The Case of JonBenet Ramsey-CBS Sept. 18

[No it's not]

Hmmm ... still thinking about the garotte ... If JB was struck by the flashlight while still in the kitchen, and then BR tried to get her down to the basement to hide her until she would "wake up", how would he do that when he most likely could not lift and carry her? He might have tried to drag her by the back collar of her night-dress, which then could have caused the triangle-shaped bruise on the front of her neck. What if he then thought he had a better idea and made the "garotte" only intending to use it to be better able to drag JB to the WC area? The knot around her neck so it wouldn't slide off, and the handle to provide a better purchase for his hands when pulling her body so the cord would not keep sliding through his fingers?

My point is, maybe the garotte was not intended at all to be a "garotte" and was only made to help BR drag JB to some place out of sight in case his parents got up. Then he went and got one of her blankets and put over her, either to further hide her or keep her warm.

The reason that a child the age of 9 can't be charged with murder in CO (and elsewhere, or other young aged children), is because they can't form an "intent" to murder. That doesn't mean that some of them actually can't form such an intent. But in general, a child that age might strike a killing blow in the heat of the moment without meaning to kill but only as an expression of angry retaliation. If that's what happened in this case, then BR may have been startled when she fell and just lay there -- this had not happened before when he'd hit her. He may not have realized "Well, she's unconscious" because it was just outside his experience. So he may have expected her to "wake up" after a little while, and not even realized he was strangling her while dragging her any distance with the "garotte".

Just thoughts.

Except she wasn't dragged into the wine cellar, she was carried into it. I assume the mold was the giveaway.

-Nin

 

[Madeleine74]

We'll never know for sure. It's one of those things you can argue either way. The dog and the neighbors who cared for the dog are long deceased.

At least at this point the world knows BR cannot be excluded as being a suspect since it was proved:

1. A 9/10 yr old absolutely can inflict a fatal head blow to a 6 year old's head with a MagLite. (source: CBS show on JBR case)

2. BR was up and out of bed that very night, after everyone else went to bed, and downstairs (source: BR himself on the DP show)

3. BR is forensically tied directly to that bowl of pineapple (his fingerprints on the bowl)

4. BR tried to distance himself from that bowl of pineapple, even coyly refusing to identify it in his interview with an investigator when he was 11 (source: as seen on video)

5. BR showed disturbing signs towards his sister, prior act of violence with golf club, feces in JBR's bed and on her things / walls.

6. BR's voice was heard at the end of the 911 call, proving he was awake and downstairs at the time, despite the story the R's & he told.


Believe it or not, but BR is on the list.

 

[Whiteorchids]

What baffles me if the family went to so much trouble to cover up why would they leave the flashlight, pineapple bowl, tea sitting out on the table? Wouldn't they hide those along with the tablet, other end of paintbrush, sharpie? I'm still not 100% convinced it was the Ramsey's and not an intruder. I've started reading the book foreign Fraction. I don't make my decision based on a TV show just like making of a murderer. I think it was biased to fit their theory. Lots of footage excluded. JMO

 

[Ambitioned]

What baffles me if the family went to so much trouble to cover up why would they leave the flashlight, pineapple bowl, tea sitting out on the table? Wouldn't they hide those along with the tablet, other end of paintbrush, sharpie. I'm still not 100% convinced it was the Ramsey's and not an intruder. I've started reading the book foreign Fraction.

I LOVE Kolar's book and I think you will too.

Well, the flashlight was wiped down as were the batteries. Not sure about the rest. I guess Patsy was in a blind panic and not thinking clearly

 

[WhoKnowsWhat]

Speaking of pineapples, who now lives in a pineapple under the sea (of evidence?)

Hey, we can't see those hi-tec shoes

 

[Madeleine74]

Image wayyyy too large.

 

[Advocate4]

Except she wasn't dragged into the wine cellar, she was carried into it. I assume the mold was the giveaway.

-Nin

Per the autopsy, there were "abrasions/contusions" on the back of one shoulder, her lower back and the back of a leg -- these suggest she may have been dragged at least some distance at some point.

 

[Gardenista]

I don't follow this case, so I wasn't sure where to put this--maybe it has already been posted, but i could not find it. It's a 35 minute interview with Lin Wood

Attorney Vows to Take Down CBS ‘Hulk Hogan Style’ After Report Accused Brother of Killing JonBenét Ramsey

http://lawnewz.com/uncategorized/at...rt-accusing-burke-ramsey-of-killing-jonbenet/

 

[Whiteorchids]

I don't follow this case, so I wasn't sure where to put this--maybe it has already been posted, but i could not find it. It's a 35 minute interview with Lin Wood

Attorney Vows to Take Down CBS ‘Hulk Hogan Style’ After Report Accused Brother of Killing JonBenét Ramsey

http://lawnewz.com/uncategorized/at...rt-accusing-burke-ramsey-of-killing-jonbenet/

If he didn't do it this CBS special sure screwed up his life.

