The Jury Hangs - Justice Delayed

[lib's mom]

Comment deleted. I don't need another TO.

 

[tarheel8600]

I think the detectives should create a powerpoint or chart for the next trial that illustrates JY's calls and pings on his cell phone on 11/02 and 11/03.

Show the jurors that after 11ish on the night of 11/02, there were no pings on his cell phone. My understanding is that pings occur as long as the phone is on. Calls don't necessarily have to be made for pings to occur. (Please correct me if I'm wrong on this point.) If pings do occur when the cell phone is on and no pings were recorded that night, JY needs to explain why a man with a wife who is 5 months pregnant and who has a 2 1/2 year old at home by themselves would turn off his cell phone in case they needed to reach him. There has never been any mention of his phone number at the hotel being written down by MY and found at the house. Children get sick and women do go into premature labor. Also, there were instances reported that strange noises had been heard by MY before that frightened her.

As for 11/03, show the jurors the first phone call made by JY at 7:40 A.M. (to his mistress and not to his wife to check on her or CY). Next, show all the phone calls made and received by JY that day up until the time that his MIL called him 4 times, which he did not answer, and her 2 urgent messages left for him to reach her because she really needed to speak to him, which he did not return. After his MIL's phone calls and messages, he abruptly stops all phone communication, which suggests that he knew the reason LF was calling and was delaying being told about MY's death so as to ensure that he was informed by his mom and step-father, who he felt would tell others that upon hearing the news, JY acted appropriately and just crumbled.

 

[Just the Fax]

Tarheel....idle cell pings are not recorded for later retrieval. The only record a cell carrier would have are calls placed or received and what tower was pinged for these transmissions.

 

[tarheel8600]

Tarheel....idle cell pings are not recorded for later retrieval. The only record a cell carrier would have are calls placed or received and what tower was pinged for these transmissions.

Thanks, JTF.

I've read just a little on the subject - most of which had to do with locating a missing person based on the pings off nearby cell towers his/her cell phone recorded. The only reason I read that a cell phone wouldn't ping off a tower is if the battery was removed. My readings also stated that even if a phone isn't in use, that it will ping off a cell tower that is nearby, which is why cell phone batteries run down even if the phone isn't making or receiving calls.

It would be interesting if we could prove his cell phone was not receiving pings from midnight 11/02 until the morning of 11/03. It sure would require JY to explain why his cell phone battery was removed on that particular night.

Also, it would have been nice if his cell phone had been equipped with a GPS to determine whether or not he stopped for gas that is not recorded on his credit card on his way to or shortly after leaving Clintwood, VA.

Thanks again, JTF. I'm new on here and trying to learn. I don't know if I'll ever catch up to all of you regular posters, though.

 

[Just the Fax]

Welcome tarheel, I enjoy your posts.Yes, missing persons can often be located by tracing 'live' pings in realtime and narrowing down to which tower it is near at a given time. He probably left his phone in his room thinking that would bolster the alibi....thankfully it didn't.

 

[Just the Fax]

I did some weather research for 11-3-06 @ midnight, hoping to bust his "too windy" to light the cigar BS. Of course, you would have expected he would save it - throw it in the pile of missing pullover shirts, gloves and HP shoes.

Anyway, there was a steady 15MPH wind at midnight. I'm sure Collins knew this and wrote it in the script.

 

[borndem]

Thanks, JTF.

I've read just a little on the subject - most of which had to do with locating a missing person based on the pings off nearby cell towers his/her cell phone recorded. The only reason I read that a cell phone wouldn't ping off a tower is if the battery was removed. My readings also stated that even if a phone isn't in use, that it will ping off a cell tower that is nearby, which is why cell phone batteries run down even if the phone isn't making or receiving calls.

It would be interesting if we could prove his cell phone was not receiving pings from midnight 11/02 until the morning of 11/03. It sure would require JY to explain why his cell phone battery was removed on that particular night.

Also, it would have been nice if his cell phone had been equipped with a GPS to determine whether or not he stopped for gas that is not recorded on his credit card on his way to or shortly after leaving Clintwood, VA.

Thanks again, JTF. I'm new on here and trying to learn. I don't know if I'll ever catch up to all of you regular posters, though.

BBM

Hi, tarheel! :seeya:

First, let me say, "Poppycock, horsefeathers, nonsense, fooey, and fuggeddaboutit."

We were all newbies here at one time! Don't let that worry or slow you down one bit! And it doesn't look like, by the quality and thoughtfulness of your posts, that you have held back! Sometimes you just have to speak!

You have been "lurking & learning" just as I did -- WS is my first forum -- and just as so many of us have done.

Just bring it on! Each of us is different, and that's what makes WS great. And a new perspective always brings a viewpoint that no one else has.

I guess my post name should be Pollyanna this morning, but there you are.

And since you apparently live near the Young family or in that general area, your perspective and comments on that are very valuable to us, and can't be done by anyone else on this forum as far as I know. Keep it comin':skip::websleuther:

 

[gracielee]

:rollercoaster:

BBM

Hi, tarheel! :seeya:

First, let me say, "Poppycock, horsefeathers, nonsense, fooey, and fuggeddaboutit."

