Starting from scratch

[Cubby]

Good points Jules and I agree with most. I also think though while people are far more transient than they once were, we need to take into consideration what the trends were for a man of Mr. Kyles approximate age and during what time frames. For example people growing up in the 50's and starting to build careers in the 60's and 70's didn't expect to have a similiar number of employers as someone growing up in the 80's or 90's, as well as possible career changes as they would today or within the last 10-15 years.

I happen to be one of the few(?) that is still in the general area I grew up. As are my parents and sisters. One left state for appx 6 years but did relocate back here. Actually there is still a large branch of my family in the immediate area (or within 50-75 miles or so) that immigrated to the US in between 1905-1910 and are still in that same 50-75 mile area. When I did our genealogy I found a 3rd cousin 15 min away so we met. Actually the above stands true for both my maternal and paternal roots... and I still run into my friends from grammer schools parents who still live in the same homes they lived in back in the 70's.

:blowkiss:

Just thought I would add some more thinking outloud.

 

[Roselvr]

When I was in high school I attended vo-tech to cut hair (82-83) we used to go on a field trip to New York City; to the huge hair show. Since I was little in the 70's I have no clue if schools did this if he was in training for the restaurant business.

As far as what you said about people moving around; I still live in the same state but not the same part of the state. There is only one of us that has moved to a different state.

Someone just sent me a link to the Vietnam War casualties site. Not sure if it will be useful to anyone but wanted to post it.
Virtual Wall

BK remembers attending the restaurant show in Denver---has anyone already tried contacting the Colorado Restaurant Assoc.? Maybe someone in membership could go through archives there and see if they can find anything...I can contact them...


Thinking "out loud here", I am trying to think of this logically (just call me Spock). If BK remembers attending U. of C. Boulder in the late 70's-early 80's, we have to assume one of three things: 1. Either he was getting his bachelors there, in which case he is younger than we think, or 2.He was attending graduate school, but then where did he get his undergrad? and what was he studying in grad school? or 3. He attended college later in life, and if so why? Lack of funds? Military? (I know, I know-- the fingerprint issue--but I am not 100% convinced--I think he WAS in the military.) If he was military, he could have attended on the G.I Bill, so there should be a record somewhere. Perhaps he never saw combat, but worked in intelligence, and that is why there are no fingerprint records?

That leads to the next set of questions: What did he study at UC Boulder? They only have a limited number of programs at the university. Did he actually go to school there or did he work in the library or food service?

Then there is the memory of reading Restaurants and Institutions. I have looked through the magazine, and no offense to anyone, but in my opinion, this is not a magazine for minimum wage burger flippers. This is a magazine for people in the boutique and upper scale restaurant business. Perhaps this was not always the case with this magazine, but what it appears to be now. So why did he read it? Was he a chef? Unlikely if he attended UC Boulder. CO State has a chef program, but I could not find one at UC B. Was he in the architecture program and designed restaurants? Maybe--UCB has an architecture program. An engineer? Perhaps.

We have so many clues in front of us, we just need to piece them together...

 

[believe09]

http://twitter.com/j2s/status/8485427248

This twitter from James Smith, the documentary film maker for Mr. K, indicates that Newsweek is publishing their article and will be carrying a clip of the documentary on their website....

 

[carolwood]

Cubby--I was upset with myself because I saw your message while I was at the game, but my damn 3G would not work so I could not respond. I did not think you were upset or anything, I just frustrated with myself that I could not get to you. :blowkiss:


O/T (sort of) The following is just my opinion, after thinking and thinking and thinking about this whole thing: If I were to get amnesia tomorrow, who knows what little bits I would remember or where I would say I lived: I lived in three different states as a young child, was adopted at 5, and then lived with a new family in another three states. I have had two mothers, and two fathers, and three siblings from one family and two from the other. I went to college in PA and then lived in another six states either on my own or after I was married; some for short amounts (I lived in the Atlanta area for about 7 mths) and others for long periods. Growing up, I spend part of my summers at my grandparents in upstate NY and the other half on Long Island, NY. To this day, I still remember both areas like the back of my hand, even though I have not been to either in at least 15 yrs. As an adult I worked first in the plumbing/electrical industry and traveled to every state(except Alaska and Hawaii) in the country ALOT, and even had an office out of CA, so would travel between the east and west coast every six to eight weeks. I then worked in the travel industry and traveled worldwide. As an adult, I went back to the house in CA that I lived in before I was adopted, and although had not been there for 30 yrs, was successfully able to describe it and then find it. My natural family was some wierd hippie religion; when I was adopted, I was raised Catholic. If a dialect evaluator had to pinpoint my accent, I guarantee they would have problems. I have lived on both coasts, and in northern and southern US. I have not lived in one place more than 10 yrs, so probably have a hodge podge of accents, in addition to the east and west coast accents of all my parents.

