Questions you'd like answers to...

[HarmonyE.]

You know LW could get the entire GJ proceedings released if he so wanted..

I don't think he has any more power than anyone else does with regard to this.

 

[sedndun]

I'd never really gone into those final seven seconds. I've manipulated them every way I can and yet I don't hear anything except for an initial muffled impact sound which could be Patsy holding the phone against her chest. Has anyone ever heard anything in that bit? Part of my mind hears things in the static, but just barely and is probably more from wanting to hear things than actually hearing them.
As for the rest, I'm still fairly certain John says "Can I speak with you?" I had created my own clip pulled from the CBS special and had listened to it off and on since that aired. I had notes on what didn't mesh from what others heard and what I could make out. Only recently did the John clip come into focus for me. The rest changes quite drastically depending on the speed it's played at, so I won't post any new ideas until they solidify further. I however, would love to hear what others are hearing- just one differenet word may help things click in my own mind.

 

[andreww]

I'd never really gone into those final seven seconds. I've manipulated them every way I can and yet I don't hear anything except for an initial muffled impact sound which could be Patsy holding the phone against her chest. Has anyone ever heard anything in that bit? Part of my mind hears things in the static, but just barely and is probably more from wanting to hear things than actually hearing them.
As for the rest, I'm still fairly certain John says "Can I speak with you?" I had created my own clip pulled from the CBS special and had listened to it off and on since that aired. I had notes on what didn't mesh from what others heard and what I could make out. Only recently did the John clip come into focus for me. The rest changes quite drastically depending on the speed it's played at, so I won't post any new ideas until they solidify further. I however, would love to hear what others are hearing- just one differenet word may help things click in my own mind.

The versions you can find on YouTube are fairly poor. You can Make out Patsy fairly clearly, but after that you will find the remaining voices have been removed. I do not believe the enhanced version has ever been released although they did play it on the CBS special and it was much clearer than anything I've heard. Wish we had access to an audio clip from that special!

 

[SerenitySprings]

I'd never really gone into those final seven seconds. I've manipulated them every way I can and yet I don't hear anything except for an initial muffled impact sound which could be Patsy holding the phone against her chest. Has anyone ever heard anything in that bit? Part of my mind hears things in the static, but just barely and is probably more from wanting to hear things than actually hearing them.
As for the rest, I'm still fairly certain John says "Can I speak with you?" I had created my own clip pulled from the CBS special and had listened to it off and on since that aired. I had notes on what didn't mesh from what others heard and what I could make out. Only recently did the John clip come into focus for me. The rest changes quite drastically depending on the speed it's played at, so I won't post any new ideas until they solidify further. I however, would love to hear what others are hearing- just one differenet word may help things click in my own mind.

911 Operator: Patsy? Patsy?
Unknown: I think.
911 Operator: Patsy?
PR: See? What did you do to her? What did you do?
Unknown: Gonna arrest me.

 

[Userid]

When Patsy thought she had hung up the receiver, it didn't disconnect. But they claimed this call was made from the wall phone in the kitchen. Ask yourself how someone can fail to cradle the receiver on a wall phone without it falling to the counter-top below. I think this call was made from the desktop phone in the basement and all three surviving Ramseys were present from the beginning to the end of the call. If investigators had realized this and told them they had that proof, I think they might have had them. They would have been separated and questioned, and at least one of the three would have cracked.

(Respectfully snipped, in regards to the bolded) Exactly. This has been driving me up a wall. How in the heck could she accidentally leave the phone off the hook when the supposed phone she was calling from was a wall mount? I never understood this and I still don't.

On another note, great points about the ransom note not being where it supposedly was by Meara, etc. Trying to play catch-up.

 

[Userid]

One thing that occurred to me was that when the operator asked Patsy who the note was from, she didn't ask John who it was from, his voice isn't there. That would be the most natural thing to do if he was there crouched over the note reading it.

Oh my, what an excellent observation. Really -- superb.

I've been out of the loop during the holidays so I'm not sure: have you shared your theory yet? It's fine if not and I still understand your reasons not to; just curious because I really like your posts and I'm interested to hear it.

 

[Tortoise]

Oh my, what an excellent observation. Really -- superb.

I've been out of the loop during the holidays so I'm not sure: have you shared your theory yet? It's fine if not and I still understand your reasons not to; just curious because I really like your posts and I'm interested to hear it.

Oh thanks.

I'll tell you where I'm at. I wanted to get it finished by Christmas because obviously that was the anniversary and a significant deadline, but it was interfering with me being able to organise Christmas for my family so I had to shelve it that week, or we'd have had no food shopping or wrapped pressies. And it was a totally unrealistic deadline for me, I'm still only half way finished with it and I have a big meal to cook for my extended family tomorrow night - we didn't all manage to see each other at Christmas. So anyway, it's complete in my head but not all typed up. When it's done it's going directly to the DA, and unless they indicate they don't want me to publish it, I'll share it after that. For reasons I won't go into yet I've decided not to send it to Boulder PD.

