Reasons why you think it could be suicide

[bourne]

They did find out it was Jonah by speaking to him. Jonah's call detail for his phone would also show the call was made.

http://www.760kfmb.com/story/154850...e-calls-to-rebecca-zahau?clienttype=printable

News 8 obtained two pages of AT&T billing logs from the 32-year-old's cell phone, which family members said was a newer-model phone using the Windows Phone mobile operating system.

The cell phone records confirm Zahau listened to her voicemail for two minutes at 12:50 a.m. on July 13, about two hours before her estimated time of death.

No, Rebecca's phone records show SOMEONE used her cellphone and accessed her voicemail (VM) at 12:50am 7/13/2011, but that does NOT mean Rebecca was the one who retrieved the VM, nor does it mean the content of the VM retrieved at that time contained a VM belonging to Jonah.
It simply means someone accessed Rebecca's VM messages at 12:50am. Period. It says NOTHING about the content of the VM nor the identity of the callers who left the VM.

Therefore, clearly, that is NOT proof that Jonah made any phone calls or left any VM to Rebecca around that time.

Until we see Jonah's phone records and/or some IT expert is able to retrieve the actual VM purported to have been left by Jonah, the so-called "suicide trigger VM" has NOT been proven.

 

[MyBelle]

Ok, I'm sorry I misunderstood your statement of "simply because her family hasn't asked for it". It seemed as that was stated as fact. Thanks.

My opinion is based on facts that I know. If you have a link that proves me wrong, please post it. Thanks.

 

[MyBelle]

No, Rebecca's phone records show SOMEONE used her cellphone and accessed her voicemail (VM) at 12:50am 7/13/2011, but that does NOT mean Rebecca was the one who retrieved the VM, nor does it mean the content of the VM retrieved at that time contained a VM belonging to Jonah.
It simply means someone accessed Rebecca's VM messages at 12:50am. Period. It says NOTHING about the content of the VM nor the identity of the callers who left the VM.

Therefore, clearly, that is NOT proof that Jonah made any phone calls or left any VM to Rebecca around that time.

Until we see Jonah's phone records and/or some IT expert is able to retrieve the actual VM purported to have been left by Jonah, the so-called "suicide trigger VM" has NOT been proven.

the call detail--time and duration--is kept by the provider of Jonah's service. That's proof that LE has seen and we have not and will not because it is private information. Jonah hasn't been charged with a crime.

 

[*Lash*]

Why did Becky board her dog Ocean?

“The San Diego detectives learned that Becky had arranged for Ocean to be at the Camp Diggity Dogs kennel for a few days after Max’s fall because she felt that was better with “people coming and going.”

Excerpt From: Rule, Ann. “Fatal Friends, Deadly Neighbors.”

Who did Ocean the dog belong to? (Evan aka Neil)

“Nevertheless, Evan said that he and Becky stayed in close contact. Their divorce was final in February 2011. Becky took Ocean, their Weimaraner, with her.

“Ocean was really my dog,” Evan said.”

Excerpt From: Rule, Ann. “Fatal Friends, Deadly Neighbors.”

 

[MyBelle]

Why did Becky board her dog Ocean?



Who did Ocean the dog belong to? (Evan aka Neil)

What people were "coming and going" from the mansion? Adam didn't stay inside the house, he was at the guest house. I think it was more likely that RZ boarded the dog because she was contemplating suicide.

JMO

 

[MaybeNotToday]

BBM.

What is your source for this information? (Bolded area.) I had not heard that before. How do you know this is true? When did Rebecca first want to have Ocean boarded? Was Ocean refused by Diggity Dogs? Did Rebecca obtain the additional vaccinations so the dog could board?

<mod snip>

I know that my pets have to have additional vaccinations if I want to board them at our pet hospital, but those vaccinations have always been optional for our pets. Our vets have always clearly told us they are optional, and only needed for a kennel. We don't board our pets, so we have always opted out of the additional expense for those extra vaccinations, and because one pet has health issues that we balance against the risks of the additional vaccinations. I hardly think our vets would characterize me as "neglecting" to have my pets "properly vaccinated".

