Shannan Gilbert Found, death declared an accident. #2

[Justiceforever]

In the meanwhile I'd like to entertain all possible scenarios, ideas, observations, and theories as I see fit. As I said before, the best I can do right now is take a socratic approach, not a debater's club approach where I need maintain a neat little theory wrapped up in a nice little package all ready to fire from a particular corner. Certainly, I am not the cheerleader type, either. That's not the way I think. Not the way I operate. It'd be a waste of time here for you, for me, for everybody.

Love it!!!

 

[BKS]

In the meanwhile I'd like to entertain all possible scenarios, ideas, observations, and theories as I see fit. As I said before, the best I can do right now is take a socratic approach, not a debater's club approach where I need maintain a neat little theory wrapped up in a nice little package all ready to fire from a particular corner. Certainly, I am not the cheerleader type, either. That's not the way I think. Not the way I operate. It'd be a waste of time here for you, for me, for everybody.*

Love it!!!

Me too! I keep an open mind. I'm not committed to "one and only one" theory. there are several good ones here. As more evidence or better theories are presented I may lean one way or the other. I think keeping an open mind is the best way to solve any problem, keep an open mind and weigh all the options. I'm not going to force my theories on anyone. As my old boss used to say, put your listening ears on.

 

[Justiceforever]

In the meanwhile I'd like to entertain all possible scenarios, ideas, observations, and theories as I see fit. As I said before, the best I can do right now is take a socratic approach, not a debater's club approach where I need maintain a neat little theory wrapped up in a nice little package all ready to fire from a particular corner. Certainly, I am not the cheerleader type, either. That's not the way I think. Not the way I operate. It'd be a waste of time here for you, for me, for everybody.*

Love it!!!

My fault adler...I didnt quote u properly...I love your approach!!!

 

[Peter Brendt]

Nix that one Peter ... Coletti lives at the gate and could not have seen down to Anchor Way where SG was last seen and where her jacket (since lost by LE) was reportedly found.

If you've seen a map of where Coletti's house is in relation to the marsh and where SG was last seen on Anchor Way, it is not possible for him to have seen her down there. In earlier threads we discussed where GC was pointing when he said that she went into the reeds ... iirc, it was across the road from his house. Also, SG was reported to have knocked on another door after she ran from Coletti's, and Justin C indicated that SG's footprints were seen in the sand heading toward the beach.

from:
http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/06/jersey_city_prostitute_still_m.html

Oh I've seen a lot of maps of the area. The point is, she obviously went to the reeds. We don't know exactly whether she had the jacket still when she was at Coletti's. And we don't know, whether those footprints were made before or after she saw Coletti. So, you have to decide. Was she maybe unable to hold a straight direction and doubled for and back? Then you can claim, she maybe didn't actually enter the marsh but have to face the problem, how someone could have knocked her over the head in a community that was waking up, police arriving and people slowly paid attention to the ruckus. Or she entered the marsh. Simply that.

 

[Justiceforever]

LOL!!! Dumb smartphone never fails to make me look stuuupid!!! ; ) sometimes its hard oto quote a ppst esp. if its longer than a few sentences...smh!

 

[Justiceforever]

Me too! I keep an open mind. I'm not committed to "one and only one" theory. there are several good ones here. As more evidence or better theories are presented I may lean one way or the other. I think keeping an open mind is the best way to solve any problem, keep an open mind and weigh all the options. I'm not going to force my theories on anyone. As my old boss used to say, put your listening ears on.

It looks like my thought because I dint quote it properly...it was adlers...but I totally agree

 

[Sillybilly]

Oh I've seen a lot of maps of the area. The point is, she obviously went to the reeds. We don't know exactly whether she had the jacket still when she was at Coletti's. And we don't know, whether those footprints were made before or after she saw Coletti. So, you have to decide. Was she maybe unable to hold a straight direction and doubled for and back? Then you can claim, she maybe didn't actually enter the marsh but have to face the problem, how someone could have knocked her over the head in a community that was waking up, police arriving and people slowly paid attention to the ruckus. Or she entered the marsh. Simply that.

Yes, absolutely GC stated she went into the reeds at his house ... different reeds than the marsh in which her remains were found and different time.