I'm thinking another week or two.

 

[sedndun]

Keep in mind, several more calls were made right after that, so I never imagined Patsy actually let go of the phone. If you are making a series of calls, you don't put the phone down- especially if you are in an agitated state. You touch the receiver to the cradle to end the call, but pull it right back so you can make the next one. Or some may just push down the switch hook/button with their free hand. This actually makes more sense if it were a wall phone and knowing the call hadn't been cut off properly. On those types of phones, if the receiver isn't put back fully, or the switch hook/button not pressed all the way down, the call won't disconnect.
I do think it's important to wonder where the call actually took place. If it was in the basement, then they each knew exactly what had happened.

 

[TeaTime]

(Respectfully snipped, in regards to the bolded) Exactly. This has been driving me up a wall. How in the heck could she accidentally leave the phone off the hook when the supposed phone she was calling from was a wall mount? I never understood this and I still don't.

On another note, great points about the ransom note not being where it supposedly was by Meara, etc. Trying to play catch-up.

Maybe she used the phone in the basement near the laundry room. The operator thought she was Kath - - , so it was coming from an address with a Kath-- name coming up on the operator's screen.

Even BR stated that unless someone erased his memory, he did not kill his sister. Maybe he has been programmed to mis-remember by the lies.

He once said, in response to questions about that day, that when he was told that JBR was missing he thought she was hiding and when told she was kidnapped, he thought "what are the chances of that" happening?

JR and PR both stated that BR was in therapy because they didn't want it all to explode on him when he was 40. After the DP interview, he seems to want to self-destruct. I think the lawsuit will do him more emotional damage than it is worth. You can forgive the person who murdered your baby sister and daughter in her own home, but attack people for thinking you did it. No forgiveness there. "You can kill my sister/daughter and be forgiven but you can not be forgiven for thinking I did it and I'll make you pay for thinking that, even though I have not done one thing in my life to help the police find the killer and frankly, haven't bothered to inquire about he progress of the case because I've moved on with my life."

Ick. Just ick.

 

[SerenitySprings]

I would love to know someone who knows almost nothing about this case. I would have them sit down with the 911 call recording so they could tell me what they think it says. Sometimes I wonder if we all hear PR, JR, & BR saying incriminating things simply because we want confirmation that our hunches about them are correct.

Of course, I would also love to hear the CBS 911 call with their comments and the music cut out. It's so frustrating to be intently listening for those seconds and then have a drum beat or some other suspenseful music playing.


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[Ambitioned]

I would love to know someone who knows almost nothing about this case. I would have them sit down with the 911 call recording so they could tell me what they think it says. Sometimes I wonder if we all hear PR, JR, & BR saying incriminating things simply because we want confirmation that our hunches about them are correct.

Log into a MMORPG or find a COD player. Many hard core gamers don't pay attention to US news and they shell out $$$$ for the best headphones. If you ask them who they think killed JB, they'll reply with, "Who?"

 

[SerenitySprings]

Log into a MMORPG or find a COD player. Many hard core gamers don't pay attention to US news and they shell out $$$$ for the best headphones. If you ask them who they think killed JB, they'll reply with, "Who?"

You know, that is actually not a bad idea. I have a brother who's 10 years younger than me and I bet he has no idea who she is. He would've been 10 when it happened so I'm sure he wasn't exposed to the news on it.

Plus he's a HUGE gamer so probably ha the best headphones.

Now to find a clean version of the call...


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[Ambitioned]

You know, that is actually not a bad idea. I have a brother who's 10 years younger than me and I bet he has no idea who she is. He would've been 10 when it happened so I'm sure he wasn't exposed to the news on it.

Plus he's a HUGE gamer so probably ha the best headphones.

Now to find a clean version of the call...

He may not be able to make out exactly what was said. But he will hear a child's voice on the call. I bet my life savings on it!

 

[buggiegirl]

Maybe she used the phone in the basement near the laundry room. The operator thought she was Kath - - , so it was coming from an address with a Kath-- name coming up on the operator's screen.

I think the operator said "Pats-" and got interrupted. The screen probably said John and Patsy Ramsey and she knew it was a woman's voice.

 

[sedndun]

I promise this is my last post regarding Disgusted's 911 audio challenge for a while, but I'd like to know if this is at least close as far as the number of syllables. I've adjusted the audio each and every way I could and brought it down to 25% speed and listened hundreds if not a thousand times more since you mentioned that there is absolutely no "Jesus" in there.
Patsy: "How didn't you notice this? How did you sleep?"
So I'm hearing John saying sternly (to Patsy, not Burke) at the end of the call "Can I speak with you?" As if he's already realizing things have spun out of control.
Patsy retaliates by asking him how he could have slept through the nite's horrors- either meaning an intruder, or her having to do what she did.
Burke is still unclear to me, especially that last word. I don't hear "find." What I hear is more like "found" there's a clear "o" in there.