Without more information, I cannot agree with your comment that Rebecca "neglected" to have Ocean "properly vaccinated". <mod snip>

Just as I also think it is also unfair to characterize Dina Shacknai as "neglectful" for not immediately following thru with a cardiac evaluation for Max's newly discovered heart murmur. The overwhelming majority of pediatric murmurs that are newly discovered in school age children are benign and incidental, and do not require an emergency or immediate consult. If the doc discovering Max's murmur felt it was an emergency, he or she would have directed Max's parents to a specialist within a day or so.

While I disagree and find fault with MANY things Dina has done, I do not fault her at all over not scheduling a pedes cardiac consult right away. Many criticize her for that, and call her neglectful for it, but I never have. FWIW.

Added: I found the link. Interesting that even the kennel guy didn't characterize Rebecca as "neglectful" because of the need for additional vaccinations. Remember that Ocean was only 14 months old-- maybe it wasn't the proper time for those vaccination yet. So I still cannot agree that Rebecca was "neglectful" for not having Ocean "properly" vaccinated.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1107/19/ijvm.01.html

---snipped---

Dang. You mean business.
But seriously do you really believe that a statement about Rebecca neglecting to vaccinate a pet is unusually harsh? Of all the opinions on this case, that one is unusually harsh?
This is the blatant double standard that I wish could be addressed in a healthy and mature way. It never is, but one can still dream.

 

[MyBelle]

Dang. You mean business.
But seriously do you really believe that a statement about Rebecca neglecting to vaccinate a pet is unusually harsh? Of all the opinions on this case, that one is unusually harsh?
This is the blatant double standard that I wish could be addressed in a healthy and mature way. It never is, but one can still dream.

That same transcript notes that the kennel owner was told by RZ that she wanted to get to the hospital to visit her injured son and he found it strange.

Getting the dog out of the house and worrying about what everything would cost is an indication to me that she was planning suicide and knew Jonah cared very much for the dog. I do wonder if she told Jonah she was boarding the dog. I bet she did not.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1107/19/ijvm.01.html


VELEZ-MITCHELL: And she was trying to arrange you taking the dog so she could go to the hospital, but she never ended up going to the hospital. Tell me what you said you found very strange about that.

GREENBERG: Well, like you said, she made it clear that she wanted the dog out and be -- be boarded by Camp Diggity Dogs so that she could go to the hospital to be with her son, but as it turns out, like you said, she was at home. So what was the purpose of getting the dog out of the house?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And that wasn`t her son. That was the son of her boyfriend, the pharmaceutical mogul who...

 

[IQuestion]

What people were "coming and going" from the mansion? Adam didn't stay inside the house, he was at the guest house. I think it was more likely that RZ boarded the dog because she was contemplating suicide.

JMO

Bolded and enlarged above by me!
Mybelle I read and ALSO listened to NR's Chan 8 interview. And she clearly stated Rebecca picked up her and NR's son at the airport on Monday, drove them to the hospital, and then still managed to take their luggage to them later in the same evening. (That is a lot of driving!)
Then of course Rebecca, took her sister to the airport, picked up AS, took him to the hospital, took HL to the airport (somewhere in all of her driving/limo duties), and then even drove AS back to the mansion.
So "technically" people were not "coming and going FROM the mansion" but they were certainly being "shuttled from airport-to-hospital-to-Coronado" all day and night by Rebecca. Maybe Rebecca was being told "more relatives" would be arriving to visit MS in the hospital? Remember Rebecca did not receive the "fait accompli phone call of MS's irreversible condition" until 12:30am, Wednesday....so I can see no reason for her not planning to board the dog if more relatives would be arriving and demanding her time.

My first question would be, was the dog ever boarded before when RZ accompanied JS on out of town trips?
And as always, I feel there are too many outstanding questions and really weird coincidences for me to accept any of LE's conclusions.

 

[MaybeNotToday]

That same transcript notes that the kennel owner was told by RZ that she wanted to get to the hospital to visit her injured son and he found it strange.

