Sheila and Katherine Lyon-sisters missing since 1975 - #2

[gregjrichards]

"(CNN)Forty years ago, the disappearance of two innocent little girls shook the town of Kensington, Maryland, to its core.

On March 25, 1975, Katherine and Sheila Lyon walked to a neighborhood shopping center for pizza and a look at an Easter exhibit. They never returned home.

Kensington's fears would later spread to the Washington Metropolitan area -- and the nation. The heavily publicized disappearances of the 10- and 12-year-old Lyon sisters in Maryland, of Etan Patz in New York and of other children in that era helped build a wave of fear that the America of unlocked doors and unsupervised kids playing in safe neighborhoods was over.

The fear that some stranger might kidnap and kill an innocent child propelled mothers throughout the country into a protective mode that would morph into "helicopter parenting" in the years to followed.

Remarkably, after 40 long years, Bedford County, Virginia, Sheriff Mike Brown finally announced on July 15 an indictment of the alleged murderer, Lloyd Welch Jr. Welch's aunt, Patricia Welch, was also accused of perjury in December -- and indicted this month -- for lying to a grand jury investigating the case. Lloyd Welch denies murdering the two girls. Patricia Welch has declined to comment.

"Cold cases" such as this one present extraordinary challenges for prosecutors. The recent New York trial in the disappearance of 6-year-old Etan Patz resulted in a hung jury in late May, demonstrating the problems cold case prosecutors often face."

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/07/23/opinions/callan-lyon-sisters-murder-trial/

I thought this was an interesting article.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I hope they can find them somehow and give this family answers. It is just so unimaginable to me that they do not know all the facts about their little girls deaths.

 

[gregjrichards]

I hope they can find them somehow and give this family answers. It is just so unimaginable to me that they do not know all the facts about their little girls deaths.

I know my heart goes out to them the last 40 years must have been utter h*ll everyday. They now have a murder trial and potentially other trials to endure too it is awful.

 

[WaynezWorld]

In Maryland, I have never seen juvenile records revealed and it apparently takes a court order to even see your own records.
https://www.oag.state.md.us/Courts/2005/2005_01_11.pdf

Even for adult convictions, it's pretty hard to use a defendant's prior convictions against him in court unless he lies on the stand about activities he was convicted for.
http://prosecutorsdiscretion.blogspot.com/2011/12/does-it-always-stay-in-your-past.html

It's unusual because Lloyd earned his convictions for crimes long after the Lyon sisters crime, but this might even make it harder, near impossible, to use Lloyd's criminal history against him.

IF Lloyd was the person pretending to be a security guard at Wheaton Plaza in 1975 who allegedly tried to abduct six young women on six different occasions, this MIGHT be admissible if it established a "pattern of conduct" that he 1) targeted girls in the same age range and 2) targeted girls at Wheaton Plaza in 1975. But if the person pretending to be a security guard was not Lloyd, it might help his defense by introducing other sexual predators.

This is a short summary of the limited bad behavior information that might be introduced:
"Prosecutors often argue that prior bad acts are admissible not as propensity evidence, but to establish a “pattern of conduct.” For example, if a bank robbery defendant has previously robbed multiple banks using the same mask, the same note, and the same weapon, the Commonwealth could introduce evidence of the prior bank robberies to prove the defendant’s identity and his pattern of robbing banks in an identical fashion. In deciding whether to allow the evidence to be presented to the jury, trial judges consider whether its probative value outweighs the unfair prejudice to the defendant."
From: http://www.massachusettscriminalatt...-seeks-exclude-prior-bad-acts-upcoming-trial/

I am pretty certain the juvenile record can be introduced in the penalty phase in most states. If LLW is convicted of the yon girls, it would definitely be relevant that he continued on a pattern of crimes against children after 1975.

 

[steveP120]

Paul Callan, a CNN legal analyst and former New York homicide prosecutor has an "opinion" piece on CNN at

http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/23/opinions/callan-lyon-sisters-murder-trial/

which not only has a good summary of the evidence, but also summarizes the legal challenges of the Lyon sisters case.