We were all newbies here at one time! Don't let that worry or slow you down one bit! And it doesn't look like, by the quality and thoughtfulness of your posts, that you have held back! Sometimes you just have to speak!

You have been "lurking & learning" just as I did -- WS is my first forum -- and just as so many of us have done.

Just bring it on! Each of us is different, and that's what makes WS great. And a new perspective always brings a viewpoint that no one else has.

I guess my post name should be Pollyanna this morning, but there you are.

And since you apparently live near the Young family or in that general area, your perspective and comments on that are very valuable to us, and can't be done by anyone else on this forum as far as I know. Keep it comin':skip::websleuther:

Let me add my welcome!

:rollercoaster:

:yourock:

:welcome2:

:wagon:

:welcome4:

 

[tarheel8600]

Hourly Observations in Hillsville, VA on 11/02/2006
Time (EST) Temp. Wind Speed Gust Speed
11:00 PM 33.8 °F 15.0 mph 26.5 mph
11:20 PM 33.8 °F 16.1 mph 24.2 mph
11:40 PM 33.8 °F 20.7 mph N/A

This information comes from Weather Underground.

For a nonsmoker, which several people claimed JY was (this was backed up by his insistence that a no smoking clause be put in the custody agreement b/t him and MF AND due to the fact that no other cigars, cigar box, or cigar paraphernalia was found in his luggage or vehicle indicates he was a very infrequent cigar smoker at best), this seems an odd night for JY to decide to go outside and smoke a cigar- especially in light of the fact that he did not have on a heavy coat - just a light shirt - to keep him warm. Pretty cold and windy, IMO, for someone not addicted to nicotine. JY had been to Hillsville before and had to know it was likely to be cold for his planned cigar smoke outside.

Also, I believe it was stated that he was going to read the newspaper he received from the night clerk while he was outside smoking his cigar. Pretty windy, especially considering the wind gusts, to be reading a newspaper outside. Plus, how much light was available to him outside to even be able to read the newspaper?

 

[tarheel8600]

When JY's stepfather was on the stand and BH asked him about the time he took a polygraph in Asheville, I found it odd when he said he didn't take a polygraph in Asheville but in Arden. Arden is only a few miles outside of Asheville; he was definitely setting himself up to be viewed as a hostile witness to the prosecution who wanted to look like he knew more about the particulars of the case than BH did. I believe he was trying to make BH look incompetent. For those of us who live up here in the mountains, making a distinction between Asheville and Arden is a definite non-issue.

BH asked him if he told LE that day that he would stick with his family to the death. He said he told the person giving him the polygraph that. She again asked him if he said that he would stick with his family to the death, and he replied, "That's what I said and that's what I mean." BH dropped it at that point.

IMO, BH should have asked him a few more questions.

1) Does sticking with your family to the death mean that you would cover up JY's involvement in MY's death if you had knowledge of it - even if you found out about it some time after the fact?

2) Wasn't MY a member of your family? (His answer would have to be yes.)

3) Did your "sticking by MY," a member of your family, end at the point of her death?

4) In what ways have you tried to help LE find the killer of MY?

5) How many times in the 3 years before your stepson was arrested, did you contact LE or the DA's office to inquire about the progress of finding MY's killer?

6) What would you say was your first priority in the days, months, and years after MY's death - defending your stepson or bringing a killer to justice? Which one of these did you spend more of your time pursuing?

7) In what ways did you or your family memorialize MY and your unborn grandson, Rylan?

Instead of JY's stepfather looking like a good and loyal man who stands by his family, these questions could have led him to look like a man who blindly supported his stepson and pretty much ignored seeking justice for his daughter-in-law and unborn grandson.

 

[Just the Fax]

Good ol'e boy Gerald.
I heard it was common knowledge around Transalvania County, Gerald was spreading tales at the local gun shop. It seems he was telling the boys that Michelle was inpregnated by an African American (not quite the term he used ).

 

[NCEast]

Glad to see there is still ongoing talk about the JY case. I do not want the interest in this case to die just because the first jury hung. I am not a resident of Wake County but if I were I would have already written, emailed, and phoned CW's office about retrying this case. Without a doubt, he owes it to Michelle's mother and sister.
My internet has been down a lot this week and I haven't had working email since Tuesday night, downside of living in the middle of nowhere. I have been able to keep up, almost, with the WS threads and the Anthony trial. The defense rested today without proving --hardly any mention of--any of the 'claims' Baez mentioned in his opening statement. That trial has really and truly sucked the life out of me--have never seen such a mess. Or such a huge cast of characters and misfits. I'll be so happy when it's over and we can get on with the Raven trial here. Hoping it will be carried by WRAL.

 

[tarheel8600]

Good ol'e boy Gerald.
I heard it was common knowledge around Transalvania County, Gerald was spreading tales at the local gun shop. It seems he was telling the boys that Michelle was inpregnated by an African American (not quite the term he used ).