 

[No it's not]

Per the autopsy, there were "abrasions/contusions" on the back of one shoulder, her lower back and the back of a leg -- these suggest she may have been dragged at least some distance at some point.

That is certainly possible.

-Nin

 

[molly1255]

I'm new to this forum, but not to Websleuths. I've been following this case since it first happened.

The timing of BR's interview with Dr. Phil and the airing of the CBS documentary is beyond bizarre, IMO. Is it possible the attorney gave a nod of approval for BR to do the DP interview first without realizing what that could do to his status as a public vs. private citizen?

I don't believe so. I think the attorney is much smarter than that, especially since he knew about the upcoming CBS documentary and that the finger would be pointed at BR. So why not let CBS run it first and then follow up with a DP interview? It seems to me that the chances of winning a big defamation lawsuit would be greater if it happened that way. And they still would have collected whatever DP paid for the interview.

IMO, there is more than meets the eye in terms of sequence of the interview first, then the CBS show.

 

[ElleElle]

If my little brother or sister was "murdered", I sure wouldn't be acting all giddy and playful. I would be scared that the "boogieman" so to speak would be out to come and get ME, regardless of any behavioral or personality disorders. Especially if it happened in my own home.

 

[HarmonyE.]

What baffles me if the family went to so much trouble to cover up why would they leave the flashlight, pineapple bowl, tea sitting out on the table? Wouldn't they hide those along with the tablet, other end of paintbrush, sharpie? I'm still not 100% convinced it was the Ramsey's and not an intruder. I've started reading the book foreign Fraction. I don't make my decision based on a TV show just like making of a murderer. I think it was biased to fit their theory. Lots of footage excluded. JMO

I don't think they knew anything about the pineapple or the tea. Patsy seemed genuinely surprised when she saw the photo and said she would never have given one of her kids that huge spoon with that bowl. And even if Patsy was around when Burke fixed the bowl, JonBenet only had a small amount in her system. With all of the insanity that went on that night the bowl and tea would have been the last thing they thought of.

 

[Kadoober]

He doesn't and he won't. Lin Wood is just screaming at the internet. I'm enjoying the show. I'd prefer to see Burke Ramsey deposed under oath by the finest attorneys CBS can hire, but Lin throwing tantrums is likely as far as it will go.

Thank you. I almost slapped my own head. Duh. Of course they have a lawyer who is full of hot air and nonsense. We all seek our own.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

 

[Amonet]

What baffles me if the family went to so much trouble to cover up why would they leave the flashlight, pineapple bowl, tea sitting out on the table? Wouldn't they hide those along with the tablet, other end of paintbrush, sharpie? I'm still not 100% convinced it was the Ramsey's and not an intruder. I've started reading the book foreign Fraction. I don't make my decision based on a TV show just like making of a murderer. I think it was biased to fit their theory. Lots of footage excluded. JMO

I think the pineapple being left has a very simple explanation. They never realized it was a key part of the evidence. They were so focused on covering up what happened that night that no one would have thought about the pineapple...they might not have known she took some of it and that it would be found in her stomach contents. That wasn't what they were focused on...they were only focused on a cover-up to save their son from knowing what he'd done and being taken away from them. I can't explain the flashlight. No one should wipe the batteries inside the flashlight but leave it there. It was snowing that night? They couldn't leave the house to dump anything. The notepad and pen stayed in the house, the flashlight stayed too...that's the only answer I can see.

 

[ElleElle]

I'm new to this forum, but not to Websleuths. I've been following this case since it first happened.

The timing of BR's interview with Dr. Phil and the airing of the CBS documentary is beyond bizarre, IMO. Is it possible the attorney gave a nod of approval for BR to do the DP interview first without realizing what that could do to his status as a public vs. private citizen?

I don't believe so. I think the attorney is much smarter than that, especially since he knew about the upcoming CBS documentary and that the finger would be pointed at BR. So why not let CBS run it first and then follow up with a DP interview? It seems to me that the chances of winning a big defamation lawsuit would be greater if it happened that way. And they still would have collected whatever DP paid for the interview.

IMO, there is more than meets the eye in terms of sequence of the interview first, then the CBS show.

Perhaps he thought that if BR is on the biggest daytime TV shows, the people who have been following this case may say: "Oh poor Burke". I cannot think of any explanation, but I am sure some awesome WS'er may be able to explain this as I find the timing odd as well.

Also, maybe he wanted a big ca$h in before he goes into hiding after the CBS special?

 

[ElleElle]

I don't think they knew anything about the pineapple or the tea. Patsy seemed genuinely surprised when she saw the photo and said she would never have given one of her kids that huge spoon with that bowl. And even if Patsy was around when Burke fixed the bowl, JonBenet only had a small amount in her system. With all of the insanity that went on that night the bowl and tea would have been the last thing they thought of.

Maybe they did not know that in fact she did not eat any pineapple? Maybe JBR did not like pineapple, but took a piece and put it in her mouth to tease BR?