"It will be a tough road for the prosecution, but a conviction is possible."

"Putting this story together in a compelling presentation that points "beyond a reasonable doubt" to the guilt of a specific member of the Welch clan will not be easy."

 

[beachlvr0810]

Paul Callan, a CNN legal analyst and former New York homicide prosecutor has an "opinion" piece on CNN at

http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/23/opinions/callan-lyon-sisters-murder-trial/

which not only has a good summary of the evidence, but also summarizes the legal challenges of the Lyon sisters case.

"It will be a tough road for the prosecution, but a conviction is possible."

"Putting this story together in a compelling presentation that points "beyond a reasonable doubt" to the guilt of a specific member of the Welch clan will not be easy."

Paul Callan has misquoted one part...Richard's house was in Maryland, not Virginia.

 

[lisette]

Something I've wondered about...If Richard was working as a security guard at Wheaton at the time, wouldn't he have had to be living in MD and not in VA? Or has it ever been established that he was working there then? I guess he could have still had the property in VA but wouldn't have known about the fire?

 

[steveP120]

Something I've wondered about...If Richard was working as a security guard at Wheaton at the time, wouldn't he have had to be living in MD and not in VA? Or has it ever been established that he was working there then? I guess he could have still had the property in VA but wouldn't have known about the fire?

Richard was working in the DC area, but I don't think it has been established he was working in Wheaton on the day of the disappearance. It is likely that Richard worked either at the Giant Food grocery store at Wheaton Plaza (now mall) or the small, nearby area of Wheaton. This would put Richard (and a million other people) in the area either to be able to commit the crime or in the area to help Lloyd cover up a crime with a car, money or advice. A person, say Richard or Helen, helping with say a car, might not know the car was needed for an illegal purpose. Keep in mind that this was long before cell phones, and if one got in an unexpected jam and needed help such as a car, one had to walk to a phone and hope the person was home, or walk directly to a person in person.

Paul Callan did make a mistake confusing Maryland and Virginia for the location of Richard's home. Richard was living in Hyattsville, MD at the time, and in a different house in Hyattsville now. Police searched Richard's Hyattsville, MD house, but it's not been publicly released what if anything they found.

The property in VA, about 200 miles away, was/is owned by relatives. Two hundred miles each way is quite a stretch for a commute to Maryland; one would have to spend about eight hours commuting each day.

 

[beachlvr0810]

Something I've wondered about...If Richard was working as a security guard at Wheaton at the time, wouldn't he have had to be living in MD and not in VA? Or has it ever been established that he was working there then? I guess he could have still had the property in VA but wouldn't have known about the fire?

He still owns the property which joins the property that used to belong to Allen and Lizzie Parker.

 

[jimmymc]

I am new to this site and have been obsessively reading the Lyon sister threads to catch up. I worked with Dick Welch at the Heidi Bakery in the early 1980's. Heidi bakery supplied Giant Food with their bread/bakery items. Dick, or RAW as he is referred to here, came there to work job with sanitation at the bakery after being a security guard for several years. Dick often talked about when he was a security guard and various Giant stores that he worked at. This included the Wheaton store. There was also a Pants Corral store at Wheaton Plaza. Pants Corral was owned by the same company as Giant and the security guards were often dispatched to various stores to cover shifts. I believe Dick once told me that he worked as a security guard for another company before coming to Giant and that he had a German Shepherd guard dog. I have shared this information with the police and they seemed very interested. They said they have had a very difficult time locating people that worked with Dick in the early 70's and employment records that far back are not available.