GC claimed she had her jacket over her shoulder (the same jacket that he now says maybe her purse was under). If the footprints down by Cannings were made before she arrived at Coletti's, she would have had to have run from JBs down to Anchor Way to leave the footprints and back up to Coletti's, still with jacket slung over her shoulder for GC to have observed it, and then back down to Anchor Way to where jacket was subsequently found.

Knocking someone unconscious with one good blow to the head makes them somewhat silent, no?

 

[LINative13]

When are they going to let that poor girl have a funeral?

 

[LINative13]

Sorry Dude, I am not here to further propegate your rumors. But I will answer the one question you asked about me. I do not cruise for company. I have friends and a girlfriend and a family.....all of whom I love dearly. I am also a very loyal person. I am very protective of all of them as well. I also expect the same in return.

Suffolk/Babylon is too small and too leaky to hold such a conspiracy of your magnitude. You think for one second these guys wouldnt want to solve this case (assuming they do not care about the young lives taken as you tend to perpetuate and are all power thirsty vampires) but just for the selfish reason of being the one to close it? It would be a power move politically. You think all of these high ranking guys are going to risk there career over covering this up when they could solve it and make there career? It doesnt make sense and is irrational. I am here to possibly help solve this case. Not push some personal agenda.

If the other side that lost control of the county even got a whiff of any of this being true you do not think that they wouldnt use it? Come on bro. It would be all over Foxnews. Hannity would probably personally fund it.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Yes, absolutely GC stated she went into the reeds at his house ... different reeds than the marsh in which her remains were found and different time.

GC claimed she had her jacket over her shoulder (the same jacket that he now says maybe her purse was under). If the footprints down by Cannings were made before she arrived at Coletti's, she would have had to have run from JBs down to Anchor Way to leave the footprints and back up to Coletti's, still with jacket slung over her shoulder for GC to have observed it, and then back down to Anchor Way to where jacket was subsequently found.

Knocking someone unconscious with one good blow to the head makes them somewhat silent, no?

But then, in a community just waking up, you would also to knock the whole neighborhood over the head to make sure they stay later silent. And then, it's not so easy to knock someone over the head, if you can't just lurk for her in a dark corner. In the middle of a road in daylight ... it's a little bit harder to surprise someone. So, we agree, she had to run zigzag to get to all this places? We disagree over the possibility to knock her over the head without a chance for her to scream in daylight despite the lack of surprise and while a number of potential witnesses were obviously already awake.

 

[Sillybilly]

But then, in a community just waking up, you would also to knock the whole neighborhood over the head to make sure they stay later silent. And then, it's not so easy to knock someone over the head, if you can't just lurk for her in a dark corner. In the middle of a road in daylight ... it's a little bit harder to surprise someone. So, we agree, she had to run zigzag to get to all this places? We disagree over the possibility to knock her over the head without a chance for her to scream in daylight despite the lack of surprise and while a number of potential witnesses were obviously already awake.

Other than running from the boat into the reeds at GC's when she knew MP was coming, and subsequently being on Anchor Way near The Bayou, we don't know that she was zigzagging. How she got to Anchor Way is anyone's guess.

As for the potential witnesses who were up at that time of the morning, peeps disappear all the time with lots of potential witnesses in the vicinity who don't know anything about the disappearance. I'm not stuck to any one theory that SG was knocked out ...just suggesting another possibility that you don't agree with

 

[Peter Brendt]

Other than running from the boat into the reeds at GC's when she knew MP was coming, and subsequently being on Anchor Way near The Bayou, we don't know that she was zigzagging. How she got to Anchor Way is anyone's guess.

As for the potential witnesses who were up at that time of the morning, peeps disappear all the time with lots of potential witnesses in the vicinity who don't know anything about the disappearance. I'm not stuck to any one theory that SG was knocked out ...just suggesting another possibility that you don't agree with

So what's the political correct term for running for and backwards, without any recognizable goal? Not zigzagging obviously. So, we call it what? Oh, yes, running confused and drugged-like?
And when it comes to theories I don't agree with, why not set any theory on the list that shows gaping logic gaps on the list, that would save us a lot of discussions. I mean, knock her over the head, strong and fast enough to get her unconcscious without giving her the chance to scream (without surprise on the attacker's side) and then without causing blunt force trauma to the skull? Really?

