Tempo Restaurant: What Happened There?

[Evie Ivy Over]

You can get whatever impression you want, and other people get their opinions too. What does this have to do with the Tempo thread?

Thanks for your openness. But I'm not sure why you selected me to ask the question about the appropriateness this conversation to the thread?

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

On an intellectual level I may agree, but on an emotional level I care about JLM's rights about as much as he cared about Hannah's and his other victims'. JMO

When he's found guilty, I'll feel the same way, SteveP...definitely.

 

[Enni]

In my thinking, I don't think it matters that the actual "sketch" was released on the 16th if, in fact, that's when it was released. The connection AND identification (of JLM) HAD to have been made no later than the 15th in order for that statement to have been made ON the 15th. IMO

JLM was a very well-known regular on the mall. I'd bet anything that someone called in with a tip on the 15th.

I understand what you're saying, it's hard to believe that LE was able to ID JLM so quickly. But why is it so hard to imagine that LE might have been tipped off early on? Most of C'ville knew that Hannah had gone missing, and some of those folks actually saw her with JLM on the mall ("Abby," the doorperson and guests outside Tempo; WG; all the folks on the surveillance tapes...) and at McGrady's. It's not the sort of thing one would put off reporting (I hope any way!)

 

[ILOKAL]

JLM was a very well-known regular on the mall. I'd bet anything that someone called in with a tip on the 15th.

I understand what you're saying, it's hard to believe that LE ID'd JLM so quickly. But why is it so hard to imagine that LE might have been tipped off early on? Most of C'ville knew that Hannah had gone missing, and some of those folks actually saw her with JLM on the mall ("Abby," the doorperson at Tempo; WG; all the folks on the surveillance tapes...) and at McGrady's. It's not the sort of thing one would put off reporting (I hope any way!)

Of course I'm not a local so I have no idea when the news of Hannah being missing was reported by the media to the public. We KNOW it had to have been at some point after 4:34 PM on the 14th. However, if it wasn't released to the public until the 15th, even IF there was reporting by some that they saw this missing woman with Jesse Leroy Matthew together at Tempo reported to LE ON the 15th, there's no way IMO those reports would have been timely enough for the statement made by the university ON the 15th to be put into action. Am I the only one who sees it this way?

 

[hambirg]

In my thinking, I don't think it matters that the actual "sketch" was released on the 16th if, in fact, that's when it was released. The connection AND identification (of JLM) HAD to have been made no later than the 15th in order for that statement to have been made ON the 15th. IMO

The statement wasn't made on the 15th. The statement came on the 16th saying the report was on the 15th.

 

[ILOKAL]

The statement wasn't made on the 15th. The statement came on the 16th saying the report was on the 15th.

Actually, I meant to refer to the report as being on the 15th which led to the statement on the 16th. But how could the report have generated ON the 15th unless there really WAS a sighting - but then THAT would make for a HUGE coincidence, time wise!

Also, as far as I can tell, the first news reports of Hannah's disappearance appear to have been on the 15th. I haven't "found" any on the 14th.

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

Actually, I meant to refer to the report as being on the 15th which led to the statement on the 16th. But how could the report have generated ON the 15th unless there really WAS a sighting - but then THAT would make for a HUGE coincidence, time wise!

Also, as far as I can tell, the first news reports of Hannah's disappearance appear to have been on the 15th. I haven't "found" any on the 14th.

The only two people we know about as contacting LE with HG sightings were the lady who saw her pass by Fellini's, and WG who saw them together in the DTM. Both of these individuals stated that while they attempted to make contact with LE as soon as they heard the news, they weren't able to pass along their information until Wednesday, 09/17. I'm sure there were lots of witnesses from the DTM--maybe even those two ladies JM high-fived on the video. From the sounds of it, someone got through very early.

 

[hambirg]

Actually, I meant to refer to the report as being on the 15th which led to the statement on the 16th. But how could the report have generated ON the 15th unless there really WAS a sighting - but then THAT would make for a HUGE coincidence, time wise!

Also, as far as I can tell, the first news reports of Hannah's disappearance appear to have been on the 15th. I haven't "found" any on the 14th.

I'm confused. What I'm saying is there is no report on the 15th. . .it's fictional. LE said on the 16th that they received a report on the 15th. . .but they really didn't. Is there some proof of a report on the 15th other than LE saying that on the 16th?

 

[hambirg]

The only two people we know about as contacting LE with HG sightings were the lady who saw her pass by Fellini's, and WG who saw them together in the DTM. Both of these individuals stated that while they attempted to make contact with LE as soon as they heard the news, they weren't able to pass along their information until Wednesday, 09/17. I'm sure there were lots of witnesses from the DTM--maybe even those two ladies JM high-fived on the video. From the sounds of it, someone got through very early.

It was being reported on the HFHG FB page on the 16th that Hannah had been seen on the DT mall and that those tips had been reported via the tip line. I don't remember where, but I thought WG called the tip line early too, but didn't go to the police station until the following day/or days. Does anyone remember where that article was. . .maybe Coy Barefoot?

