Australia Samantha Murphy, 51, last seen leaving her property to go for a run in the Canadian State Forest, Ballarat, 4 Feb 2024 *Arrest* #12

[australianwebsleuth]

I ignore most of these go to crime experts - most of the time they know nothing about the case in the first place. On a recent and highly publicised drowning case in the UK a some of them engaged in wild and unfounded speculation.

They get paid to comment. “Make sure you throw in some controversy to make it interesting”

 

[emirates1957]

Hopefully the Prosecution have a Forensic Botanist on their list of witnesses

Hopefully the one that nailed Gerard Baden Clay.

 

[drsleuth]

Hopefully the one that nailed Gerard Baden Clay.

Yes Dr Gordon Guymer

The trials and triumphs of botany

www.une.edu.au

“We are often called in to work on drug-related matters or to provide supporting evidence in criminal matters, usually to indicate where a crime happened or where a suspect had been,” Gordon said. “I never expected, when I took on the Baden-Clay case, that it would end up occupying a number of months of my life and that I would be so front-and-centre as an expert witness.

“There was the forensic work to identify the species taken from Allison’s hair, visiting the crime scene to identify what was growing there, and then comparing that with plants at the house. It took some time to collate all the evidence, but what I gathered and the way I presented it … it was an open and shut case that Allison had died at her home. The Defence reportedly referred to me as “the most dangerous man”. I was just pleased that my skills and expertise could help to ensure justice.”

I hope they are able to retrieve some botanical material connecting PS ( if they can find SM )

 

[Warshawski]

This area is his own backyard,.. he knows it as well as anyone knows their backyard,

He has lived there all his life.

I keep in mind that abandoned mines are extremely dangerous to him, and him loaded down with an inert dead body of a fully grown woman , trying to get a foothold, shifting around at the entrance to a crumbling mine is about as dangerous a game as anyone can play. Bodies dont just slip down mines by themselves, he would have had to work up a hell of a sweat that hot morning to play out this scenario....

These mines are abandoned for the reason that they are no good to enter anymore, the entrance has collapsed, the tunnel has collapsed, it's all a rocky crumbling dangerous unmapped, unknown, unregistered hole in the ground, how deep no one knows, it could be 1/2 metre, or 30 metres... it could be full of red bellied browns, cranky at being disturbed....

As you say, grew up here, it is his ‘backyard’.

Frightening as it is for a parent to consider, and they are all the things you’ve mentioned, but possibly he (& mates) explored old mine shafts as a kid, and having come out unscathed, and with thousands to choose from, I’m pretty sure he would know some safe spots v those too dangerous to go near etc….

Maybe some of those exploratory areas were still included in his bike riding treks - do I recall correctly his neighbours made mention ?

However, something more than a motor bike would be required to transport a body. I suspect access to those ‘safe’ places could be limited for a vehicle, but I don’t know that area; a horse may work !

I do ponder over the fact that Police are/were adamant that made a deliberate attack on SM which resulted in her death ( ie the Murder charge) however they seem to have no knowledge of what transpired from that point.
* do they have visual footage of said ‘deliberate attack’
* if so, why no visual footage of the removal of her body from the scene of her death
* why no tracking ability from then on

JMO.

 

[Warshawski]

From what I’m reading it seems quite possible as they latch on to, and follow the smell of decay which can travel & stick & spread.
In a doco I watched, during the search the cadaver dogs missed the body that was buried beneath them. The body was later dug up, and it had been chopped up in pieces and wrapped in disposable nappies which helped to contain the decay and smell.
So environmental conditions and how the body is arranged or interned would factor into it.
Nevertheless this week, after 2 or 3 (?) days of full on searching for Sam the dogs found nothing? No wafts of anything?
How exasperating to have such a huge search op, which is suggestive of a strong lead, with no result. VicPol must get so frustrated. No wonder they were dancing at the dam.

IMO expecting a positive result was possibly unrealistic, given the size of the area being covered V the number of cadaver dogs on-site ( I have no idea how many dogs were employed. .. but it’s my understanding that VIC has none, so they were borrowed from NSW - which I think only has 3 such dogs )
I’ve seen suggested that these dogs can cover 1.3 square klm per day.
Enfield State Forest is 44 km2!
Seems to me that there’ll need to be many more days of intensive searching.

JMO.

 

[Trooper]

As you say, grew up here, it is his ‘backyard’.

Frightening as it is for a parent to consider, and they are all the things you’ve mentioned, but possibly he (& mates) explored old mine shafts as a kid, and having come out unscathed, and with thousands to choose from, I’m pretty sure he would know some safe spots v those too dangerous to go near etc….

Maybe some of those exploratory areas were still included in his bike riding treks - do I recall correctly his neighbours made mention ?

However, something more than a motor bike would be required to transport a body. I suspect access to those ‘safe’ places could be limited for a vehicle, but I don’t know that area; a horse may work !

