Possibly related cases (GB4, Manorville, Bittrolff victims, & others)

[bessie]

A point I keep repeating is the high number of murder victims, particularly sex workers, are found shoeless. Naturally I don't believe all are connected, but imo there could be a connection between LISK and the Atlantic City and Daytona Beach victims. JMO

 

[FindHG]

Moses had to remove his shoes. Jesus washed people's feet. Christian churches face the East.

You're so right, and Old Testament burial rituals require unadorned coffins, so the sackcloth idea may indeed have some link to perp/s belief system, from your suggestion? Thank you for mentioning this, I would have never thought of it otherwise.

 

[Natga]

Has anyone thought maybe these girls all used the same escort "agency" for bookings?
I read somewhere that Maureen Brainard-Barnes had some guy who updated her craigslist postings. Couldn't that be an agency? Melissa Barthelemy was associated with James Bond Entertainment.
I swear I read somewhere that one of them used the agency "An Affair to Remember" (aatr).
It would probably be very useful to find a common "agency" that was used by all of them.

 

[Bre1958]

I just became aware of anything about this case after watching A&E's special The Killing Season last night. I was immediately mystified by the LISK case. I did some google research on murders in Suffolk County and came across the case of Rebecca Kosler, who went missing from Suffolk County in 2009. Her burned and dismembered body was found in Connecticut. A man named Evans Ganthier was convicted. According to the reports I read, he had tried to get rid of a tattoo she had, and also sent taunting text messages to her family after her death. I can't help but wonder if he was not connected to some of the other torso murders identified in the LISK case. Based on what I am reading, I believe there were most certainly more than one killers involved in all the bodies found in what is associated with the LISK case. It seems to me that there were probably 3 or 4, and unfortunately this area of Suffolk County was just identified by multiple killers as a remote and easily accessible dumping ground.

 

[Cedarthistle]

I have been following the West Mesa killer investigation from its beginning and the hairs on the back of my neck stood up when Denise Hill of Atlantic City specifically mentioned the "river man" who investigators later connected to states including Texas, Arizona and New Mexico. The active years of murders are eerily similar.

What an astute observation regarding the slides and burlap sacks. Could this potentially indicate someone working for state fairs//carnies as a possible suspect for both LISK, the Atlantic City "river man" and the West Mesa Bone collector?

Have you looked further into a possible connection between LISK and WMK ? Was anyone able to ID the alleged atalantic city suspect Denise Hill accused?

Awesome posts btw. Relieved to see I'm not the only one to wonder if it's within the realm of possibility they're all connected.

 

[Corpsetennant]

Cases in Lexington Ky http://www.wkyt.com/home/headlines/Private-investigator-believes-Kentucky-missing-person-cases-may-be-related-239509891.html

Looks similar to Lisk victims

 

[dmrouse420]

Has anyone looked into the vanishing women in ohio to see is there's a link? And is there anything about them on here?

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[LAbradford]

Have there been anymore recent murder victims found in or around GB since that John Bittrolf guy was convicted? He was convicted of murdering two women in Manorville (not sure if they are the two victims mentioned in the documentary) and suspected of a third, but the police say he's not suspected of being LISK. Why not? He seems like a very plausible suspect.

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[bessie]

Have there been anymore recent murder victims found in or around GB since that John Bittrolf guy was convicted? He was convicted of murdering two women in Manorville (not sure if they are the two victims mentioned in the documentary) and suspected of a third, but the police say he's not suspected of being LISK. Why not? He seems like a very plausible suspect.

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Hi, LAbradford. Here's the most recent thread for Bittrolf

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10815261

 

[FindHG]

I just became aware of anything about this case after watching A&E's special The Killing Season last night. I was immediately mystified by the LISK case. I did some google research on murders in Suffolk County and came across the case of Rebecca Kosler, who went missing from Suffolk County in 2009. Her burned and dismembered body was found in Connecticut. A man named Evans Ganthier was convicted. According to the reports I read, he had tried to get rid of a tattoo she had, and also sent taunting text messages to her family after her death. I can't help but wonder if he was not connected to some of the other torso murders identified in the LISK case. Based on what I am reading, I believe there were most certainly more than one killers involved in all the bodies found in what is associated with the LISK case. It seems to me that there were probably 3 or 4, and unfortunately this area of Suffolk County was just identified by multiple killers as a remote and easily accessible dumping ground.