 

[BOESP]

Was there ever any explanation as to why someone else looked after her dog? That seems so unusual. I have read some theories/innuendos but were they ever asked about this directly? Thanks.

merribe I don't know if they were ever asked directly. Iirc, the little dog pottied in the house and generally wasn't wanted other than by JonBenet. Who knows what the real story was. I'm glad the little fellow got to go to a loving home.

 

[Gardenista]

I don't think they knew anything about the pineapple or the tea. Patsy seemed genuinely surprised when she saw the photo and said she would never have given one of her kids that huge spoon with that bowl. And even if Patsy was around when Burke fixed the bowl, JonBenet only had a small amount in her system. With all of the insanity that went on that night the bowl and tea would have been the last thing they thought of.

According to the video I posted above, they don't even know that what was found in her system was actually pineapple.

 

[Brendon]

There was blood which had been wiped off of JBs thighs.

For the millionth time an intruder didn't slip in a tiny window miraculously managing not to disturb the large spider web, an intruder didn't lurk in that house unnoticed while Patsy tried to get ready for the trip, an intruder didn't lure JB downstairs, an intruder did not find a random notepad and write a practice ransom note, an intruder did not write the longest ransom note the American criminal justice system has ever seen, an intruder did not fix JB a snack, an intruder didn't lure her to the basement, an intruder didn't crush her skull,choke and violate her. And an intruder most certainly did not take the time to find new oversized underwear for JonBenet. Seriously what random criminal would get rid of the original pair and take the time and effort to find a new pair? After all that effort an intruder wouldn't leave JonBenét behind if he was really trying to be so careful about covering his track. And on a sarcastic note that intruder must be pretty lucky. It was so nice of John and Patsy to consistently lie and tell stories which protected "him" in the long run.

And what in the world is up with this new notion that since Burke hasn't gone on a killing spree yet then we are off in finding him to display sociopathic and potentially psychopathic traits. Sociopathy is far more common than people realize and most sociopaths aren't mass murderers. It isn't as simple as ,"Oh well he seems functional and went to college so nothing to see here folks. "

For the most part Dennis Rader seemed normal enough until the world learned he was BTK. Most people who knew Ted Bundy had no clue they were in the presence of a violent sadistic serial killer until he was caught. Laci Peterson didn't see Scott coming did she?And the world is full of people who functioned perfectly fine before and after committing murder. Just look at that waste of oxygen known as Karla Homolka. I'm pretty sure no one thought someone like her would assist in the violent rape and murder of her own sister; but not only did she do just that but thanks to her plea deal she now leads a very normal life with a family of her own. Lizzie Borden got on with her life. Casey Anthony isn't in jail again. If you want a child killer comparison look no further than Mary Bell. She strangled two children to death for funsies when she was only 11 and has no run ins with the law since her 12 year sentence.

The real monsters of this world don't walk around drooling,covered in excrement with a cardboard sign proclaiming their violent nature. No the real monsters are the ones who know how to hide who they are. They can be your annoying but seemingly normal neighbor, they can be an expectant father with a wife who has no clue she will never get to hold her unborn son because her husband is plotting her death,they can disguise themselves as a mother or as a brother. These people wear masks and those who get a peak of what is underneath usually don't survive to tell the tale leaving the monster free to continue as it pleases.

It is so sad to think that JonBenét was probably at the age where she would start to fear the proverbial monster lurking in her basement totally unaware that it didn't need to hide in the dark basement behind boxes because it had been hiding in plain sight all along ....in the form of someone she loved and trusted.

I meant there was no blood on her head that would cause alarm and make the parents think she was seriously injured or dead. She would have looked as if she lost consciousness if they came upon her after she had been hit. In which case, the mother most probably A) Calls 911 B) Puts a cord around her daughter and chokes her to death with force.

I'll let you figure that one out.

Another point. By 5pm the Ramseys were still in the presense of others. According to what you believe, that would include them being awake for nearly 40 hours. Do you have any knowledge about police or other witnesses saying they were falling asleep in front of them, or were being incoherent, or appearing drugged or drunk. Try staying up for 40 hours and tape yourself talking to people for a length of time.

Another point. You believe Burke did it, or you believe Burke knows who did. A nine year old is a loose cannon, right? Could say anything to anybody, right? The Ramseys must have kept their 9 year old son close yeah? No. They sent young Burke to a neighbors to keep him away from the horrible situation. Like loving people, not like people who had something to hide.

People that knew and had come across Dennis Rader seemed normal enough until the world learned he was BTK? But people did come forward to say he was a most unsavory type of a person after he was caught. Look it up.

Why is it that the the tiny window in the basement is the only way you think an intruder could get in and out of the place. They had many visitors and guests to that home. Quite a few people knew the layout. John Ramsey broke into that window because he lost his key to the front door. There's a clue for you.

There are monsters who walk amongst us, who we would not recognize as they do look normal. But they come out at night with pitchforks and fire and going on witchhunts and victimising people who don't "look right" etc. If the authorities can't find find a suitable target for them, then they point the finger at the first available victim and hold it there, no matter what. Ask Lindy Chamberlain.