data, as the computer has all the passwords for accessing websites that I use in my regular life. This laptop is used daily for my work but also for lots of random personal stuff. There's nothing embarrassing to me here, but no one else needs to know I follow Websleuths and a local sports blog and order romance novels from Amazon.I would need to get rid of that personal data before turning it in. Most of the people I know use their laptops the same way, especially if they travel, even short distances, for work, as Ray would have done. My guess is that Ray was not very sophisticated about how computers work or how to go about getting his personal stuff off his laptop. He was way too smart to put anything illegal or too embarrassing there; it would have been a lot easier to buy his own laptop for those purposes. It's far more likely that he was murdered and his killer wanted to be sure nothing was on that laptop (such as an appointment schedule) that might point to him or her.

 

[Fromthedeepestjungle]

It has been determined that suicide can have a genetic component. https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/10/111007113941.htm

LE does have RFG's DNA. They could check against the chromosomes that could show a genetic propensity for suicide,

I be trying to see what would it take to do suicide- would spin the cylinder be one ---pills------ jump off building ------ cut one's neck---- by LE---- maybe a female-- The list can go on and on -----naa at one time after not knowing to much about this and then some of the females came out I had the thought maybe a small group of women took him down or just maybe one because none match up for what was said if I can blame the writer or writer's

 

[Fromthedeepestjungle]

what is more sad about this is it was very tight lipped and no one talks about it and it seems everyone is happy here in the valley i really think I should move on but something keeps bringing me back here to look and as to that other site it must be like a magnet that pulls me here

 

[J. J. in Phila]

First, it is good to see you post.

Just a thought, here. I am writing this now on my work laptop, which is far more convenient than the large desktop in my home office. If I were retiring, I would need to get rid of a lot of personal data, as the computer has all the passwords for accessing websites that I use in my regular life. This laptop is used daily for my work but also for lots of random personal stuff. There's nothing embarrassing to me here, but no one else needs to know I follow Websleuths and a local sports blog and order romance novels from Amazon.I would need to get rid of that personal data before turning it in. Most of the people I know use their laptops the same way, especially if they travel, even short distances, for work, as Ray would have done. My guess is that Ray was not very sophisticated about how computers work or how to go about getting his personal stuff off his laptop. He was way too smart to put anything illegal or too embarrassing there; it would have been a lot easier to buy his own laptop for those purposes. It's far more likely that he was murdered and his killer wanted to be sure nothing was on that laptop (such as an appointment schedule) that might point to him or her.

To strengthen that a bit, RFG used the laptop as a home computer, so he could have had personal stuff that he didn't want to "share" with anyone. I wouldn't blame him.

To weaken that a bit, how would any killer know that RFG had that data only on the laptop? If there was something that someone else wanted to go away, how could person be sure it was not also on his home desktop or office computer, on some removable medium, on the Internet someplace, or printed out?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

what is more sad about this is it was very tight lipped and no one talks about it and it seems everyone is happy here in the valley i really think I should move on but something keeps bringing me back here to look and as to that other site it must be like a magnet that pulls me here

As I said, I think more will come out when the PSU 3 case goes to court. I have heard that some of the people that know may come forward publicly, at that point.

 

[Trackergd]

Just a thought, here. I am writing this now on my work laptop, which is far more convenient than the large desktop in my home office. If I were retiring, I would need to get rid of a lot of personal data, as the computer has all the passwords for accessing websites that I use in my regular life. This laptop is used daily for my work but also for lots of random personal stuff. There's nothing embarrassing to me here, but no one else needs to know I follow Websleuths and a local sports blog and order romance novels from Amazon.I would need to get rid of that personal data before turning it in. Most of the people I know use their laptops the same way, especially if they travel, even short distances, for work, as Ray would have done. My guess is that Ray was not very sophisticated about how computers work or how to go about getting his personal stuff off his laptop. He was way too smart to put anything illegal or too embarrassing there; it would have been a lot easier to buy his own laptop for those purposes. It's far more likely that he was murdered and his killer wanted to be sure nothing was on that laptop (such as an appointment schedule) that might point to him or her.

That "may" be a reasonable scenario. I just can't see RG destroying county property just to erase personal passwords and "legal" browsing history. That's why county's have IT staff. To me, it had to be something he did not even trust to an IT staff to erase. Removing the hard drive and throwing the two different parts into the river, possibly in two different spots, a long drive away from where he lived and worked goes way beyond what even a paranoid person would do. He could have handed the computer back in minus the hard drive and offer to pay for it. I am firmly in the camp there was something potentially damning on that hard drive. He may have not been computer savvy, but he did go to the trouble to google "how to fry a hard drive", so what he did not know, he went to the trouble to learn. If it was not sensitive information, why did he not go to the county IT person? No,no, no...this was more than run of the mill passwords etc... The drive to Lewisburg and disposal of the computer was a deliberate act by RG and may or may not have involved "others".

 

[Trackergd]

As I said, I think more will come out when the PSU 3 case goes to court. I have heard that some of the people that know may come forward publicly, at that point.

When is the trial scheduled?

 

[Trackergd]

I noticed Kathleen Kane's twin sister (Chief Deputy AG) has filed charges against her. That must make the AG's office a fun place to work these days...

 

[J. J. in Phila]

When is the trial scheduled?

