Sentencing and beyond- JA General Discussion #7

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ALV never wrote a report. The redacted and unredacted access refers to her 100 pages of notes. (Just checked what I typed on appeals chronology in appeals thread. Sorry for the confusion - used both "notes" and "report" in that section, but definitely only notes were being referred to).

My guess is the DT redacted pesky little details like ALV's occasional mention of discrepancies in the 's lies. Like, paper vs. computer.

JM definitely had access to the unredacted version.

I think it's bizarre that ALV was never required to submit an official report.

Your mention of the pesky little details reminds me that ALV's approach to anything factual she got caught on was to say something to the effect...."same difference." Computer vs. paper? "Same diff." Broken glass vs. peeling apples? "Same diff." Email vs. text message? "Same diff." No primary evidence for TA's point of view vs. manufactured evidence for his point of view? "Same diff."

There's something very wrong with that woman....
 
Random thought here.

When I first heard about this case I saw her last name and (in my mind) I pronounced it in the Spanish way. I was tickled when Juan Martinez pronounced it that way, too. It must have irked her because something caused Nurmi to ask her -- right off the bat -- when she was on the witness stand, how she pronounced her name, which is how it became "Air-E-Us." Not sure if JM intended to get her goat or if he was just pronouncing her name as it is normally pronounced, but I like that she was offended. :)

Yes, there is definitely something in the pronunciation. Also, in the second trial - Dr Fonseca - played games with Juan Martinez re his name. I forgot to mention - if anyone gets a chance - scroll to the end of the video I posted above re the coded magazines. I defy anyone not to laugh out loud as Juan pins her to the ropes re the remote control she gave to Brewer. The very one she stole from her grandmother's house. I've seen it before but she flounders around like a fish on a hook. Only to be saved by a break. Juan knows exactly how far he can push her on this one. Man is a genius.
 
Yes, there is definitely something in the pronunciation. Also, in the second trial - Dr Fonseca - played games with Juan Martinez re his name. I forgot to mention - if anyone gets a chance - scroll to the end of the video I posted above re the coded magazines. I defy anyone not to laugh out loud as Juan pins her to the ropes re the remote control she gave to Brewer. The very one she stole from her grandmother's house. I've seen it before but she flounders around like a fish on a hook. Only to be saved by a break. Juan knows exactly how far he can push her on this one. Man is a genius.

BBM

Yes, she did, and I found that so disrespectful. When it was happening, and we were only hearing about stuff via twitter, I (charitably) thought it must have been due to her having a thick accent. Only later (upon watching the videos) did I learn that she had no foreign accent whatsoever! She was employing theater craft!

Just another witness for the defense that I find to be of questionable repute...
 
Just wanted to let everyone know that I had a terrible accident yesterday, but I am doing better now. I decided yesterday to go horseback riding which I haven't done in years. Well, I climb on the horse and started out slow and then we went a little faster and then we were going as fast as the horse could do, all of a sudden I fell off and caught my foot in the stirrup. The horse was dragging me around in a circle. It wouldn't stop, just going around and around in a circle. If it weren't for a quick thinking man (I owe my life to) I would probably not have made it. Thank goodness the store manager at Wal Mart came out and unplugged the machine.
 
Just wanted to let everyone know that I had a terrible accident yesterday, but I am doing better now. I decided yesterday to go horseback riding which I haven't done in years. Well, I climb on the horse and started out slow and then we went a little faster and then we were going as fast as the horse could do, all of a sudden I fell off and caught my foot in the stirrup. The horse was dragging me around in a circle. It wouldn't stop, just going around and around in a circle. If it weren't for a quick thinking man (I owe my life to) I would probably not have made it. Thank goodness the store manager at Wal Mart came out and unplugged the machine.


::deadhorse::drumroll:
 
Random thought here.

When I first heard about this case I saw her last name and (in my mind) I pronounced it in the Spanish way. I was tickled when Juan Martinez pronounced it that way, too. It must have irked her because something caused Nurmi to ask her -- right off the bat -- when she was on the witness stand, how she pronounced her name, which is how it became "Air-E-Us." Not sure if JM intended to get her goat or if he was just pronouncing her name as it is normally pronounced, but I like that she was offended. :)

IIRC, JM knew that hated to be called Ms. Arias with or without the Spanish method. In his book?, KN mentions her last name would make have a temper tantrum or some such thing. She wanted to be called by the J-name. I'll bet she invented the Air-E-Us pronunciation for herself, 'cos if not Arrrias, it would almost certainly be pronounced are-e-us. JM never used Air-E-Us.
 