My point is that I am probably not that unusual, and that in a persons lifetime they have many different experiences. I personally know very few people who still live in the same area that they were raised. If BK worked in the hospitality or food industry, he may have moved a fair amount--you go where the jobs are; likewise if he were an engineer or architect. He may have been raised as a military brat and moved many times with his family.

I know we are looking at Powells in IN because of BK's memories. We learned with the Juan Doe case that an amnesia patients memories may be disjointed. BK very well may have memories of Indianapolis and the state fair etc, because he spent summers at his grandparents. Maybe he never lived in IN at all.

I know we are looking for a needle in a haystack, but I do not want us to limit ourselves to certain areas and people and exclude others because they do not fit in the "parameters". Obviously we are limited with eye color, height, etc, but we should not limit ourselves to age, birth date, etc. because we might just miss something.

This is exactly my point with the genealogy aspect. The family that is closest to Benjaman's dna settled in KY. and not many of the beginning families left. There were a few, and these are the ones I am working on first. Yes the ones that left, went to Indiana and Missouri, so far.

 

[GRANNYL]

I have a question. I remember reading several years ago that Kyle had a scar from a total knee replacement. Is that true?? Thanks

 

[believe09]

I have a question. I remember reading several years ago that Kyle had a scar from a total knee replacement. Is that true?? Thanks

That would be the first I have heard about it...are you talking about Mr. Kyle? Perhaps he can answer......

 

[nerosleuth]

This is exactly my point with the genealogy aspect. The family that is closest to Benjaman's dna settled in KY. and not many of the beginning families left. There were a few, and these are the ones I am working on first. Yes the ones that left, went to Indiana and Missouri, so far.

After World War II, there were folks that left Kentucky during the late 1940's, the 1950's and the 1960's to look for jobs in the northern states north of the Ohio River. They went to states such as Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, and Ohio because they had to go where the jobs were back then.

So if Benjaman's parents were from Kentucky, it is possible that his parents may have left Kentucky sometime between the late 1940's to late 1960's.

So going north of the Ohio River or even west of the Mississippi River to look for jobs back then wouldn't be out of the question.

 

[Julessleuther]

True, and during the depression, alot of families moved west to work in migrant camps, particularly in CA.

After World War II, there were folks that left Kentucky during the late 1940's, the 1950's and the 1960's to look for jobs in the northern states north of the Ohio River. They went to states such as Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, and Ohio because they had to go where the jobs were back then.

So if Benjaman's parents were from Kentucky, it is possible that his parents may have left Kentucky sometime between the late 1940's to late 1960's.

So going north of the Ohio River or even west of the Mississippi River to look for jobs back then wouldn't be out of the question.

 

[Roselvr]

I have a question. I remember reading several years ago that Kyle had a scar from a total knee replacement. Is that true?? Thanks

Hopefully he can answer but I don't ever remember reading about knee replacement.

 

[nerosleuth]

I was sitting up late tonight watching the Discovery Health channel on cable tv. There is a real life documentary show called Trauma: Life In The ER. It's about ER doctors and staff that treat real life trauma patients in the ER.

The episode I watched tonight was called Passing the Puck. This documentary took place at the Denver Health Medical Center at Denver, Colorado. The original air date of this show was October 10, 2000.

In this episode, two men are rushed to the hospital after they fell thirty feet off of an icy roof. One of the injured man was Ben Kidder. Kidder suffered broken ribs and bruised lung. The other injured man was Cliff Powell. He suffered a broken neck from the fall. Cliff's family were seen in this episode.

Here's the link to this episode of this documentary tv show:

http://tlc.discovery.com/fansites/trauma/episode/season5/05_03.html

I'm guessing that this episode of the documentary tv show could have been filmed sometime during 1999 or 2000 if it first aired in October 2000.

I don't know if this could have been someone that Benjaman knew when he lived in the Denver area.

 

[Cubby]

Where there any pictures of the two men who were injured as a result of the fall? Where they roofers? Doing work on a vent of some kind? Kind of hard to imagine why anyone would be on an icy roof in the winter other than to get snow off their roof.