Getting the dog out of the house and worrying about what everything would cost is an indication to me that she was planning suicide and knew Jonah cared very much for the dog. I do wonder if she told Jonah she was boarding the dog. I bet she did not.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1107/19/ijvm.01.html


VELEZ-MITCHELL: And she was trying to arrange you taking the dog so she could go to the hospital, but she never ended up going to the hospital. Tell me what you said you found very strange about that.

GREENBERG: Well, like you said, she made it clear that she wanted the dog out and be -- be boarded by Camp Diggity Dogs so that she could go to the hospital to be with her son, but as it turns out, like you said, she was at home. So what was the purpose of getting the dog out of the house?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And that wasn`t her son. That was the son of her boyfriend, the pharmaceutical mogul who...

Whoah. I had never seen the transcript. . . If I was on the fence, that sure would tip me over.

1) why would she call him her son? 2) why would she give a reason for boarding that was not the truth? 3) or did she tell the truth and then change her mind?

Was this at the same time she misspoke and called her sister her daughter?

IMO, all those misstatements to me indicate she was very upset. Even though her sister said she didn't feel guilty (which IMO is kind of strange), it's clear she was upset. And honestly, who wouldn't feel upset or or at least a little guilty?

 

[Gilgamesh]

That same transcript notes that the kennel owner was told by RZ that she wanted to get to the hospital to visit her injured son and he found it strange.

Getting the dog out of the house and worrying about what everything would cost is an indication to me that she was planning suicide and knew Jonah cared very much for the dog. I do wonder if she told Jonah she was boarding the dog. I bet she did not.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1107/19/ijvm.01.html


VELEZ-MITCHELL: And she was trying to arrange you taking the dog so she could go to the hospital, but she never ended up going to the hospital. Tell me what you said you found very strange about that.

GREENBERG: Well, like you said, she made it clear that she wanted the dog out and be -- be boarded by Camp Diggity Dogs so that she could go to the hospital to be with her son, but as it turns out, like you said, she was at home. So what was the purpose of getting the dog out of the house?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And that wasn`t her son. That was the son of her boyfriend, the pharmaceutical mogul who...

I bet that she did. In fact, I bet that Jonah told her to. In fact, I see a subtle planting of spin here. The way you see it is one way to look at it. How about this way:
Rebecca was told to board the dog and then she was attacked and murdered. The dog wasn't there to save her, was he?

 

[IQuestion]

I bet that she did. In fact, I bet that Jonah told her to. In fact, I see a subtle planting of spin here. The way you see it is one way to look at it. How about this way:
Rebecca was told to board the dog and then she was attacked and murdered. The dog wasn't there to save her, was he?

Great observations Gilgamesh! I agree with EVERYTHING you just wrote, except for one word..... The only word I don't agree with is "SUBTLE." The sentence flows just as well if written as, "I see a planting of spin here.":blushing:

 

[kittychi]

What people were "coming and going" from the mansion? Adam didn't stay inside the house, he was at the guest house. I think it was more likely that RZ boarded the dog because she was contemplating suicide.

JMO

Weimaraners are relatively high maintenance dogs. It would only make sense to have him taken care of and out of the way. Rebecca had no idea what the next days would bring, who she may have to pick up, take stuff to the hospital for Jonah, etc. it only makes sense when a family is dealing with that kind of crisis.

Also...you are saying that she cared more about the dog than her own family...she made sure the dog was taken care of but didn't even leave a note for her family? That just does not fly.

 

[Zinn]

No, Rebecca's phone records show SOMEONE used her cellphone and accessed her voicemail (VM) at 12:50am 7/13/2011, but that does NOT mean Rebecca was the one who retrieved the VM, nor does it mean the content of the VM retrieved at that time contained a VM belonging to Jonah.
It simply means someone accessed Rebecca's VM messages at 12:50am. Period. It says NOTHING about the content of the VM nor the identity of the callers who left the VM.

Therefore, clearly, that is NOT proof that Jonah made any phone calls or left any VM to Rebecca around that time.

Until we see Jonah's phone records and/or some IT expert is able to retrieve the actual VM purported to have been left by Jonah, the so-called "suicide trigger VM" has NOT been proven.

