Random things about this case...

[Compassionate Reader]

Me, too!! Loved how he said he could not testify against Damien because THAT would be murder. Note that Damien & Jason were friends, but they were not friends with Jessie. And reading Jessie's "confession" is just sad. Makes me really disappointed in LE & how they coerced Jessie.

Wow -- Hobbs' hair in the ligatures? And his teeth disappeared after the crime? And no neighborhood canvasing by LE? And the neighbor's comments about Terry calling to the boys before they were missing? Injustice to say the least . . .

Did Damien change his name or did his parents give it to him? I have a few friends who named their boys Damien & not because of The Omen.

Damien was born Michael Wayne Hutchinson. When his mother remarried, she married Jack Echols, who later adopted Damien. According to Damien's testimony at his trial, he changed his first name at that time, too. He chose Damien in honor of Father Damien who is to be sainted for his work with the lepers in Hawaii which eventually cost him his life.

 

[~n/t~]

If you're talking about the older interviews with Damien (while he was still falsely imprisoned), he has dental problems. They are being corrected, but he's still in considerable pain from them. Have you ever had a severe toothache? The only remedy provided to Death Row inmates by the State of Arkansas for dental problems is extraction. (They don't intend to spend money for fillings or crowns, etc. on someone that they plan to kill.) Don't judge him based on his pain unless you have experienced similar pain for about 15 years.

Sorry, I don't see dead or soulless eyes. Remember that the Death Row interviews were done through glass. The reflection from the glass could be responsible for the look that you see but I don't. You're entitled to your opinion, of course, but I don't see a soulless person at all. I see a very eloquent, strong young man who is just beginning to live the life that he should have been living for the last 18 plus years. You do realize that your statement about his lack of soul is a veritable quote, don't you?

As to Jason, he's a shy young man who is simply not used to the media attention. Again, I don't see a puppet at all. He's articulate and soft-spoken. I think he'll do fine in life.

No it was a combination of old and new interviews on the show last night. As a matter of fact, I noticed the same body language when he was interviewed right after the release. A tooth ache doesn't last 18 years.

They will always remain guilty in my eyes and we will all have to agree to disagree. One of the reasons I don't come by this thread anymore. There has been nothing so far that has proven they did not murder those 3 little boys. They confessed, they pleaded guilty and the rest is history.

 

[krimekat]

As to Damien's name, he was born Michael Wayne Hutchinson. When his mother married Jack Echols, her new husband adopted Damien. Damien changed his name when he was interested in the Roman Catholic Church. It is in honor of Father Damien, soon to be sanctified by the Church for his work with the lepers in Hawaii.

Thank you, CR! As always, you have the answer. Your insight & knowledge of this case is extraordinary - I have learned so much by your comments & links. I cannot wait until December when the new evidence is available. I will continue to follow this case as it progresses. Hopefully, justice will be served.

I cannot believe I did not hear about this case until WELL after the fact. I was going to grad school in St. Louis at the time & would think it was covered extensively but I don't remember it. I attribute it to a (MO) small-minded, uneducated, scared community looking for swift justice, and how unjust it was!

 

[krimekat]

Damien admitted that he studied and looked into the satanic side of the occult, and stated he was very familiar with it. There are more than 10,000 Roman Catholic saints and beatified people......... and Damien Echols chose a name, Damien, but from the horror movie, The Omen. One of the Omen's character, Damien, had qualities that Damien Echols told psychiatrist, Dr. George Wood, that he also possessed. Damien believed he had been visited by demons since the age of 9. Damien Echols believed he had special powers. Damien Echols wrote about his "special power" in this frightening poem:
http://callahan.8k.com/images2/d_echols/de_poem.JPG

Damien Echol's poem:
I know just where you live.
I know you live alone.
I’ll pay a visit in your darkest hour.
I’ve got a treat in store.
Won’t be the same no more.
And I will demonstrate my holy power.
I see through what it is inside you.
I’ll make you break down and cry.

Um, this is an Ozzy song . . . Devil's Daughter. NOT Damien Echols

I was a teenager in the late 80s MUCH like Damien. However, I had parents who guided me away from the dark side. Damien only had prison. Thank God they are free to pursue their innocence!

 

[Cappuccino]

No it was a combination of old and new interviews on the show last night. As a matter of fact, I noticed the same body language when he was interviewed right after the release. A tooth ache doesn't last 18 years.

Yes it does, if it remains untreated for 18 years.

Ozzy Osbourne lyrics, Damien has BRAIN DAMAGE, (putting it in capital letters makes it true), and a scary name from a horror film. Oh, and Damien has no soul and makes n/t shudder. There's the case for the prosecution folks.