Hey! Haven't been here for awhile... so didn't get answer these.

franquerolane said:
Niner, my husband has stage 4 kidney cancer (there is no stage 5), and we talked tonight about me finding him dead one morning. He said, "Be happy." I know that the less agony he goes through, the happier I will be.

I'm so sorry to hear that! a :hug: for you. Yeah, the pain they go thru is tough, and there is nothing you can do to make them feel better...

Cinnalauda said:
I'm very sorry for your loss Niner. He's at peace now, and I hope you can find some peace too.

Thank you! Getting there, I think...:) I knew this was coming, but unfortunately, just too soon.

MaLou said:
I am so sorry for your loss, Niner.
MsJosie said:
I am sorry for your loss Niner.
TrialWatcher said:
The sweetness of your words made me cry, Niner. My condolences.
Caylee Advocate said:
Niner, I am so very sorry to read of your loss. I just now am able to read the thread. It has been a struggle for the both of you and now he rests eternally. The pics you posted on Sidebar are something you will remember a lifetime. Though he is now at peace, you will have your memories to get you through.

Thank you all! Appreciate it! Yes, I have memories that will never go away! :luv:

Salberg - my Huz took tramadol for his cancer. A :hug: for your puppy Shane!

RickshawFan said:
It seems that there's an assumption going in this article that the rashes are all from one source. Rashes are probably not rare in an environment like Perryville, and there's not a whole lot else to do there except scratch and argue with your cellie. They very well could have several different causes. Heck, needs all that hemarrhoid cream: one source of itch right there.

:laughcry:

20 more posts to read...
 
NINJAS TO SELF-DEFENSE LIE



PART 1. NINJAS AND NO MITIGATION.


October 2008. DP notice filed. The ninjas did it.

Early-mid 2009. Mitigation investigation—Brewer, MM, parents, brother, grandparents, employers. No mitigation to be found, and precious few folks who are willing to say anything good about the .

May 22, 2009. tells Judge Duncan she wants attorneys Schaffer and Greg P. fired. Duncan tells her to talk it out with Schaffer.

August 18, 2009. Schaffer and Greg P. withdraw. Nurmi and Washington appointed. The ninjas did it.

October 14, 2009. DT begins relentless campaign to access TA’s texts and emails.

November 13, 2009. DT wants access to TA’s hard drive.

December 28, 2009. Dr. Samuels administers MCMI test. He will visit/interview the 12 times over 4 years and administer 2 tests.

January 15, 2010. Dr. Samuels administers PTSD test. The ninjas did it.


PART II. THE NINJAS DIDN’T DO IT & THE PEDO LIE IS BORN.

(Perhaps Nurmi tried out the ninja story with students sometime in late January, hoping to convince the the ninjas simply wouldn’t do as a defense? And the came up with pedo and abuse because she thought…worst case, TA’s family would back down and agree to a 2nd degree plea, best case she’d con a jury and walk free?)


February 2-3, 2010. Two day forensic evaluation by Karp (interviews). Typed report by Dr. Karp; in it is first mention of pedo accusations, saying internet and it happened on Jan 21, 2008.

Reports by of physical abuse “too numerous to count” (DeMarte, PP2 testimony). Broken finger is linked to TA rage on February 5, 2008, the day she was fired by Mimi’s. No childhood abuse.

February 10, 2010. Dr. Karp administers TMI test and DV test.

On DV test. Question: “Used force to make me have sex.” Told Karp-“some of the time.” Same test post-verdict, on December 2013, told Geffner—“never.”
Question. “Demanded sex when I didn’t want it.” Told Karp-“all of the time.” Told Geffner-“some of the time.”


PART III. BUTTRESSING THE PEDO & ABUSE LIES WITH FORGED LETTERS; TRANSITIONING TO FULL LIE OF SELF-DEFENSE

April 10, 2010. Ten forged letters sent to Nurmi. The letters are dated November 27, 2006 - May 27, 2008. The letter referencing pedo (and TA calling himself “pure evil,” the exact words Travis used to describe her May 26) is dated January 21, 2007. This is the letter Nurmi told Sky about in June 2011; the letter said TA was interested in Sky’s son.

The pedo letter had Travis telling JA to call him after she read his confession, not to judge him, and that he knows she’ll be compassionate.