Also, I have not seen anything on this site about a relative of Dick's named James Welch from Bedford. Not sure the relationship or where I read it but I think a Roanoke T.V. station or newspaper had something about Dick possibly transporting the girls in a vehicle associated with James. I think James may be dead as if this is him:

http://www.roanoke.com/obituaries/w...cle_9c0ab493-8bee-523b-9925-c1685c62aa7b.html

 

[Backwoods]

I am new to this site and have been obsessively reading the Lyon sister threads to catch up. I worked with Dick Welch at the Heidi Bakery in the early 1980's. Heidi bakery supplied Giant Food with their bread/bakery items. Dick, or RAW as he is referred to here, came there to work job with sanitation at the bakery after being a security guard for several years. Dick often talked about when he was a security guard and various Giant stores that he worked at. This included the Wheaton store. There was also a Pants Corral store at Wheaton Plaza. Pants Corral was owned by the same company as Giant and the security guards were often dispatched to various stores to cover shifts. I believe Dick once told me that he worked as a security guard for another company before coming to Giant and that he had a German Shepherd guard dog. I have shared this information with the police and they seemed very interested. They said they have had a very difficult time locating people that worked with Dick in the early 70's and employment records that far back are not available.

Also, I have not seen anything on this site about a relative of Dick's named James Welch from Bedford. Not sure the relationship or where I read it but I think a Roanoke T.V. station or newspaper had something about Dick possibly transporting the girls in a vehicle associated with James. I think James may be dead as if this is him:

http://www.roanoke.com/obituaries/w...cle_9c0ab493-8bee-523b-9925-c1685c62aa7b.html

:welcome:

Welcome to Websleuths, jimmymc!

 

[gregjrichards]

I am new to this site and have been obsessively reading the Lyon sister threads to catch up. I worked with Dick Welch at the Heidi Bakery in the early 1980's. Heidi bakery supplied Giant Food with their bread/bakery items. Dick, or RAW as he is referred to here, came there to work job with sanitation at the bakery after being a security guard for several years. Dick often talked about when he was a security guard and various Giant stores that he worked at. This included the Wheaton store. There was also a Pants Corral store at Wheaton Plaza. Pants Corral was owned by the same company as Giant and the security guards were often dispatched to various stores to cover shifts. I believe Dick once told me that he worked as a security guard for another company before coming to Giant and that he had a German Shepherd guard dog. I have shared this information with the police and they seemed very interested. They said they have had a very difficult time locating people that worked with Dick in the early 70's and employment records that far back are not available.

Also, I have not seen anything on this site about a relative of Dick's named James Welch from Bedford. Not sure the relationship or where I read it but I think a Roanoke T.V. station or newspaper had something about Dick possibly transporting the girls in a vehicle associated with James. I think James may be dead as if this is him:

http://www.roanoke.com/obituaries/w...cle_9c0ab493-8bee-523b-9925-c1685c62aa7b.html

Welcome to websleuths Jimmymc. Thanks for sharing your post and for contacting the police.

 

[mrssunshine]

Two things I noticed in the affidavit by Connie Akers.
In her own words, LLWjr showed up with a bloody foul smelling bag. Is it believable to this person- that someone carried raw meat in a bag in 1975? Because that sure sounds suspicious to me. I appreciate Beachlover's wonderful posts giving us an insight as to how things were, but it just seems like that would have been a huge red flag and nothing I would have helped out with.

And although this is coming from LLWjr--I find it very interesting that he claimed the car they all got in was Uncle Richard's Ford Station Wagon!
Kind of backs up Mr. Deitz claim that a station wagon was what he saw. And the thing about the basement door with a lock, could this be what he wife was lying about to the Grand Jury?