I do ponder over the fact that Police are/were adamant that made a deliberate attack on SM which resulted in her death ( ie the Murder charge) however they seem to have no knowledge of what transpired from that point.
* do they have visual footage of said ‘deliberate attack’
* if so, why no visual footage of the removal of her body from the scene of her death
* why no tracking ability from then on

JMO.

Huge questions, Victoria Iphigenia, way back in maybe the first thread, there was mention of perhaps a static camera, like Attenborough uses, to capture film in the forest of shy animals, and birds... put in there by the Friends of the Forest, a group that is a constant presence in that part of the Wookwookarung State Park where she was running.. that would explain this part of the crime being captured, but not the disposal part.... as a theory , it has a lot going for it, he , Stephenson would probably be unaware of those cameras thru-out the Park, completely oblivious to the entire filming of his attack and murder of Mrs Murphy....

Police were adamant it was not a hit and run operation, as well... Patton was clear about that...

This is merely one theory, there are probably thousands !!!

​

 

[HoneyBunOne]

As you say, grew up here, it is his ‘backyard’.

Frightening as it is for a parent to consider, and they are all the things you’ve mentioned, but possibly he (& mates) explored old mine shafts as a kid, and having come out unscathed, and with thousands to choose from, I’m pretty sure he would know some safe spots v those too dangerous to go near etc….

Maybe some of those exploratory areas were still included in his bike riding treks - do I recall correctly his neighbours made mention ?

However, something more than a motor bike would be required to transport a body. I suspect access to those ‘safe’ places could be limited for a vehicle, but I don’t know that area; a horse may work !

I do ponder over the fact that Police are/were adamant that made a deliberate attack on SM which resulted in her death ( ie the Murder charge) however they seem to have no knowledge of what transpired from that point.
* do they have visual footage of said ‘deliberate attack’
* if so, why no visual footage of the removal of her body from the scene of her death
* why no tracking ability from then on

JMO.

I also agree with Trooper in the above comment about a possible static camera being hidden in the bush, sometimes they're used to catch illegal rubbish dumping, and for monitoring wildlife activity etc. If that were the case, law enforcement would only have a direction that Samantha was taken after the attack, and perhaps nothing more. (That's not to say that the accused could not have circled back and ended up in the opposite direction.) That would explain why they could have hit a brick wall in regards to her whereabouts from then on, but for all we know police could have used a variety of techniques to narrow down the area where she may be, but because of the terrain, makes it a difficult job of finding her.

Is there a possibility that Samantha was able to film some of the attack, without her attacker's knowledge? I'm not sure at what point police would have had access to her phone data though, I believe Apple are quite tight fisted when it comes to handing over the private information of their users.

 

[mrjitty]

Huge questions, Victoria Iphigenia, way back in maybe the first thread, there was mention of perhaps a static camera, like Attenborough uses, to capture film in the forest of shy animals, and birds... put in there by the Friends of the Forest, a group that is a constant presence in that part of the Wookwookarung State Park where she was running.. that would explain this part of the crime being captured, but not the disposal part.... as a theory , it has a lot going for it, he , Stephenson would probably be unaware of those cameras thru-out the Park, completely oblivious to the entire filming of his attack and murder of Mrs Murphy....

Police were adamant it was not a hit and run operation, as well... Patton was clear about that...

This is merely one theory, there are probably thousands !!!

​

Could be telematics data from his car, or location (not ping) data out of his phone.

 

[Trooper]

Could be telematics data from his car, or location (not ping) data out of his phone.

Indeed, Mr J, that too, the thing is , whatever VICPOL has, it has convinced them that Mrs Murphy and Mr Stephenson intercepted with each other ( according to police , for the first time in their lives ) at Mt Clear at sometime near 8am, and by 8am that Sunday morning, she was dead, not just dead, but murdered, by Mr Stephenson only, nobody else, by way of attacking her.

Whatever VICPOL has, it clearly shows all these elements. Time, persons, action, method and manner. Probably clearly shows, and records, the sounds of, in addition, most likely.

Not just pings, I reckon. A lot more than telemetry, but that too.

 

[Kemug]

My anticipation is building as we get closer and closer to the date when we might actually learn some facts and proper evidence - when is the exact date again?

 

[Trooper]

My anticipation is building as we get closer and closer to the date when we might actually learn some facts and proper evidence - when is the exact date again?

November 14th, provisionally.

I say provisionally, because things happen, he may suddenly wish to express a plea, he may have evidence he wishes to be considered by the DPP< , the DPP may come up with some more elements of the crime that were not covered in the 'extensive disclosure' ,, the 'unprecedented' material given to the defence, ... NOV 14 can be pencilled in, in heavy blacklead but not biro, just yet.

 

[Kemug]

November 14th, provisionally.

I say provisionally, because things happen, he may suddenly wish to express a plea, he may have evidence he wishes to be considered by the DPP< , the DPP may come up with some more elements of the crime that were not covered in the 'extensive disclosure' ,, the 'unprecedented' material given to the defence, ... NOV 14 can be pencilled in, in heavy blacklead but not biro, just yet.

Thanks Troops, much appreciated, as always!