 

[Just K]

Everyone heard her screaming...only three witnesses (GC, JB & MP) have publicly stated that they saw her running...and only GC & MP have publicly stated that they saw her after she ran away from JB's steps. So, why would anyone assume that any other resident saw her at all. If they didn't go to the window or door to see what some woman was screaming about then why would anyone think that they cared enough to look and catch a glimpse of her either being let into another home or being pulled into someone's vehicle?


ETA: It has been reported that B Brennan also called 911. There are conflicting reports if she actually saw SG or just heard here. BUT, she lives even further down Anchor Way from EC & her son JC.

 

[Adler]

Thanks, and I completely appreciate your socratic approach. I am also interested in using goog earth to review the all of the pertinent locations of the case over the years. I don't think I saw the X's you are talking about, can you describe what you mean? Markings in the road? Bush? Grass? Something that was part of the earth or markings/writing on the digital images?

Brush, same side of OP as GB-4 remains. I am going to try to get the Google Earth screen here, so you won't have to type in coordinates again. If that fails, try 40.624423,-73.37661 , zoom in a bit, select the history time bar and click back, year by year to 1994. You will notice in 2007's image, there is a similar patch of sand to the one you posted the other day. What is it?

Only in the 1994 do the white crosses show up just east of the coordinates.

 

[Adler]

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[Peter Brendt]

Everyone heard her screaming...only three witnesses (GC, JB & MP) have publicly stated that they saw her running...and only GC & MP have publicly stated that they saw her after she ran away from JB's steps. So, why would anyone assume that any other resident saw her at all. If they didn't go to the window or door to see what some woman was screaming about then why would anyone think that they cared enough to look and catch a glimpse of her either being let into another home or being pulled into someone's vehicle?

How about a newspaper link or anything to back that up?

 

[Just K]

How about a newspaper link or anything to back that up?

Results Search "Justin Canning."
http://websleuths.com/forums/search.php?searchid=5830084
Search: Keyword(s): Justin, Canning,
The following words are either very common, too long, or too short and were not included in your search: 20
Forum: Long Island Serial Killer Today, 02:59 AM
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Shannan Gilbert Found, death declared an accident. #2
Views: 25,344
Posted By Adler
. An OB resident, Justin Canning said that her...

. An OB resident, Justin Canning said that her footprints were seen in the sand going toward Gilgo Beach, and CPH was known to say that he had seen her "running at night near Oak Beach, looking both...
Forum: Long Island Serial Killer Yesterday, 07:54 PM
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Shannan Gilbert Found, death declared an accident. #2
Views: 25,344
Posted By Peter Brendt
. An OB resident, Justin Canning said that her...

. An OB resident, Justin Canning said that her footprints were seen in the sand going toward Gilgo Beach, and CPH was known to say that he had seen her "running at night near Oak Beach, looking both...
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Shannan Gilbert Found, death declared an accident. #2
Views: 25,344
Posted By sillybilly
<snip> For the record, it is NOT true that...

<snip>

For the record, it is NOT true that Shannan was seen running into the marsh. An OB resident, Justin Canning said that her footprints were seen in the sand going toward Gilgo Beach, and CPH...
Forum: Long Island Serial Killer 03-30-2012, 09:53 PM
Replies: 713
Manorville Bodies: A Second Killer? Latest Remains found 02/17/2012
Views: 35,596
Posted By scandi
Hi, There is a link somewhere, but I found this...

Hi, There is a link somewhere, but I found this on Google: " . . . Shannon Gilbert the night she disappeared from a Long Island, N.Y., .... We saw her footprints in the sand," said Justin Canning,...
Forum: Long Island Serial Killer 03-28-2012, 09:57 PM
Replies: 713
Manorville Bodies: A Second Killer? Latest Remains found 02/17/2012
Views: 35,596
Posted By MrsPC
I'm not sure if Gilbert went to the Canning's...

I'm not sure if Gilbert went to the Canning's door but on the Websleuths archive there is this from Justin Canning:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-159244.html

"That was...
Forum: Long Island Serial Killer 01-05-2012, 08:37 PM
Replies: 47
Sticky: Shannan gilbert timeline
Views: 4,381
Posted By Theforeigner
Shannan gilbert timeline

The Shannan Gilbert Timeline

Here’s an unfinished Shannan Gilbert timline.