It's also possible JS left a message covering multiple topics, including Max's condition and DS's whereabouts at that time. For instance, if DS was not at the bedside, JS could have been concerned about leaving Max's bedside with nobody to relieve him, given the dire situation. For all we know, he could've been calling Rebecca to ask her to relieve him at Max's bedside so he could get some sleep. Without hearing the message, we don't know.

If the content of the voicemail would have been useful in bolstering LE's theory, I strongly suspect the investigator would have been sure to retrieve the message from the server before it was forever deleted.

All of the above is just my opinion.

 

[screecher]

Or maybe JS did call, left a message for Rebecca WARNING her to get out of there because Dina left the hospital enraged and Nina left hospital too.

Remember Nina's babbling on and on about her handling Rebecca's phone? She went on and on...I bet she was the who checked, listened then erased JS message.

 

[kittychi]

They did find out it was Jonah by speaking to him. Jonah's call detail for his phone would also show the call was made.

http://www.760kfmb.com/story/154850...e-calls-to-rebecca-zahau?clienttype=printable

News 8 obtained two pages of AT&T billing logs from the 32-year-old's cell phone, which family members said was a newer-model phone using the Windows Phone mobile operating system.

The cell phone records confirm Zahau listened to her voicemail for two minutes at 12:50 a.m. on July 13, about two hours before her estimated time of death.

BBM - Your link does not say anything about Jonah's call detail showing the call was made. This is what was in your link: "Detectives said the message was erased and officials will not confirm who left the voicemail."\

And the cell records do not confirm that ZAHAU listened to her voicemail for two minutes at 12:50 on July 13.

As long as LE is using people's "word" as part of an investigation, how about Mary's "word" that Rebecca would not kill herself, especially in this manner.

:shakehead:

 

[kittychi]

It's also possible JS left a message covering multiple topics, including Max's condition and DS's whereabouts at that time. For instance, if DS was not at the bedside, JS could have been concerned about leaving Max's bedside with nobody to relieve him, given the dire situation. For all we know, he could've been calling Rebecca to ask her to relieve him at Max's bedside so he could get some sleep. Without hearing the message, we don't know.

If the content of the voicemail would have been useful in bolstering LE's theory, I strongly suspect the investigator would have been sure to retrieve the message from the server before it was forever deleted.

All of the above is just my opinion.

But they didn't think they needed to bolster their theory. They didn't hear the voicemail, they took Jonah's word for it about what it said and what time. No need to do any more bolstering.

 

[inthedark14]

What about it needs examination and why is it relevant now? Why wouldn't Jonah inform RZ of Max's grave condition?

http://www.760kfmb.com/story/154850...hone-calls-to-rebecca-zahau?clienttype=mobile

"We know from the investigation that (voicemail) message that was left on her phone was to inform Rebecca of Maxie's grave condition and imminent death," said San Diego County Sheriff's Sgt. Dave Nemeth at a news conference earlier this month.

Zahau's sister, Mary Zahau-Loehner, said detectives told her that Jonah Shacknai left the voicemail on Rebecca's phone around 12:30 a.m. on the morning of her death.

So we all agree, JS SAID he left a voicemail on RZ's phone around 12:30 a.m., we all agree he said that he did even though RZ's phone records show that she never had a missed call from him, or anyone else during this time. IMO, if JS's phone records show that he did indeed leave a VM for her, her phone was shut off at that time. So are you saying that she was already doing all things that would need to be done to complete this elaborate "suicide" and then, and only then, she retrieves the VM from JS? Or is it possible that RZ, after speaking with her sister, put her cell phone to charge and started getting ready for bed as she was planning to bring JS a clean set of clothes in the morning? IMHO someone else checked that VM, if it ever really did exist.

This is, perhaps, one of reasons why the Z team received the cease and desist letter from JSs attorney.




RE the phone message that AB states "no one has ever heard", well, RZ heard it and then erased it. Perhaps RZ did not want anyone else to learn the contents of Jonah's message.