You didn't get the impression either of these men might be BK, since he thinks his surgery was as a result of a fall ( off a loading dock ).

thanks!

 

[nerosleuth]

Where there any pictures of the two men who were injured as a result of the fall? Where they roofers? Doing work on a vent of some kind? Kind of hard to imagine why anyone would be on an icy roof in the winter other than to get snow off their roof.

You didn't get the impression either of these men might be BK, since he thinks his surgery was as a result of a fall ( off a loading dock ).

thanks!

Cubby,

Yes, they did show the faces of the two men. From what I understand about the accident, they were standing on a roof looking at the skyline of Denver when the roof suddenly collasped on them. I'm guessing their weight and the weight of the ice and snow on the roof caused them to fall thirty feet. I don't think they were doing any kind of roof work when the accident happened.

The Discovery Health Channel is going to show this episode again on Sunday February 7, 2010 at 7:00 AM Eastern Time, 6:00 AM Central Time if you want to watch or tape that episode.

I didn't see anyone that looked like BK, but it did show the injured men faces and it did show the faces of their family. I don't know if Cliff Powell had any other surgery from that fall. He broke his neck from the fall and had a halo brace on his neck and head.

 

[Cubby]

Holy Carp! There are some benefits to suffering from insomnia. I could not sleep last night and was up so late Tru TV was already airing infomercials so I tuned in MSNBC which airs the prison shows really late night. I about fell off the couch when I saw this gentleman Mike Dempsey who works with the Pendleton Juvenille facility. Low and behold it is in Indiana!

Take a look at his picture. He is the spitting image of Benjaman outside the nose.
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.in.gov/idoc/dys/images/Superintendent_-_Photo.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.in.gov/idoc/dys/2336.htm&usg=__VIHW_eGe4VQfaKcAmKZxi4BpqB8=&h=180&w=135&sz=47&hl=en&start=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=mYyjfKleRXDX3M:&tbnh=101&tbnw=76&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dmike%2Bdempsey%2Bpendleton%2Bjuvenile%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1R2ADRA_enUS353%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1

ETA: anyone want to look into this? I am going to be swamped with a few projects at least until midweek and don't know when I will have time to further delve into this guy and the pendleton area of IN. (If that is the name of the town, I'm not that familiar with Indiana).

ETAA: I was so tired watching this last night, I couldn't get myself up to come look this up online. I had to focus to ensure I remembered his name today.

 

[Cubby]

Well, I just looked at a map and Pendleton, IN is pretty close to Indianapolis. Just a little north east of Indianapolis.

 

[nerosleuth]

I found a web site about the Indiana DYS Pendleton facility. Construction of the facility began in 1998 and it opened in July 2000.


http://www.in.gov/idoc/dys/2346.htm


I also found the leadership chart of the Indiana DYS. I also found Mike Dempsey who still works for the Indiana DYS.


http://www.in.gov/idoc/files/New_Leadership_2009.pdf


Cubby, looks like we both sat up very late last night and came across some very interesting cable tv shows.

 

[nerosleuth]

I'm not all that familiar with that area of Indiana. But I did find a community profile of Pendleton,Indiana from Wikipedia.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pendleton,_Indiana

According to the community profile from Wikipedia, Pendleton has three prison facilities in that community.

Pendleton is located just east of I-69 and south of Anderson,Indiana.

Thought: Could BK have been involved with a company that installed restaurant equipments for correctional facilities and institutions?

 

[annemc2]

Jeez, Cubby - I thought that *was* Benjamin!

Holy cow! Looks like him for sure. Great find!

 

[Cubby]

Thanks guys.... This guy could be from anywhere and working at Pendleton... I wish ya'll could have seen my expression when I saw this guy on TV. I'm sure it was priceless. I kept wondering if I was seeing things because I was so tired or what.

If you compare the smiles they are identical. Everything imo, is the same except nose and this Mike looks younger than Mr. Kyle.

But man, they could be brothers, cousins....

 

[Cubby]

I'm going to try and find an email for MD and send him Mr. Kyles information. He'll either recognize and know of him or not, and it could just be another one of many who resemble BK but have been dead end leads thus far. Will try and make contact this week and post when I get a reply. Considering MD works in a LE capacity, I think he would be kind enough to reply to an email and inquiry as to whether he recognizes BK.

 

[Cubby]

Email sent to MD at Pendleton Juvenille Facility and awaiting a reply. Hopefully it won't be too long of a wait. Keep your fingers crossed!