 

[kanzz]

I would love to know someone who knows almost nothing about this case. I would have them sit down with the 911 call recording so they could tell me what they think it says. Sometimes I wonder if we all hear PR, JR, & BR saying incriminating things simply because we want confirmation that our hunches about them are correct.

Of course, I would also love to hear the CBS 911 call with their comments and the music cut out. It's so frustrating to be intently listening for those seconds and then have a drum beat or some other suspenseful music playing.

Virgin ears - great idea!

Log into a MMORPG or find a COD player. Many hard core gamers don't pay attention to US news and they shell out $$$$ for the best headphones. If you ask them who they think killed JB, they'll reply with, "Who?"

Gamer kids - another great idea!

 

[AndHence]

I have two quick questions: 1) Burke will be deposed in the upcoming lawsuit against CBS, correct? and 2) Why weren't the Ramseys called to testify before the Grand Jury back in 98?

 

[SerenitySprings]

I have two quick questions: 1) Burke will be deposed in the upcoming lawsuit against CBS, correct? and 2) Why weren't the Ramseys called to testify before the Grand Jury back in 98?

1. Yes, if the lawsuit goes forward. First the judge has to decide that the case is appropriate. Then, if it is, discovery will be exchanged. If CBS decides not to settle the case, it could lead to depositions. People lie during depos all the time. And I bet they figure out all sorts of ways to keep BR away from providing any testimony in any way. But he is opening himself up by filing in the first place.

2. I don't know yet. I'm reading Perfect Murder, Perfect Town by Schiller. I have about 1/4 of the book left to read and I'm just now getting to the grand jury part. I'd recommend you read it. Once I find out more about what happened during the GJ I'll post here.


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[TeaTime]

The Ramseys were suspects and could not be compelled to testify in front of the GJ just as they could not be compelled to testify at trial. There wasn't even any reason to try to make them appear, the 5th amendment defense kicks in and they would never have been forced to testify.

Burke WILL be deposed if the trial gets passed all the preliminary motions. He can be compelled to testify, under oath, and his attorneys MUST produce him for that sworn testimony. He has the burden of proof and refusal to participate in normal discovery procedures will get him kicked out of court.

His psychiatrists may also find themselves on the bad side of the table. As well as JR and DP. Everybody who wrote a report that was used by those in the documentary will be subject to deposition. The case will be tried by CBS. It is good for ratings.

 

[Userid]

Keep in mind, several more calls were made right after that, so I never imagined Patsy actually let go of the phone. If you are making a series of calls, you don't put the phone down- especially if you are in an agitated state. You touch the receiver to the cradle to end the call, but pull it right back so you can make the next one. Or some may just push down the switch hook/button with their free hand. This actually makes more sense if it were a wall phone and knowing the call hadn't been cut off properly. On those types of phones, if the receiver isn't put back fully, or the switch hook/button not pressed all the way down, the call won't disconnect.
I do think it's important to wonder where the call actually took place. If it was in the basement, then they each knew exactly what had happened.

Good point -- I've also thought about this, but I never put much stock into it because, she had to have called her friends from the same phone (which ever one that was) she used to call police. (right?). I assume this considering how quickly they arrived. Has it ever been confirmed by BPD/the operator if the phone was ever actually/eventually hung up? Did the operator stay on the line until she was disconnected?

Maybe she used the phone in the basement near the laundry room. The operator thought she was Kath - - , so it was coming from an address with a Kath-- name coming up on the operator's screen.

Even BR stated that unless someone erased his memory, he did not kill his sister. Maybe he has been programmed to mis-remember by the lies.

He once said, in response to questions about that day, that when he was told that JBR was missing he thought she was hiding and when told she was kidnapped, he thought "what are the chances of that" happening?

JR and PR both stated that BR was in therapy because they didn't want it all to explode on him when he was 40. After the DP interview, he seems to want to self-destruct. I think the lawsuit will do him more emotional damage than it is worth. You can forgive the person who murdered your baby sister and daughter in her own home, but attack people for thinking you did it. No forgiveness there. "You can kill my sister/daughter and be forgiven but you can not be forgiven for thinking I did it and I'll make you pay for thinking that, even though I have not done one thing in my life to help the police find the killer and frankly, haven't bothered to inquire about he progress of the case because I've moved on with my life."

Ick. Just ick.

Yes, that's possible, but part of me wonders if the audio (that's head after Patsy "hangs up") would have been heard, had the call been made in the basement. It's possible of course, but I always just assumed that sound would have a harder time traveling in the enclosed basement with all those rooms/walls, but I could be wrong. That's the question I always ask: where was the end of the call (after she "hung up") taking place? So, if she did indeed call from the basement, where was JR and BR when she encountered them after? It would have to be the area by the bathroom/bottom of the stairs in the basement, with both doors between the areas open -- but with all the clutter that was in that area at the time, would that have been possible?