The forged January 21 letter is in keeping with the pedo not yet being linked to physical violence, so not yet the core of her self-defense claim that TA’s violence resulted from her knowledge of his pedo.

April 29, 2010. Handwritten notes by Karp on pedo say bed and *advertiser censored* on paper. (Perhaps…changed because the DT didn’t find *advertiser censored* on TA’s hard drive)?

June 18, 2010. Psych evaluation by Samuels. Best guess- -an evaluation intended to establish a causal link between the pedo lie and the abuse lie.

June 22, 2010. The DT drops ninjas, files notice of affirmative defense.

July 2010. JM motion to preclude pedo letters from trial.

JM describes some of the content of letters in his motion: sexual acts and fantasies, regret over his behavior, no “corroborated acts of abuse.” In his book says one or more of the letters was very disparaging of Deanna.

Says letters can be authenticated by an expert, but would need originals. Neither originals or the source of emailer has been disclosed.

The “current version (of her story) is that Travis became angry when she dropped the camera.”

The DT argued: letters are evidence of sexual and physical abuse. Goes to her awareness of prior acts of violence. Contains “confession to having assaulted her.”

(MM was to corroborate abuse by lying that he’d seen bruises on her. IMO, the ’s emphasis on sex was to conceal/deny/take revenge for the fact TA had rejected her, a storyline she began working on in April-May 2008 ---the May 2 email about tree “fantasy,” TA getting jealous when she mentioned her fictictious BF’s, etc.).

DT: Letters are probative because every aspect of her relationship could give rise to self-defense OR to heat of passion. (Sounds like Nurmi was trying to keep the door open to his preferred “snapped” defense).

October 26, 2010. First “plea offer” by . All the threats she’d reprise in her 3rd and last plea offer in July 2011 were already there…that a trial would expose Travis as a “sexual deviant,” a “sexually active playboy hiding behind the façade of a Mormon choir boy,” that marriages would be destroyed and friendships ruined, yada yada.

Judging by the spiteful evil words directed at TA’s family during sentencing, I’m betting the is still pissed the TA’s family didn’t get with her program and agree to a plea.






-------------------------------------------
 
Hey! Haven't been here for awhile... so didn't get answer these.



I'm so sorry to hear that! a :hug: for you. Yeah, the pain they go thru is tough, and there is nothing you can do to make them feel better...



Thank you! Getting there, I think...:) I knew this was coming, but unfortunately, just too soon.






Thank you all! Appreciate it! Yes, I have memories that will never go away! :luv:

Salberg - my Huz took tramadol for his cancer. A :hug: for your puppy Shane!



:laughcry:

20 more posts to read...


(((((Niner))))))
 
TrialWatcher said:
snipped by me...
Your thread on Appeals makes it easy to see at a glance how it all fits chronologically. Thank you.

I totally agree! Great job Hope4More!

So - as I understand it - after her appeals - they will release all those "sealed" records. correct?

RickshawFan said:
snipped by me...
I think it's bizarre that ALV was never required to submit an official report.

I thought so too - I thought I saw another trial, where the expert didn't have a report, and he was excused as a witness...

TrialWatcher said:
snipped by me...
Juan knows exactly how far he can push her on this one. Man is a genius

Agree with you here! :juanettes: I believe he's the best prosecutor that I've watched do a trial!

Caylee Advocate said:
Just wanted to let everyone know that I had a terrible accident yesterday, but I am doing better now. I decided yesterday to go horseback riding which I haven't done in years. Well, I climb on the horse and started out slow and then we went a little faster and then we were going as fast as the horse could do, all of a sudden I fell off and caught my foot in the stirrup. The horse was dragging me around in a circle. It wouldn't stop, just going around and around in a circle. If it weren't for a quick thinking man (I owe my life to) I would probably not have made it. Thank goodness the store manager at Wal Mart came out and unplugged the machine.

LOL! Here I was going to give you a hug, until I read your last line! :laughcry: Good one!!
 
The discrepancy between the January pedo letter year - 2007 vs 2008, could that have been what the coded magazine messages referenced? I always thought those messages were for MM. The correct year needed to be 2008 for the , & the author "f$@'d up" the dates (quoting the message here, mods- no profanity from me!).
I watched the video of testimony above where the killer did indeed squirm about why she went back to DB's home the morning of 6/3/08. She was definite caught there.
Did anyone also note how she refused to answer Juan's question as stated when he asked her whether she stopped to see either MM or DB "on the way to kill Mr. Alexander"? Probably so proud of herself that she "caught" Juan trying to get her to admit premeditation with that question.
 