It isn't, but the preliminaries are scheduled for July or August. I suspect it will start this year.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

That "may" be a reasonable scenario. I just can't see RG destroying county property just to erase personal passwords and "legal" browsing history. That's why county's have IT staff. To me, it had to be something he did not even trust to an IT staff to erase. Removing the hard drive and throwing the two different parts into the river, possibly in two different spots, a long drive away from where he lived and worked goes way beyond what even a paranoid person would do. He could have handed the computer back in minus the hard drive and offer to pay for it. I am firmly in the camp there was something potentially damning on that hard drive. He may have not been computer savvy, but he did go to the trouble to google "how to fry a hard drive", so what he did not know, he went to the trouble to learn. If it was not sensitive information, why did he not go to the county IT person? No,no, no...this was more than run of the mill passwords etc... The drive to Lewisburg and disposal of the computer was a deliberate act by RG and may or may not have involved "others".

What if whatever it was was embarrassing, but not illegal? Hypothetically, maybe he visited a website like "Hot Asian Babes" (I don't even know if there is such a site) and he would be embarrassed if it came out. If the people pictured are of age, there would be nothing illegal in that, but it still could be embarrassing. I can also see situations like that of former Justice Eakin. He sent out things that were risque, but by no means illegal. RFG could have been in a similar situation.

 

[Trackergd]

What if whatever it was was embarrassing, but not illegal? Hypothetically, maybe he visited a website like "Hot Asian Babes" (I don't even know if there is such a site) and he would be embarrassed if it came out. If the people pictured are of age, there would be nothing illegal in that, but it still could be embarrassing. I can also see situations like that of former Justice Eakin. He sent out things that were risque, but by no means illegal. RFG could have been in a similar situation.

That scenario "could" be in the realm of possibility and "could" explain the deception to PF on where he was going, but then he goes missing. One does not go missing over risque website browsing, photographs or emails. Destroying the hard drive does not completely erase the evidence if the person you were sending them to or receiving them from ends up getting caught. The record of sent and received emails from that person(s) computer would be easily searchable by LE, PI or irate Wife/SO.

 

[Trackergd]

It isn't, but the preliminaries are scheduled for July or August. I suspect it will start this year.

This could be an interesting trial for a juror.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

That scenario "could" be in the realm of possibility and "could" explain the deception to PF on where he was going, but then he goes missing. One does not go missing over risque website browsing, photographs or emails. Destroying the hard drive does not completely erase the evidence if the person you were sending them to or receiving them from ends up getting caught. The record of sent and received emails from that person(s) computer would be easily searchable by LE, PI or irate Wife/SO.

LE could only trace his email if they knew the account. If that account was only accessed from the laptop, there would be no record, unless the knew the account.

I would add that I am not convinced that RFG desire to make sure the data on the laptop never saw the light of day, and his probable searches for a way to do it, that the tossing of the laptop is tied to his disappearance.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Well, a killer wouldn't know about other files on other computers. If, indeed, the laptop was part of an abduction, getting rid of it may have been part of getting rid of the body with no particular relationship to what was on the computer. The killer could have been not very bright about computers and how they work. It could also be that Ray had gone to meet with someone and used the computer as part of that encounter. I would also say that Ray's interest in wiping computers and destroying hard drives or whatever might have been a professional interest related to a case. We can speculate but we can't know.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

That "may" be a reasonable scenario. I just can't see RG destroying county property just to erase personal passwords and "legal" browsing history. That's why county's have IT staff. To me, it had to be something he did not even trust to an IT staff to erase. Removing the hard drive and throwing the two different parts into the river, possibly in two different spots, a long drive away from where he lived and worked goes way beyond what even a paranoid person would do. He could have handed the computer back in minus the hard drive and offer to pay for it. I am firmly in the camp there was something potentially damning on that hard drive. He may have not been computer savvy, but he did go to the trouble to google "how to fry a hard drive", so what he did not know, he went to the trouble to learn. If it was not sensitive information, why did he not go to the county IT person? No,no, no...this was more than run of the mill passwords etc... The drive to Lewisburg and disposal of the computer was a deliberate act by RG and may or may not have involved "others".

Hmmm. If I were going to get rid of a computer, I wouldn't throw it in the river in the same area where I was known to have visited. There are many places where one might be rid of such a thing forever without it turning up on a river bank. Gricar was smarter than that.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Hmmm. If I were going to get rid of a computer, I wouldn't throw it in the river in the same area where I was known to have visited. There are many places where one might be rid of such a thing forever without it turning up on a river bank. Gricar was smarter than that.

If he was planning to come back, there would be "any tie" in to Lewisburg.

The drive was found in an unexpected place, up river from the laptop. It really only had to soak in the water for 2-4 weeks.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Well, a killer wouldn't know about other files on other computers. If, indeed, the laptop was part of an abduction, getting rid of it may have been part of getting rid of the body with no particular relationship to what was on the computer. The killer could have been not very bright about computers and how they work. It could also be that Ray had gone to meet with someone and used the computer as part of that encounter. I would also say that Ray's interest in wiping computers and destroying hard drives or whatever might have been a professional interest related to a case. We can speculate but we can't know.

A killer wouldn't know about any files on other computers, and that is exactly point. Just about anyone that had any understanding of computers would understand that could be copies of any files, including hard copies. Anyone other than RFG could not be sure that tossing the laptop would completely destroy any possible copy of the data.

It is possible that RFG would be using the laptop at some encounter. However, if that is the case, RFG was covertly traveling 50 miles for something that had to do with data on the laptop, to encounter someone unknown to both his girlfriend and staff. That would be suspicious, if it happened.