OMG!!! I go to the local gun shop occasionally with my son. I'm gonna have to check this out!

Is he the guy on the right in the picture? Looks certainly have changed since this picture was taken.

 

[NCEast]

Good ol'e boy Gerald.
I heard it was common knowledge around Transalvania County, Gerald was spreading tales at the local gun shop. It seems he was telling the boys that Michelle was inpregnated by an African American (not quite the term he used ).

Well, I just spat/spewed Coke all over myself when I saw that picture! Are these men from Transylvania County
My husband is from the mountains of NC but on the southern end. Thankfully, perhaps!

 

[Just the Fax]

4 strong, sensible GUILTY as charged
2 weak, easily swayed NG
6 strong NG
=============================
There were 5 women on the jury (4 white / 1 black).
We know the white male foreman was a strong NG.
Reckon the 4 guilty votes were women?
Jury selection for round 2 will be HUGE.

 

[tarheel8600]

Well, I just spat/spewed Coke all over myself when I saw that picture! Are these men from Transylvania County
My husband is from the mountains of NC but on the southern end. Thankfully, perhaps!

I'm not originally from Transylvania County, but my husband and his family are. I haven't seen men who look quite like this. Thankfully, for certain. I think I'd turn around and go the other way. I don't know, though, I might have stared. It is quite a sight!!

 

[justbetweenus]

Buying only $15 worth of gas probably wasn't all he bought, I think he got spooked by his own bad behavior and just took off because he realized it and panicked. Could easily have purchased gas somewhere else before returning to the hotel, or even on the way back to Birchleaf between midnite and 3 am.

Exactly what I think, which makes me believe Gracies story. Say he really did come in cussing her out (which I do believe he did)....gave her the $20.00 to prepay for the gas to have her turn on the pumps. BUT....while pumping the gas he's starting to panic, possibly thinking "what if she calls the police on me; I'm really screwed" "I just need to get out of here now."

So he only pumps $15.00 leaves her the extra $5.00 tip, hoping to appease her and perhaps, she just might forget this whole encounter with the slayer. He takes off and grabs gas somewhere else.

 

[johnfear]

So, apparently the lean in this case is towards no retrial. I had wondered if they would because of the way they handled it from the beginning. If retried, they need to figure out who the real accomplice is. (And I am positive there is one. Just not sure whom. Whether it's someone paid or personally involved. This is where the mileage/gas/time/cleanup issue would be solved for a jury IMO)

I have a long weekend ahead with a few folks affiliated with it and the two things I have to pick their brain on are these:

1) Was Gracie's height estimate based on the sticker by the door? (They have a 4-7 foot mark in there that's been there for a while, but getting crappy now, basically to give the general height in the midst of madness)

2) How real is the DNA mess they didn't explain fully as far as unidentified? Feels like both sides muddied the waters there?

3) Any truth to the 30 blows? (I have some questions about why this wasn't a bigger issue. 30 blows by an angry husband seems right. Not by a random "burglar", etc. But, without consulting a Ouija, can they tell how many were pre versus post mortem? I've been listening to someone else's diatribe about how that many blows indicates to them a woman was involved. Sound familiar?)

4) Did the inventory of the valuables remain incomplete because of JY's lack of involvement or was it ever finalized?

5) Why has the minor child not been brought into this one (at least from a press perspective with regard to what happened. I know she can't testify or accurately recreate but she was there.) from the perspective of being a key piece of credible evidence? Footprints, 911 call, etc. Anyone know when those things were ruled on and why?

So you guys know where I stand, I think he did it/had a hand in it/did it with someone else/paid for it to be done. I do think the defense and pros had a hard battle. I, however, thought BH did an excellent job up to the point where she crossed JY and I thought the detectives involved here were way better (for what they had) than some of the other area representations we have seen.

I can easily see how unaffiliated parties might have found reasonable doubt. I just don't happen to have any myself.

Anything else that's just lingering?

 

[cody100]

Johnfear, I agree with you on your points. I believe he was involved in this somehow, I too can easily see how a juror found reasonable doubt. I hope they will be able to tie up the loose ends and retry this case. However, some of these loose ends are difficult to resolve.

 

[Madeleine74]

Regarding the theory that he might have hired someone to do the 'hit,' this doesn't make sense because if he had, then there would have been no reason for him to put a rock in the door at the H.I., unplug and later move the camera, etc. He wouldn't have needed to do anything because someone else would be at his house killing his wife and he would have had no reason to leave the H.I. Clothes & shoes would not have to be thrown out, and there wouldn't be footprints in blood with HP Orbital sz 12s.

As to the theory that he had some help either at the murder or afterwards, that might be true, but if that occurred, he is still guilty of 1st degree murder. Having an accomplice does not absolve him, and an accomplice doesn't have to be identified in order for JLY to be found guilty.

Either way, he's guilty of 1st degree murder, in the above scenarios.