NINJAS TO SELF-DEFENSE LIE



PART 1. NINJAS AND NO MITIGATION.


October 2008. DP notice filed. The ninjas did it.

Early-mid 2009. Mitigation investigation—Brewer, MM, parents, brother, grandparents, employers. No mitigation to be found, and precious few folks who are willing to say anything good about the .

May 22, 2009. tells Judge Duncan she wants attorneys Schaffer and Greg P. fired. Duncan tells her to talk it out with Schaffer.

August 18, 2009. Schaffer and Greg P. withdraw. Nurmi and Washington appointed. The ninjas did it.

October 14, 2009. DT begins relentless campaign to access TA’s texts and emails.

November 13, 2009. DT wants access to TA’s hard drive.

December 28, 2009. Dr. Samuels administers MCMI test. He will visit/interview the 12 times over 4 years and administer 2 tests.

January 15, 2010. Dr. Samuels administers PTSD test. The ninjas did it.


PART II. THE NINJAS DIDN’T DO IT & THE PEDO LIE IS BORN.

(Perhaps Nurmi tried out the ninja story with students sometime in late January, hoping to convince the the ninjas simply wouldn’t do as a defense? And the came up with pedo and abuse because she thought…worst case, TA’s family would back down and agree to a 2nd degree plea, best case she’d con a jury and walk free?)


February 2-3, 2010. Two day forensic evaluation by Karp (interviews). Typed report by Dr. Karp; in it is first mention of pedo accusations, saying internet and it happened on Jan 21, 2008.

Reports by of physical abuse “too numerous to count” (DeMarte, PP2 testimony). Broken finger is linked to TA rage on February 5, 2008, the day she was fired by Mimi’s. No childhood abuse.

February 10, 2010. Dr. Karp administers TMI test and DV test.

On DV test. Question: “Used force to make me have sex.” Told Karp-“some of the time.” Same test post-verdict, on December 2013, told Geffner—“never.”
Question. “Demanded sex when I didn’t want it.” Told Karp-“all of the time.” Told Geffner-“some of the time.”


PART III. BUTTRESSING THE PEDO & ABUSE LIES WITH FORGED LETTERS; TRANSITIONING TO FULL LIE OF SELF-DEFENSE

April 10, 2010. Ten forged letters sent to Nurmi. The letters are dated November 27, 2006 - May 27, 2008. The letter referencing pedo (and TA calling himself “pure evil,” the exact words Travis used to describe her May 26) is dated January 21, 2007. This is the letter Nurmi told Sky about in June 2011; the letter said TA was interested in Sky’s son.

The pedo letter had Travis telling JA to call him after she read his confession, not to judge him, and that he knows she’ll be compassionate.

The forged January 21 letter is in keeping with the pedo not yet being linked to physical violence, so not yet the core of her self-defense claim that TA’s violence resulted from her knowledge of his pedo.

April 29, 2010. Handwritten notes by Karp on pedo say bed and *advertiser censored* on paper. (Perhaps…changed because the DT didn’t find *advertiser censored* on TA’s hard drive)?

June 18, 2010. Psych evaluation by Samuels. Best guess- -an evaluation intended to establish a causal link between the pedo lie and the abuse lie.

June 22, 2010. The DT drops ninjas, files notice of affirmative defense.

July 2010. JM motion to preclude pedo letters from trial.

JM describes some of the content of letters in his motion: sexual acts and fantasies, regret over his behavior, no “corroborated acts of abuse.” In his book says one or more of the letters was very disparaging of Deanna.

Says letters can be authenticated by an expert, but would need originals. Neither originals or the source of emailer has been disclosed.

The “current version (of her story) is that Travis became angry when she dropped the camera.”

The DT argued: letters are evidence of sexual and physical abuse. Goes to her awareness of prior acts of violence. Contains “confession to having assaulted her.”

(MM was to corroborate abuse by lying that he’d seen bruises on her. IMO, the ’s emphasis on sex was to conceal/deny/take revenge for the fact TA had rejected her, a storyline she began working on in April-May 2008 ---the May 2 email about tree “fantasy,” TA getting jealous when she mentioned her fictictious BF’s, etc.).

