Post Verdict -Working Out The Unresolved Questions

[geevee]

Geevee. I agree with you that given what had to have taken place that day, CMJA's manipulation of the crime scene was very close to being effective and is further demonstration to me of premeditation. As JM said in his closing remarks, there was no blood in the bedroom or the hallway. Given the textured pattern of the walls and the amount of blood, the handprint was probably easy for CMJA to miss. With all that transpired, she left only three small pieces of evidence at the scene. If it weren't for them, the case would have been built on circumstantial evidence and her detention most likely would have been delayed. I still believe that she would have been convicted.

Very interesting observation re: reddish tinge on the track of the shower door. The color does appear to be more concentrated closer to the camera. I recall someone else pointing our the reddish mark near the corner of the door frame. It may well be that Travis had been injured prior to the completion of the series of shower pictures. Which makes his final hour on earth even more drawn out and horrific.

I've always believed that TA was under considerable duress for more than just the time in the shower. He was known for his lists and how much he would accomplish in a day. Even CMJA talked about this in one of her interviews. We know that furniture had been moved in his house and a floor cleaner was in some stage of preparation for use. The day definitely did not go down as CMJA related.

BBM That would be me. lol

No matter how much color change I do on that photo, I can't get the red out of his legs/feet to make them the same color as any other part of his body, and with that reddishness on the porcelain and the what-looks-like-flying-blood in the other corner, he may have been injured prior. I also think the day resembled nothing like what JA testified to and he was under much duress for longer than the timestamps indicate.

 

[gcharlie]

Travis purchased his home in 2004 and was the first owner of record.

Based on the pictures of his close, the floor cleaning machine and other indications, Travis was both clean and organized. It does not make sense that these reddish areas on/near the shower door frame and track would be rust, especially in arid Arizona.

Given the crime scene and autopsy photos, there is a lot of discoloration which is not addressed in the autopsy report. Horn notes some contusions of the lower right leg and knee, but nothing in the foot or ankle area. He does not indicate whether any blunt force trauma was antemortem or postmortem.

 

[geevee]

Travis purchased his home in 2004 and was the first owner of record.

Based on the pictures of his close, the floor cleaning machine and other indications, Travis was both clean and organized. It does not make sense that these reddish areas on/near the shower door frame and track would be rust, especially in arid Arizona.

Given the crime scene and autopsy photos, there is a lot of discoloration which is not addressed in the autopsy report. Horn notes some contusions of the lower right leg and knee, but nothing in the foot or ankle area. He does not indicate whether any blunt force trauma was antemortem or postmortem.

I too think he took very good care of his house and I don't see any evidence of rust, mildew or anything else around the shower, the grout is even clean, which is why I think that is blood, either a spot flowing over the edge with water or a flying drop hitting the wet surface. When I emboss the area (in Irfanview) I can see clear edges around the red coloration, it's not an artifact or optical illusion, it's something there, and I doubt it's anything besides blood.

I may have to go over the autopsy report (and feet/legs pics again, haven't done either in a while anyways) and see what he says about the legs and feet, I recall there was an abrasion on one heel but don't remember which, will report any findings. lol

 

[khaki]

Hi everyone... I really love and appreciate this thread...curious minds need to know! lol....anyway, regarding geevee's photos above...is it possible that the flesh colored discoloration running midway along the frame of the shower stall, near the date stamp, is it possible that's a reflection of JA?

 

[Tuba]

Like you, I've thought he was first attacked in the shower and it was his posture in the photos that led me to think that. Now you've laid out other bloody details, like that line of blood on the shower pan edge. Anyway, who sits like that cramped in the bottom of a shower, if he has a choice!?!

I went to the court filings this morning and saw that Nurmi did not file his reply August 5 as demanded by the court. Yesterday, I read the final revision of his motion to vacate; it is considerably cleaned up, reorganized with much added argument. It contained an odd assumption, that since jurors haven't the experience of a judge, who presides over many violent criminal cases, in comparing cruel crimes to especially cruel crimes, they would not recognize a merely cruel act from an unusually cruel one. They need the help of a judge because they can't see the difference and the legislature did not spell it out. Therefore, the judge steps over her judiciary limits and writes law in the instructions. I agree with Nurmi that it is the province of the jurors to determine what is especially (or particularly, unusually) cruel but sad to say, life itself qualifies jurors by exposing them to both ordinary cruel acts and horrifically cruel ones day in and day out. We do not live in isolation or in monasteries. We are in touch with the world in its peaceful moments and its frenzies. We know and have known for two hundred & a quarter years what is cruel and unusual punishment exacted on a human being.