 

[Pensfan]

Um, this is an Ozzy song . . . Devil's Daughter. NOT Damien Echols

Respectfully shortened-

Thank you for finding that information. Clearly Damien Echols very strongly identified with Ozzy’s lyrics about hurting someone and having “holy powers” as he kept these lyrics and stated similar things which can be found in the case documents.

From Damien Echols’ medical record:
Reveals a history of abuse as he talked of how he was treated as a child. Denies that this has influenced him stating “I just put it all inside.” Describes this as more than just anger — like rage. Sometimes he does “blow up”. Relates that when this happens the only solution is to “hurt someone”. Damien reports being told at the hospital that he could be another “Charles Manson or Ted Bundy”. When questioned on his feelings he states “I know I’m going to influence the world — people will remember me.”
http://callahan.8k.com/images/500/050.jpg


All of the following, to prove Damien believed he had holy powers, was taken from Dr. Wood’s affidavit:
He (Damien Echols) believed his body was being transformed from a human being to a superior being - Christ. He saw these changes as signs of his inevitable metamorphosis and followed command hallucinations to ready himself for this life changing event.


Damien recorded, “I can see physical changes happening in my body. I can tell it’s getting ready. The abonations [sic] have already begun to be spit Forth from the Earth. I have seen some of them. I will become one soon. . . .My body is changing but that medicine is making it happen a lot more slowly than normal I am outgrowing my skin. I am eating packs of sugar and Kool-Aid to give my body the extra energy it needs to make its change. Soon People will be able to Know I am the Christ Just by looking at me.

Mr. Echols stated that at some point in his adolescence he came to believe he was “something that was almost a supreme being that came from a place other people didn’t come from.” This transformation caused him to change physically, the pertinent changes appearing in his “appendages, hands, feet, hair.” He acquired “an entirely different bone structure that was not human.” He developed “stronger senses.” His eyesight was better and his “ability to smell and taste changed.”


He believed his arrest was an omen that supernatural entities would soon arrive to transport him to another world where he could live among beings like himself, who could understand and accept him. He described visual and auditory hallucinations: the beings “communicated” with him -- often through the words and actions of others -- and revealed themselves to him through a series of elaborate scenes that included a host of eerie and dour characters.

Mr. Echols became increasingly despondent that he had not been transported to the world his “entities” had promised him.
For example, he perceived the cameras used by the media and HBO film crew as a sign of his imminent transition.
http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/gwoods.html

 

[Pensfan]

Yes it does, if it remains untreated for 18 years.

Ozzy Osbourne lyrics, Damien has BRAIN DAMAGE, (putting it in capital letters makes it true).........

Respectfully shortened-

Educate yourself about schizophrenia.

The brain damage in schizophrenics can be viewed with MRI. It appears specifically in to two basic areas: the parietal cortex and the frontal lobe. From images taken at regular intervals of hundreds of schizophrenic patients and control subjects, neurologists looked at time-lapse MIR “movies” of what happens when and at what rate. In the MRI "movies", neurologists saw a traveling wave of tissue loss, starting with the parietal cortex and then relentlessly sweeping forward into the frontal lobe. Neurologists calculated the tissue loss at over 5 percent a year, which is comparable to Alzheimer’s disease — brain cells are actually dying as a result of schizophrenia.

http://www.bri.ucla.edu/bri_weekly/news_080623.asp

See Damien Echols' diagnosis of schizophrenia and bipolar disorder and read his delusions here:
http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/gwoods.html

 

[Compassionate Reader]

Some people seem to be fixated on Damien and his past teen angst, trying hard to make it into some sort of serious and ongoing mental health issue. I wonder if Lorri needs to be worried about this obvious "crush" on her husband? I'm just glad that Damien is now free and able to live life to the fullest with his loving wife. His astute and sincere observations in the recent 48 Hours episode made me truly proud to have supported him in his fight for freedom and to continue to support him in his fight for true justice.

 

[Wishbone]

Um, this is an Ozzy song . . . Devil's Daughter. NOT Damien Echols

I was a teenager in the late 80s MUCH like Damien. However, I had parents who guided me away from the dark side. Damien only had prison. Thank God they are free to pursue their innocence!

Glad you could set the record straight on where those lyrics really came from. There's way too many baseless accusations being made toward Damien.

 

[Compassionate Reader]

Glad you could set the record straight on where those lyrics really came from. There's way too many baseless accusations being made toward Damien.