 

[ILOKAL]

I'm confused. What I'm saying is there is no report on the 15th. . .it's fictional. LE said on the 16th that they received a report on the 15th. . .but they really didn't. Is there some proof of a report on the 15th other than LE saying that on the 16th?

What was the university's notice to students based on? It was sent on the 16th. This IS getting confusing.:tantrum: I thought the report was real but the sighting was fictional?

 

[4 Free Speech]

It was being reported on the HFHG FB page on the 16th that Hannah had been seen on the DT mall and that those tips had been reported via the tip line. I don't remember where, but I thought WG called the tip line early too, but didn't go to the police station until the following day/or days. Does anyone remember where that article was. . .maybe Coy Barefoot?

Hi Hambirg,

I have been following this from the beginning. It's my first experience here at WS.

You guys are brilliant....amazing minds. BTW.

I don't remember ever seeing WG "voluntarily come forward" I think he was questioned and was cooperative. Although he still does not sit right with me. He looks like a predator in his walk, I think JLM just claimed his prey.

I found this older article on Coy's site. It's so strange to go back and look at the older articles, knowing what we know now.

http://insidecville.com/blog/ljs-timeline/

<Slightly off camera to the right, LJ crosses the Mall and merges in with a group of five people. He is walking east now, not too far behind Hannah. In the Tuel&#8217;s video a few seconds later, he can be seen walking directly next to Hannah, just to her right, and is keeping pace with her long stride.
An eyewitness reported seeing an African-American man walk up to Hannah about that time and throw his arm around her. I ask LJ&#8217;s long-time friend Dave Johnson if he believes LJ knew Hannah before that night. Did he ever mention her? Did he speak of her? Was she a known person among your circle of friends?
&#8220;No, not at all, not at all. I don&#8217;t know her,&#8221; Dave answers. &#8220;He never mentioned her. I don&#8217;t think he knew her. In fact, I&#8217;m fairly certain of it, because he walked up and threw his arm around her. That&#8217;s what he did to women when he was hitting on them. If he threw his arm around a woman like that, that was not usually a sign that he knew her. That was a sign that he didn&#8217;t. If Hannah knew him, she wouldn&#8217;t let him put his arm around her.&#8221;
According to investigators, LJ Matthew and Hannah Graham walked up the Mall together, turned right down Fifth Street and headed to Tempo. Within minutes, LJ was back at the Tempo bar, ordering two drinks.
1:10am: Back at Tempo>

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

I'm confused. What I'm saying is there is no report on the 15th. . .it's fictional. LE said on the 16th that they received a report on the 15th. . .but they really didn't. Is there some proof of a report on the 15th other than LE saying that on the 16th?

There's this story that was originally released earlier in the day, updated at 7:36 PM on the 15th:

http://www.newsplex.com/home/headli...-Report-of-Missing-UVa-Student-275123281.html
Sept. 15, 2014 UPDATED: 7:36 PM

The Charlottesville Police Department is investigating the disappearance of a University of Virginia student, who was last seen over the weekend.

Police are actively investigating the disappearance of 18-year-old Hannah Elizabeth Graham.

She was reported missing on Sunday, September 14, at 4:34 p.m.
Graham is a white female, approximately 5'11" tall with a skinny build. She has blue eyes, light brown hair and has freckles. She was last seen wearing a black crop top with mesh cut outs.

Graham was last seen Friday night/Saturday morning between midnight and 1 a.m. According to friends, she was last seen around the area of Camden Plaza Apartments in Charlottesville. Friends also believe she may have been down Main Street or on Wertland Street, past the UVa. Corner


On this date, they don't even mention that she was last known to be at The Pointe Apartments...

 

[ILOKAL]

There's this story that was originally released earlier in the day, updated at 7:36 PM on the 15th:

http://www.newsplex.com/home/headli...-Report-of-Missing-UVa-Student-275123281.html
Sept. 15, 2014 UPDATED: 7:36 PM

The Charlottesville Police Department is investigating the disappearance of a University of Virginia student, who was last seen over the weekend.

Police are actively investigating the disappearance of 18-year-old Hannah Elizabeth Graham.

She was reported missing on Sunday, September 14, at 4:34 p.m.
Graham is a white female, approximately 5'11" tall with a skinny build. She has blue eyes, light brown hair and has freckles. She was last seen wearing a black crop top with mesh cut outs.

Graham was last seen Friday night/Saturday morning between midnight and 1 a.m. According to friends, she was last seen around the area of Camden Plaza Apartments in Charlottesville. Friends also believe she may have been down Main Street or on Wertland Street, past the UVa. Corner


On this date, they don't even mention that she was last known to be at The Pointe Apartments...

Thank you for the article Evie, and they certainly don't mention the DTM or ANY POI! OR McGrady's!

 

[hambirg]

What was the university's notice to students based on? It was sent on the 16th. This IS getting confusing.:tantrum: I thought the report was real but the sighting was fictional?