 

[gcharlie]

Tuba, it is my understanding that the US Supreme Court led Arizona to change its laws from a judge deciding whether or not to impose the death penalty.

https://www.azag.gov/sites/default/files/sites/all/docs/Criminal/ccc/Final-CapPun.pdf

" In Ring v. Arizona, 122 S. Ct. 2428 (2002), the United States Supreme Court overruled Walton to the extent that it authorized a judge, rather than a jury, to determine aggravating circumstances that subject the defendant to the death penalty. In response to Ring, the Arizona legislature enacted a new death penalty sentencing statute (Attachment “E&#8221 that provides for jury sentencing in capital cases."

Nurmi has created a circular argument given the history of Arizona law regarding the death penalty. I'll have to go back and read his motion again, because my interpretation was different from yours. I thought he argued that a judge would have the experience and knowledge to distinguish especially cruel, whereas a jury would not. I don't recall a caveat that without a judge's instructions, a jury would not be qualified to make this decision.

If Nurmi has not responded by the deadline without requesting an extension, does the judge rule on the original motion with what the filings she has received to date?

 

[Tuba]

His argument is circular but he solves it by pointing to the legislators. He asserts that they are rightly responsible for specifying what is meant by cruel and especially cruel. He does say the judge has the knowledge & experience to know but that she or he must not be the entity to spell that out because that would be legislating from the bench, which he claims Judge Stephens did in her jury instructions. He is aware that the jurist is no longer accorded the right to determine, as the jury did, what is especially cruel. That is the Constitutional right of the defendant's to be assessed by her peers. However, he finds them unqualified to do that because they do not share the judge's practice of viewing criminal cases. He finds them wanting. He wants them to receive the help of the legislature who could spell out precisely what they mean by writing that "especially cruel" aggravates the crime to a level where the death penalty is appropriate. As you know, I think jurors do recognize such cruelty, as explained above.

 

[geevee]

Hi everyone... I really love and appreciate this thread...curious minds need to know! lol....anyway, regarding geevee's photos above...is it possible that the flesh colored discoloration running midway along the frame of the shower stall, near the date stamp, is it possible that's a reflection of JA?

Hiya Khaki, it's possible but I tend to think it's more likely her hand was moving in front of the lens as it was focusing and it shows as sort of a ghost image over his calf area. At least that's my current theory. lol He also has discoloration on his thigh but I haven't discerned anything specific there.

 

[Sydni]

Here's a link to Darryl Brewer's interview during the mitigation phase:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgaGB89C0yo

He contradicts his testimony when he says in the interview that he did not know CMJA was going to Mesa when she visited him on June 3. Under cross examination, JM asked him several times about CMJA contacting him in May 2008 to borrow gas cans to go to Mesa. IIRC, when first questioned, he denied knowledge of plans to go to Mesa and then JM refreshed his memory with statements that DB had given to investigators.

Also in this interview, he is unequivocal in stating that CMJA began changing in the spring of 2006. He is also very clear that she was involved with the Mormons in the spring of 2006. I had previously posted that he said she began to change 2 years before the murder; he refers to the spring of 2006, not the two years before that I stated.

He contradicts CMJA's father when he said that she was not a person who lied when he knew her. If this is his truth, then he is a truly gullible man who is a poor judge of character.

DB claims that CMJA had a wide circle of friends in Palm Desert who were willing to testify on her behalf, yet were not sought out to do so. I do find it amazing how few people from her past have actually stepped forward to make any comments about her or this case. Both DB and Patti Womack are appalled at the murder and neither of them have proclaimed her innocence. I cannot find any statements made by Leslie Udy other than her testimony.

Good observations/research. ITA.