DT: Letters are probative because every aspect of her relationship could give rise to self-defense OR to heat of passion. (Sounds like Nurmi was trying to keep the door open to his preferred “snapped” defense).

October 26, 2010. First “plea offer” by . All the threats she’d reprise in her 3rd and last plea offer in July 2011 were already there…that a trial would expose Travis as a “sexual deviant,” a “sexually active playboy hiding behind the façade of a Mormon choir boy,” that marriages would be destroyed and friendships ruined, yada yada.

Judging by the spiteful evil words directed at TA’s family during sentencing, I’m betting the is still pissed the TA’s family didn’t get with her program and agree to a plea.






-------------------------------------------

Could we ask the moderator to put this in the appeals thread? just so we have timelines laid out in one place?
 
Does anyone know why ALV wasn't required to submit a report? There doesn't seem to be an item on the court docket to say when this was even discussed? And why would she not write a report?

There's so much hinky going on with this woman....

I lost the part in the court video where JM mentions the lack of report.

Was Demarte allowed access to ALV's notes?
 
Does anyone know why ALV wasn't required to submit a report? There doesn't seem to be an item on the court docket to say when this was even discussed? And why would she not write a report?

There's so much hinky going on with this woman....

I lost the part in the court video where JM mentions the lack of report.

Was Demarte allowed access to ALV's notes?


BBM:
Just popped onto this thread & saw these questions: my response is based on my own experience with "expert witnesses" and trials, may or may not be applicable to ALV BUT....food for thought!
Without a formal, written report.....your words on the stand can be flexible to the questions of a lawyer, the opposite side's expert witness can't do proactive research or duplicate test results nor can he/she assist other lawyer with probing, specific questions. There is another "default" that some expert witnesses can use: that the information detailed in a hard copy report can be protected by HIPAA.
Regarding access to ALV's notes: there's a possibility/probability that those "notes" if even prepared on hard copy, would be considered "work product" and/or confidential patient data, assuming that ALV is a recognized, licensed/certified healthcare provider. IIRC, ALV gave a summary statement to the prosecution, a statement that gave generalized social interactive type behavior (i.e. ALV's opinion that JA was "abused" and that she was continually & consistently denigrated by males in her social circle. (IMHO, pfffffffft on THAT opinion!)
 
The discrepancy between the January pedo letter year - 2007 vs 2008, could that have been what the coded magazine messages referenced? I always thought those messages were for MM. The correct year needed to be 2008 for the , & the author "f$@'d up" the dates (quoting the message here, mods- no profanity from me!).
I watched the video of testimony above where the killer did indeed squirm about why she went back to DB's home the morning of 6/3/08. She was definite caught there.
Did anyone also note how she refused to answer Juan's question as stated when he asked her whether she stopped to see either MM or DB "on the way to kill Mr. Alexander"? Probably so proud of herself that she "caught" Juan trying to get her to admit premeditation with that question.

The message referred to someone contradicting Arias' story. The one she had been telling for over a year- had been contradicted. I think they were for MM given how Juan Martinez introduced him on that video right after the magazine code reveal (other reasons too, of course).

Re answering Juan's question - as posed. Hahaha - forgot about that highlight. The way Arias answers, like she is a legal genius - smug, jutting up chin emphasising her smugness. How could any jury believe that?
 
The message referred to someone contradicting Arias' story. The one she had been telling for over a year- had been contradicted. I think they were for MM given how Juan Martinez introduced him on that video right after the magazine code reveal (other reasons too, of course).

Re answering Juan's question - as posed. Hahaha - forgot about that highlight. The way Arias answers, like she is a legal genius - smug, jutting up chin emphasising her smugness. How could any jury believe that?

I know, right? I guess it speaks to her BPD that she apparently thought she was *winning* when in reality most people were appalled by her, just as Travis' friends were, after first giving her the benefit of the doubt.

Also, the talk about ALV providing a report or not prompted me to revisit some sites. Again, cognitive dissonance????

http://kristinarandle.com/blog/alyc...-we-are-still-not-buying-what-she-is-selling/
 
LOL! Here I was going to give you a hug, until I read your last line! :laughcry: Good one!!



No fair Niner, I still need a hug. I am happy I could make you laugh. Big Hugs to you sweetie!!!
 
A little early but I do hope Juan has a wonderful birthday tomorrow.



13428033_1536575399983298_2047312343984446419_n.jpg





[video=youtube;N2GrMlsembw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2GrMlsembw[/video]
 
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