:welcome: Bre1958, that sounds so similar. Thank you for sharing it. Glad you watch "The Killing Season" . Very encouraging and appreciate that you joined!

I wonder if it has come up before that other sleuthers may know of?

Has anyone looked into the vanishing women in ohio to see is there's a link? And is there anything about them on here?

:welcome5: dmrouse420, and thank you for joining and asking if anyone had linked the vanishing women to those vanishing in Ohio. I don't know, but there's a chance a sleuther may pitch in with more information.

Cases in Lexington Ky http://www.wkyt.com/home/headlines/Private-investigator-believes-Kentucky-missing-person-cases-may-be-related-239509891.html

Looks similar to Lisk victims

:welcome6: Corpsetennant, very much! Thank you for joining and bring up these cases from Lexington, KY. Again, I'm out of my league on this information, but given a minute you a sleuther may pitch in to help you.

I appreciate you're taking the time. Please, also check for threads that may be directly related as you search threads.

I have been following the West Mesa killer investigation from its beginning and the hairs on the back of my neck stood up when Denise Hill of Atlantic City specifically mentioned the "river man" who investigators later connected to states including Texas, Arizona and New Mexico. The active years of murders are eerily similar.

What an astute observation regarding the slides and burlap sacks. Could this potentially indicate someone working for state fairs//carnies as a possible suspect for both LISK, the Atlantic City "river man" and the West Mesa Bone collector?

Have you looked further into a possible connection between LISK and WMK ? Was anyone able to ID the alleged atalantic city suspect Denise Hill accused?

Awesome posts btw. Relieved to see I'm not the only one to wonder if it's within the realm of possibility they're all connected.

:welcome3: Cedarthistle, great to have you join and participate. Thank you for that, for watch the "The Killing Season" and especially for helping to think it through on Websleuths. Looking forward to more of what you think. The threads for the Wesa Mesa killer you may find of great interest as you search through the various threads on it, IIRC.

There is the MEDIA THREAD where you can post links to MSM, maps, table, graphs, lists, just info but it is not open for discussion, at the top of the page, then the discussion threads are arrayed below it:

West Mesa SK threads: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?573-West-Mesa-Serial-Murders

 

[FaviousM]

I have been following the West Mesa killer investigation from its beginning and the hairs on the back of my neck stood up when Denise Hill of Atlantic City specifically mentioned the "river man" who investigators later connected to states including Texas, Arizona and New Mexico. The active years of murders are eerily similar.

What an astute observation regarding the slides and burlap sacks. Could this potentially indicate someone working for state fairs//carnies as a possible suspect for both LISK, the Atlantic City "river man" and the West Mesa Bone collector?

Have you looked further into a possible connection between LISK and WMK ? Was anyone able to ID the alleged atalantic city suspect Denise Hill accused?

Awesome posts btw. Relieved to see I'm not the only one to wonder if it's within the realm of possibility they're all connected.

Correct me if I'm wrong on this but did someone not end up killing the WMK when he attacked them?

 

[bessie]

Has anyone looked into the vanishing women in ohio to see is there's a link? And is there anything about them on here?

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Hi, dmrouse420. Which ones? There are so many murdered and missing in Ohio. I presume you mean Chillicothe, though.

There's a Chillicothe thread in the Serial Killer forum. Speculation about a LISK connection begins with this post, or thereabout.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=11894565

 

[FLgurl]

Hi everyone. I am new to WS and found you as a result of watching the Killing Season on A&E. I have read through many of the posts and you all are very far into the details of which I am not familiar with as yet. I was following another story and something jumped out at me that I thought I would throw out here and see what you all think.
Reading through the articles re the murder of the jogger on Howard Beach, Karina Vetrano, something jumped out at me - she was sexually assulated and strangled, found face down in a marsh. While she was not a prostitute, she was very active on the internet - posting thousands of selfies on instagram and had a blog where she discussed many things - including sex.
I recall the connection to Queens and she was from Queens. A second jogger, Vanessa Marcotte, was killed in Massachusetts while visiting her parents a short time later and although her circumstances were different - she was found in a heavily wooded area, sexually assaulted, her head, and of particular interest, her feet and hands were burned there are some things they have in common; both were joggers, both lived in NYC.
My intention is not to "muddy the waters" but to ask a question....do SK's "up their game" or change their routines if their pattern of behavior is bringing LE close to identifying them?
TIA for any responses or ideas!