In the many years since I've been following this case (since 1996), that has been the case. Too many small-minded people believe that everyone should fall in lock step and be cut from the same mold. When someone who is different comes along, they are often ostracized and sometimes downright persecuted. As Emily Dickinson said,

"Much Madness is divinest Sense -
To a discerning Eye -
Much Sense - the starkest Madness -
'Tis the Majority
In this, as All, prevail -
Assent - and you are sane -
Demur - you're straightway dangerous -
And handled with a Chain - "

 

[Peepers]

I understand people feel strongly on one side or the other, but for those of us new to the case and reading things, trying to discuss it here is nearly impossible. some people are really defensive.

 

[Pensfan]

I understand people feel strongly on one side or the other, but for those of us new to the case and reading things, trying to discuss it here is nearly impossible. some people are really defensive.

This is very personal for some posters because they falsely believe they must defend themselves/their subculture by defending anyone who has a similar subculture.

 

[Compassionate Reader]

I understand people feel strongly on one side or the other, but for those of us new to the case and reading things, trying to discuss it here is nearly impossible. some people are really defensive.

Yes, this case has always aroused an emotional response. Speaking for myself, whenever I see what I believe to be misinformation or outright lies being posted, I feel a need to "set the record straight" so to speak. If you feel that that's being "defensive," I'm sorry about that. I'm guessing that the "other side" feels the same way. I'm sorry if it is difficult for "newbies" to discuss the case, but please feel free to ask any questions that you have. I will be glad to give you the supporters' take on your question, and I'm sure that someone from the non-supporter side will be glad to give you their take on it, too. Don't feel intimidated, please.

 

[Compassionate Reader]

This is very personal for some posters because they falsely believe they must defend themselves/their subculture by defending anyone who has a similar subculture.

I'm not defending my "subculture." I'm defending three innocent young men who spent over 18 years in prison for murders that they did not commit and I'm seeking justice for three innocent eight year old boys who were brutally murdered on May 5, 1993, and whose murderer is still free. I will continue to defend them and try in any way I can to see that their murderer is brought to justice.

 

[krimekat]

This is very personal for some posters because they falsely believe they must defend themselves/their subculture by defending anyone who has a similar subculture.

What? :floorlaugh:

What I believe is not false. What I believe is based on what I have investigated & what I have discerned from the FACTS of this case -- and any case. It's not personal to me except for the fact that three innocent boys were found guilty of crimes they did not commit. There is no evidence they committed these crimes - NONE. In fact, there is evidence (DNA, hair) implicating one of the boys' fathers.

And we know as members of WS more often than not children are harmed by those who love them. This is from Wikipedia: a 1999 US Department of Justice study concluded that between 1976 and 1997 in the US, mothers were responsible for a higher share of children killed during infancy, while fathers were more likely to have been responsible for the murders of children age 8 or older. Parents were responsible for 61% of children murders under the age of five; filicide is the third leading cause of death amongst American children five to fourteen years old according to American Journal of Psychiatry.

Oh, and I do not subscribe to ANY subculture.

 

[Compassionate Reader]

What? :floorlaugh:

What I believe is not false. What I believe is based on what I have investigated & what I have discerned from the FACTS of this case -- and any case. It's not personal to me except for the fact that three innocent boys were found guilty of crimes they did not commit. There is no evidence they committed these crimes - NONE. In fact, there is evidence (DNA, hair) implicating one of the boys' fathers.

And we know as members of WS more often than not children are harmed by those who love them. This is from Wikipedia: a 1999 US Department of Justice study concluded that between 1976 and 1997 in the US, mothers were responsible for a higher share of children killed during infancy, while fathers were more likely to have been responsible for the murders of children age 8 or older. Parents were responsible for 61% of children murders under the age of five; filicide is the third leading cause of death amongst American children five to fourteen years old according to American Journal of Psychiatry.

Oh, and I do not subscribe to ANY subculture.

IMO, one of the most frustrating aspects of this case was the total failure on the part of the WMPD to investigate all of the parental figures and clear them of the murders before moving on to an outsider. This was not done. Even Gary G, in his deposition in the Pasdar suit, mentioned that, in a case like this, the first thing that should be done was to clear all the parents (which, of course, would include step parents).

We know that the police questioned JMB at the time of the murders. We know that Todd M was cleared of suspicion because he was an OTR driver and was out of town until 6 am on May 6, 1993. However, Terry H was not even questioned by the WMPD until 2004 (or was it 2007?). IIRC, he always managed to be unavailable when the police were in the area questioning people.

I've always questioned that, and the only reason that I can fathom is that Terry "had something" on someone high up in the WMPD, perhaps Gary G himself. I have no proof of this, only a gut feeling. Does anyone else feel the same or can any one provide a plausible explanation for the failure of the WMPD to investigate Terry H?