Info on the years from 1986 to April/May 2010.

The info on her movements on the night of April 30-May 1, 2010, is...
Forum: Long Island Serial Killer 05-08-2011, 09:21 AM
Replies: 1,046
NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #8
Views: 40,666
Posted By Just K
Different sources say that GC was the last to see...

Different sources say that GC was the last to see Shannan alive yet there are other news sources that suggest CPH saw her and then the 20 year old who added that they saw her footsteps in the sand.
...
Forum: Long Island Serial Killer 04-28-2011, 10:36 AM
Replies: 950
NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #7
Views: 43,177
Posted By MeoW333
Hello all, i've been sick for awhile, however i...

Hello all, i've been sick for awhile, however i have been following this case through the papers, net and my wife.
Are we certain that this doctor is involved as a suspect? If he is innocent....
...
Forum: Long Island Serial Killer 04-28-2011, 08:42 AM
Replies: 950
NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #7
Views: 43,177
Posted By dcgrumpy
I know Jennifer McLogan says that he said it, but...

I know Jennifer McLogan says that he said it, but she never says actually said it to her. I thought the same thing when I first saw it last month. But after watching it a few times it seems to me...
Forum: Long Island Serial Killer 04-28-2011, 08:30 AM
Replies: 950
NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #7
Views: 43,177
Posted By internetgirl101
Actually, in the video, the reporter says that...

Actually, in the video, the reporter says that CPH had stated that SG was running incoherently and looked sick. I know it wasn't a quote.. Ugh! I wish we heard it straight from the horse's mouth!
...
Forum: Long Island Serial Killer 12-20-2010, 12:25 AM
Replies: 606
NY-Long Island-Four bodies found on Beach-Possible Serial Killer-Dec 2010- All id'd
Views: 54,191
Posted By chemcopout
This is very interesting. who is the asian man in...

This is very interesting. who is the asian man in the dark colored suv? would he be her driver hired by her pimp, or another guest from the party?

Either way, telling GC that he shouldn't have...

 

[fred&edna]

I believe screaming is referenced in all of these...

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/loca...mains-Serial-Killer-Prostitute-149687895.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lberts-mother-fears-linked-disappearance.html

http://voices.yahoo.com/eight-bodies-found-gilgo-but-where-shannan-gilbert-8255555.html

 

[Peter Brendt]

I believe screaming is referenced in all of these...

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/loca...mains-Serial-Killer-Prostitute-149687895.html

"Gilbert was last seen screaming and running from a home in the Oak Beach complex where she met a client for sex on May 1, 2010."

No word, about she screamed at Anchor Way, only she screamed when she left the house ... which contradicts John Ray, who said, at the end of the 911 call there was huffing to hear as she ran out (48 Hours).

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lberts-mother-fears-linked-disappearance.html

"The matriarch told New York magazine she spoke to her daughter six hours before she ran screaming from a client's house in Oak Beach, where she had driven on May 1, 2010 at approximately 2am."

So again, no word of SG screaming later at Anchor Way. Only when she left the house, which, as above mentioned is in contradiction to John Ray in 48 Hours.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...fears-linked-disappearance.html#ixzz21s0gaIGK

http://voices.yahoo.com/eight-bodies-found-gilgo-but-where-shannan-gilbert-8255555.html

"She was next seen at 4:35 a.m. May 1, dashing in a panic from the direction of her client's Oak Beach home. She ran to the door of a neighbor, Gus Coletti, screaming, "Help me! Help me!""

This was obviously the Coletti statement. So once more, no screaming at Anchor Way. But according to what Just K argued about her jacket, we're looking for witnesses at Anchor Way who heard her screaming at Anchor Way. But exactly where she would have been actually attacked, according to that theory, without the chance of a blitz-attack, without the element of surprise, nobody heard her scream.
The two first links make me think about another thing. Who actually said, she screamed when she ran out of Brewer's house? Brewer, Pak or the drifter? John Ray state in 48 Hours, at the end of the 911 tape, there was huffing because SG was running. But I am not sure whether John Ray heard the tape or read only a transcript.

 

[Flukeyou]

SG WAS NEVER IN GUS's HOUSE!!!!!!!!!