How can you have a real report based on a fictional sighting? The university put out a notice to students because, IMHO, LE wanted the sketch out there.

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

It was being reported on the HFHG FB page on the 16th that Hannah had been seen on the DT mall and that those tips had been reported via the tip line. I don't remember where, but I thought WG called the tip line early too, but didn't go to the police station until the following day/or days. Does anyone remember where that article was. . .maybe Coy Barefoot?

Here's one story reporting WG's speaking to LE...if he came foward on Wednesday, that would have been the 17th:

http://nypost.com/2014/09/18/cops-seek-man-shown-following-uva-student-before-she-vanished/
September 18, 2014 | 1:20pm

Charlottesville police Capt. Gary Pleasants said the witness came forward Wednesday night after two more grainy surveillance videos were released of Hannah E. Graham from the Downtown Mall.

Police have interviewed about 50 people and have established a designated tip line for information on Graham.


Then there was this reference to his call before speaking to LE:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ing-teen-followed-stumbled-deserted-mall.html
UPDATED: 17:27 EST, 18 September 2014

Late last night investigators said the man in the video presented himself at Charlottesville Police Department (CPD).

He had also called the dedicated tip-line offering information about Hannah, officers have said.

 

[4 Free Speech]

Since we are talking about Sals, DM and UVA. another article, more insight?

http://charlottesvilledtm.com/2014/...en-than-uva-stats-evidence-suggest-otherwise/

<Really? USA Today seems to have neglected the recently released UVA crime data for 2013, during which there were 15 reported rapes and fondlings on grounds. Past reports say there were 14 in 2012, 14 in 2011, and 17 reported rapes in 2010. In addition, UVA is currently under federal investigation for allegedly mishandling the investigation of a 2011 rape of a third-year UVA student. Heck, there&#8217;s even a website called UVA Victims of Rape. Oh, and as you may recall, the same weekend Hannah Graham disappeared, UVA police reported there were two reported sexual assaults, one near Wertland Street, and another on nearby 15th Street NW.>

 

[ILOKAL]

How can you have a real report based on a fictional sighting? The university put out a notice to students because, IMHO, LE wanted the sketch out there.

That's exactly what I mean, Hambirg. Perhaps I'm not expressing myself very well. The notice sent to the students was real - I saw it and read it. That notice was based on some report or directive (fiction or not) by LE, because, like you said, they wanted the sketch out there. This notice to the students was sent on the 16th based on information provided to the university on the 15th. I mean that notice was based on SOMETHING and whatever that something was that caused that notice to be created had to have taken place before the 16th. What am I missing?

 

[Charlie Chan]

Personally, I think that when we know EVERYTHING that LE knows about the 15th and beyond, all of our confusion will be cleared up. If you step back and look at this entire tragedy from start to current, it is very clear to me that there is a strategy being played out by LE in many facets of this case. I have a feeling that there is a LOT of information that is being withheld from the public. Also, regarding the strategies that LE may employ in order to solve a case such as this....I am sure that it is much more complicated than we know. As for what happened at Tempo....I think LE knows exactly what happened there. JLM stands out and this case is SO high profile. I would imagine there are witnesses, footage, etc. that will never be exposed to the public until trial. And IMO, as it should be. The public "need to know" should never compromise an investigation. But I sure would like to have all of that info!~

 

[SteveP]

Personally, I think that when we know EVERYTHING that LE knows about the 15th and beyond, all of our confusion will be cleared up. If you step back and look at this entire tragedy from start to current, it is very clear to me that there is a strategy being played out by LE in many facets of this case. I have a feeling that there is a LOT of information that is being withheld from the public. Also, regarding the strategies that LE may employ in order to solve a case such as this....I am sure that it is much more complicated than we know. As for what happened at Tempo....I think LE knows exactly what happened there. JLM stands out and this case is SO high profile. I would imagine there are witnesses, footage, etc. that will never be exposed to the public until trial. And IMO, as it should be. The public "need to know" should never compromise an investigation. But I sure would like to have all of that info!~

I tend to agree with your assessment completely. LE ALWAYS knows lots more than they release, and as much as we wish otherwise sometimes, that is exactly as it should be.

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

Personally, I think that when we know EVERYTHING that LE knows about the 15th and beyond, all of our confusion will be cleared up. If you step back and look at this entire tragedy from start to current, it is very clear to me that there is a strategy being played out by LE in many facets of this case. I have a feeling that there is a LOT of information that is being withheld from the public. Also, regarding the strategies that LE may employ in order to solve a case such as this....I am sure that it is much more complicated than we know. As for what happened at Tempo....I think LE knows exactly what happened there. JLM stands out and this case is SO high profile. I would imagine there are witnesses, footage, etc. that will never be exposed to the public until trial. And IMO, as it should be. The public "need to know" should never compromise an investigation. But I sure would like to have all of that info!~

The only problem with that is LE sometimes has "different" ways of interpreting things. I was amazed at testimony given by an LE investigator at a publicized hearing; it was early into the investigation, but totally skewed and opinionated.