BTW, I don't accept the reasoning that they "had their man" when they arrested Damien and the other members of the WMFree. The whole point here is that all parents should have been cleared, regardless of whoever else might have been suspected. That's just competent police work, IMO, and it simply wasn't done in this case.

 

[Pensfan]

Now that the WM3 pled guilty (Alford plea) and they have been released, the income stream coming into the WM3 Defense Fund logically must be tapering off. Does anyone else wonder what is being done to continue interest in this case so that the income provided by donors will continue?

 

[Compassionate Reader]

Now that the WM3 pled guilty (Alford plea) and they have been released, the income stream coming into the WM3 Defense Fund logically must be tapering off. Does anyone else wonder what is being done to continue interest in this case so that the income provided by donors will continue?

There is a continued ongoing effort to raise money for the three freed men, primarily for their living expenses but also for the continued efforts of the defense team to gain their exoneration. Jessie's recent need for money to get his electricity turned on was met, for example. There are still some "deep pockets" who are striving to get the three exonerated and who are also willing to help out with discretionary funds when needed.

All three really want to be able to stand on their own. However, with the (undeserved) murder convictions at least temporarily on their records, finding decent paying jobs will probably be difficult. Hopefully, when the defense finishes with all the testing and presents its findings to Scott Ellington, exoneration will be swift and LE can focus on convicting the real killer.

Until that happens, and I have every confidence that it will happen, money will continue to be collected. I'm confident that caring people all over the world will continue to contribute as intelligent people everywhere will realize that these three will have a hard row to hoe until they are fully exonerated. Addresses to send money to the three individually are available on the Blackboard. I can post them here, if anyone is interested.

 

[UdbCrzy2]

Now that the WM3 pled guilty (Alford plea) and they have been released, the income stream coming into the WM3 Defense Fund logically must be tapering off. Does anyone else wonder what is being done to continue interest in this case so that the income provided by donors will continue?

I'll bet that the people who created the supporter website (as seen in movie) are making some cash on new artwork with t-shirts and the such. I wonder how much of that is shared with the actual support of the three convicted or with their families.

It may be difficult for them to find employment especially now with record high unemployment. I'm surprised that one of their rich supporters has not hired them for some menial job. Which makes me wonder where they are now?

Now, they are not getting health care (unless they applied for medicaid) and have to face the world without being protected by the state (housing, food, etc).

 

[Compassionate Reader]

I'll bet that the people who created the supporter website (as seen in movie) are making some cash on new artwork with t-shirts and the such. I wonder how much of that is shared with the actual support of the three convicted or with their families.

A good portion of the money raised from T-shirt sales, etc. does go to the families and recently-released men. Some of if goes to the defense team for their ongoing fight for exoneration. The "people who created the supporter website" aren't getting anything. BTW, you do realize that there are quite a few "supporter" websites, not just one, right?

It may be difficult for them to find employment especially now with record high unemployment. I'm surprised that one of their rich supporters has not hired them for some menial job. Which makes me wonder where they are now?

Jason is working at a roofing job the last I heard. Then he plans to go to law school. Damien is trying to regain his strength. Then, he will obtain employment of some kind. My guess would be maybe at a bookstore. He also plans to write and maybe paint. Jessie is to begin attending GED classes next month so that he can obtain a better paying position. Only a very small-minded person would let their unfair convictions prevent employment. I'm not saying it can't happen, but that attitude is just another example of why monies are still needed. As to where they are now, Jessie is still in Arkansas. Jason and Damien have left the state (which I understand totally) and are living somewhere else. That's all anyone really needs to know. They don't need a bunch of vigilantes who are out for their blood knocking on their doors.

Now, they are not getting health care (unless they applied for medicaid) and have to face the world without being protected by the state (housing, food, etc).

I know that they have been receiving quality medical and dental care since their release. Believe it or not, there are doctors and dentists who are supporters and who gladly provide help "pro bono" for them. If they did apply for Medicaid, frankly I'd rather that they get my tax dollars than someone unwilling to work with a house full of illegitimate children. These guys want to work; they don't want the government to bail them out. I don't think that can be said about a lot of people on welfare and Medicaid.

Please don't misunderstand my statements about Medicaid recipients. I'm sure that there are thousands of people who use Medicaid who are just down on their luck or temporarily out of work and therefore truly need the help. That's not who I resent. Who I resent are the families who have used the government for generations with no intention of trying to better their position or stand on their own two feet. They are the ones who are destroying the system and increasing the tax burden on the rest of us who know that we need to work for a living. OK Rant over.