 

[KompanyUKeep]

The number 4 obviously plays a role in my opinion. 4 seasons, 4 women, what else could be linked to the number 4?

 

[LAbradford]

The number 4 obviously plays a role in my opinion. 4 seasons, 4 women, what else could be linked to the number 4?

The 4 elements, 4 directions (North, South, East, West).

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[hawkshaw]

Oh, gosh, we just can't seem to get away from the exotic and far fetched to solve a case that is probably as simple as the nose on your face if only you could see it.

I remember during the NYC Zodiac case they were sending detectives to the Hayden Planetarium to 'search' the stars! It was hilarious.

 

[LAbradford]

Oh, gosh, we just can't seem to get away from the exotic and far fetched to solve a case that is probably as simple as the nose on your face if only you could see it.

I remember during the NYC Zodiac case they were sending detectives to the Hayden Planetarium to 'search' the stars! It was hilarious.

I agree that most serial killers have very simple (albeit, very deranged) MOs, but the Zodiac was one who didn't. He sent the police indecipherable letters that have still not been solved to this day. Some ppl think his identity may be revealed inside of one of them. I don't think so though, he's (or was, he's most likely dead by now) obviously highly intelligent.

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[Majorj]

I find myself wondering about the number four as well and how the directional elements play into it. I may be totally reading to much into the bodies directionality. Do we have details about the direction of body placement beyond that of those in Atlantic city (which were facing east)? My brain is looking at that and saying " GB is east of Atlantic City (and the AC murders occurred chronologically prior to those in GB" so.. What I am interested in braining on is if LISK is indicating a link between 4 murders to 4 directions (N,S,E,W) by posing the bodies facing the direction of his next location of choice (Hypothesizing the Toronto cases are connected [which I presently have no evidence of] were the GB bodies facing North?)? I have not had enough time to go through crime scene data. SO I may be entirely off the rails. But, I think this needs to be investigated and shouldn't be to complicated to quash if photographs are available.

 

[FindHG]

I find myself wondering about the number four as well and how the directional elements play into it. I may be totally reading to much into the bodies directionality. Do we have details about the direction of body placement beyond that of those in Atlantic city (which were facing east)? My brain is looking at that and saying " GB is east of Atlantic City (and the AC murders occurred chronologically prior to those in GB" so.. What I am interested in braining on is if LISK is indicating a link between 4 murders to 4 directions (N,S,E,W) by posing the bodies facing the direction of his next location of choice? I have not had enough time to go through crime scene data. SO I may be entirely off the rails. But, I think this needs to be investigated.

Chilling idea, Majorj, thank you for taking the time to consider it. Looking forward to reading your posts as you brain it out.

 

[LAbradford]

I find myself wondering about the number four as well and how the directional elements play into it. I may be totally reading to much into the bodies directionality. Do we have details about the direction of body placement beyond that of those in Atlantic city (which were facing east)? My brain is looking at that and saying " GB is east of Atlantic City (and the AC murders occurred chronologically prior to those in GB" so.. What I am interested in braining on is if LISK is indicating a link between 4 murders to 4 directions (N,S,E,W) by posing the bodies facing the direction of his next location of choice (Hypothesizing the Toronto cases are connected [which I presently have no evidence of] were the GB bodies facing North?)? I have not had enough time to go through crime scene data. SO I may be entirely off the rails. But, I think this needs to be investigated and shouldn't be to complicated to quash if photographs are available.

Yes, the four bodies found in AC were facing East just like the GB4. They are calling him the Eastbound strangler.

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