 

[popsicle]

[h=3]Active crime scene on Taylor's Mountain[/h]The dig site is beside 2790 Cool Springs Road. Sheriff Mike Brown called the spot a crime scene, but declined to comment on whether the dig is connected to either the Walker cold case or the Lyon sisters case.

http://www.wset.com/story/29641256/active-crime-scene-on-taylors-mountain



[h=1]Crews excavating near Taylor’s Mountain on Cool Springs Road[/h]http://wsls.com/2015/07/27/crews-excavating-near-taylors-mountain-on-cool-springs-road/

 

[Tulessa]

[h=3]Active crime scene on Taylor's Mountain[/h]The dig site is beside 2790 Cool Springs Road. Sheriff Mike Brown called the spot a crime scene, but declined to comment on whether the dig is connected to either the Walker cold case or the Lyon sisters case.

http://www.wset.com/story/29641256/active-crime-scene-on-taylors-mountain



[h=1]Crews excavating near Taylor’s Mountain on Cool Springs Road[/h]http://wsls.com/2015/07/27/crews-excavating-near-taylors-mountain-on-cool-springs-road/

I Think it's James Walker they are digging for.

 

[Tulessa]

missingjameswalker and his entire family are at the dig site.

 

[simplifymylife2014]

I Think it's James Walker they are digging for.

Tulessa, I have ALWAYS FELT there COULD BE A CONNECTION BETWEEN BOTH CASES?

Did JAMES WALKER KNOW THINGS AND WAS ABOUT TO TELL?

ELIZABETH WELCH does have PARKER IN HER NAME AS WELL!!

 

[jimmymc]

Two things I noticed in the affidavit by Connie Akers.
In her own words, LLWjr showed up with a bloody foul smelling bag. Is it believable to this person- that someone carried raw meat in a bag in 1975? Because that sure sounds suspicious to me. I appreciate Beachlover's wonderful posts giving us an insight as to how things were, but it just seems like that would have been a huge red flag and nothing I would have helped out with.

And although this is coming from LLWjr--I find it very interesting that he claimed the car they all got in was Uncle Richard's Ford Station Wagon!
Kind of backs up Mr. Deitz claim that a station wagon was what he saw. And the thing about the basement door with a lock, could this be what he wife was lying about to the Grand Jury?

Could not agree more. And her brother Henry Parker adds that the bag smelled like death and weighed 60 lbs? The affidavit also said Parker reported the family had conversation about the incident afterwards. Any reasonable person should have known something was wrong. And they held the info for 40 years I'm guessing to protect Lloyd and Dick. And Dicks wife perjures herself to protect this horrible act as well. Pat worked at Giant too back in the day. There were many good people that worked there. Its a shame to be associated with these two.

 

[Tulessa]

Tulessa, I have ALWAYS FELT there COULD BE A CONNECTION BETWEEN BOTH CASES?

Did JAMES WALKER KNOW THINGS AND WAS ABOUT TO TELL?

ELIZABETH WELCH does have PARKER IN HER NAME AS WELL!!

I have no clue SML.

 

[steveP120]

There was a local paper report on crime history in Bedford, which had NO new details on the Lyon sisters, but had some background on the legal system

From: http://www.newsadvance.com/opinion/...cle_28b917d6-3230-11e5-9b8e-03787255ef30.html

Sheriff Carl Wells frequently pointed out, Bedford’s rather lurid crime history doesn’t mean the county is a violent place filled with violent people. Indeed, the series of high-profile murders that occurred there was actually notable because the carnage was imported, the perpetrators all from somewhere else.

The stipulation in Virginia — and most other states — is that a murder trial must take place where the body of the victim is found. Law enforcement representatives in the commonwealth’s rural and semi-rural counties hate this law, because their normally quiet jurisdictions often are used as a dumping ground for killings that take place elsewhere. Then, the sheriff’s offices and/or town police are forced to spend valuable time on an investigation focusing on a place and potential suspects alien to them.

When the body of Roanoke drug informant Cecil Calloway was discovered on the Blue Ridge Parkway in 1982, a surveyor actually was called in to determine whether the body rested in Bedford County or Botetourt County — a “contest” neither locality wanted to win.

Meanwhile, authorities have refused to say whether the remains of Sheila and Katherine Lyon were found during recent forensic digs on Taylors Mountain, but have indicated there is strong circumstantial evidence the sisters wound up in Bedford.