It is highly doubtful that DS or NR had RZs pass code for that performing that function just as much as it is doubtful that JS would lie about making the phone call to RZ knowing LE could obtain ph records.

jmho

So do you know for a fact that RZ used a passcode for her voicemails? I honestly know perhaps one person who does that. Her phone was not a business phone, it was her personal phone that she by her own phone records, used quite often. It seems to me that people who use their phones as frequently as RZ did, make them very accessible. Perhaps if LE would provide her family with her phone that question could be answered.

BBM. LE had evidence of the exact time the message was received. JS not only confirmed he sent it, he told LE about the content. He had no reason to lie about any aspect of it and at the time, he had no idea whether LE could retrieve it.

JMO

Yes, JS did tell LE what the content of that VM was. I wonder why JS didn't tell RZ these things while he was out to dinner with her earlier in the day. Did some kind nurse tell him that MS' condition was so dire that evening? It would be interesting to see which of MS' doctors were around at midnight that night to speak with JS.

BBM. I agree and think the phone call was the final straw, not the beginning of her decision. I think Dr. Peterson was questioning the description of the accident long before the hospital contacted CPS and, in turn, Jonah was demanding answers from RZ.

imo, the reason she boarded the dog was because she was moving out at Jonah's request.

JMO

Since you believe that JS told RZ to move out in the VM in question, why do you think he didn't supply LE with that information? Because he was so forthcoming with the content of his voicemail?

ALWAYS MOO

 

[kittychi]

We have JSs word for it as well as AT&Ts explanation as to why the ph call would not appear on RZs billing statement.

LE did not conclude the death as a suicide based on non-verifiable evidence. There is ample evidence and all of it linked to RZ by fingerprints and DNA.

RZ wanted to implicate others in her death, perhaps, erroneously thinking that no one would possibly believe that she would hang her naked self outdoors at the mansion. In the beginning, I thought she was murdered, too. However, after researching the case, I could not overlook nor misinterpret the compelling evidence.

I believe she planned her suicide before the mysterious phone call from JS. I think RZ knew that she was in troubled waters and had made her decision by the time she boarded her dog, Ocean.

Oh, but RZ couldn't board Ocean when she first wanted to bc she had neglected to have Ocean properly vaccinated.

jmho

Seriously? You would make that comment to show what an irresponsible person Rebecca was? You did know about Dina's delinquent payment on a La Jolla rental house, right?
http://www.10news.com/news/evidence-sealed-in-coronado-mansion-death-investigation

 

[MaybeNotToday]

Ok, so RZ lapsed in vaccs and shoplifted , Dina orders too many pizzas and lapsed in rent.

Even? Haha just kidding please don't answer that.

 

[bourne]

So we all agree, JS SAID he left a voicemail on RZ's phone around 12:30 a.m., we all agree he said that he did even though RZ's phone records show that she never had a missed call from him, or anyone else during this time. IMO, if JS's phone records show that he did indeed leave a VM for her, her phone was shut off at that time. So are you saying that she was already doing all things that would need to be done to complete this elaborate "suicide" and then, and only then, she retrieves the VM from JS? Or is it possible that RZ, after speaking with her sister, put her cell phone to charge and started getting ready for bed as she was planning to bring JS a clean set of clothes in the morning? IMHO someone else checked that VM, if it ever really did exist.



So do you know for a fact that RZ used a passcode for her voicemails? I honestly know perhaps one person who does that. Her phone was not a business phone, it was her personal phone that she by her own phone records, used quite often. It seems to me that people who use their phones as frequently as RZ did, make them very accessible. Perhaps if LE would provide her family with her phone that question could be answered.



Yes, JS did tell LE what the content of that VM was. I wonder why JS didn't tell RZ these things while he was out to dinner with her earlier in the day. Did some kind nurse tell him that MS' condition was so dire that evening? It would be interesting to see which of MS' doctors were around at midnight that night to speak with JS.



Since you believe that JS told RS to move out in the VM in question, why do you think he didn't supply LE with that information? Because he was so forthcoming with the content of his voicemail?

ALWAYS MOO

Excellent points! None of us should believe ANYTHING anyone says surrounding a "violent, suspicious death" unless there is unbiased, independent, corroborating physical evidence to what that person's statements. Otherwise, it's like believing a criminal's words at face value when they have a self-serving reason to lie.