But I have to say that DB gives me the willies. There is something very off with him ... and most of JA's (former) friends, actually. I agree that if he did not see anything "weird" about JA ... well .. go figure ???

Anyway ... good post!

 

[geevee]

Anyone remember what the public record request and motion for protective order were all about back on 3-21/22? I see it on the case history but draw a blank on what those were.

 

[geevee]

Since I've never seen the full pic of 5:30:30 (from top to bottom) but I do have separate pics that show the whole thing, so I matched them up as best I could size-wise and put them together so we can see his arm positions as well as his foot/feet. The color is still off, but it's the best I could do with the no cost photo editor that I have.

 

[geevee]

Oh, meant to say, I have a larger, no-black-bar 5:30:30 pic in my PB album, not sure if it opens to full size there but if you save it, it will (746x632). See that blurry line along the center of his calf? I think it's the shower door clasp/hardware on the right that got into the pic as the camera was moving. It appears to be a blur of a white plastic object, there may also be the shape of fingers in that area but his leg is moving and so is the camera, so hard to be sure.

 

[geevee]

This is the only one I think shows her reflection while taking the picture and reaching towards the shower door (I think), I swapped the color line up to make it more visible (upper right):

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

I have sooooo many unresolved issues/questions....mostly pertaining to exactly how the murder went down. What time exactly did she arrive at the house? Did Travis know she was coming? Did she watch him secretly when she first got there? How exactly did she do the clean-up in the bathroom with all of that blood contained in the bathroom and not a drop elsewhere in the house? Where did she dispose of the weapons and how? And so on and so forth....I'm sure we'll never know the answers.

The Jury Said She is Guilty of Murder in the First Degree in a heinous manner.

<modsnip>

 

[Dana]

I do believe the topic of this thread is:

POST VERDICT - Working Out The Unresolved Questions

I hope it's alright to still discuss things that didn't make sense about this trial, otherwise I'm going to have to quit reading this thread and move on.

 

[Tulessa]

I do believe the topic of this thread is:

POST VERDICT - Working Out The Unresolved Questions

I hope it's alright to still discuss things that didn't make sense about this trial, otherwise I'm going to have to quit reading this thread and move on.

And I think we are following that guideline...........

 

[geevee]

I do believe the topic of this thread is:

POST VERDICT - Working Out The Unresolved Questions

I hope it's alright to still discuss things that didn't make sense about this trial, otherwise I'm going to have to quit reading this thread and move on.

Cute puppy, Dana!

I hope this thread goes on until we have all the questions answered.

Frankly, if the prosecution makes any sentencing deal with her at all, it would be my strongest hope that it come with complete verifiable disclosure of all events from early April '08 onward (I think she was not happy when she left Mesa and intended to do something about it). Travis' family deserves to know the truth, and all those who spent countless hours investigating and trying to shed the tiniest bit of light on her subterfuge deserve it - no talk, no deal, Ms. Arias, that would be my immovable stance.

But unless that day comes, I'll continue onward trying to figure out what all she did.

 

[Sydni]

I am sure these questions have already been asked, but I am curious about any details that might be available on the day of her arrest ...

1. Does law enforcement know more than they are saying about her destination?
2. Was she trying to flee - heading to Canada/Mexico?
3. Why the gun and other weapons hidden amongst the books
4. Her Father's interview revealed that she said she had to leave?
5. Has more info been given by "the parents" that hasn't been disclosed?
6. Why did the parents not testify on her behalf in the mitigation/penalty phase? (I think there was a risk of being charged with something like "covering up evidence" etc.)

And on other areas ...

1. What do they have on Matt M.? Something to do with those magazines that she was trying to smuggle out of jail through Ann Campbell?????
2. Where IS MM ???
3. Does DB know more than he's revealing about her personality? I think he does ... he is a very weird dude. Maybe it's the way he speaks .. icky!

I'm sure there are no answers or any information out there to answer my questions, but maybe at the end of this ordeal and she is put away forever, there will be more information released from the Court.

 

[gcharlie]

Anybody know what has happened to MySpace? I can no longer access accounts for Travis Alexander or CMJA.

 

[Dana]

And I think we are following that guideline...........

Yes we are!

I was answering a post above me that was revised by the mod so now my post doesn't make any sense.