The Perfect Intruder?

[BBB167893]

Its not my fault if RDI looks at mild mannered people and sees a monster,

Nobody said it WAS your fault, HOTYH. And as for your characterization, I take issue with both. From what I can tell, there was nothing "mild" about Patsy's mannerisms at all, and John's not mild-mannered so much as he is repressed. As for seeing a monster, let me say this:

1) You seem to be compelled to think that a monster was required. It never seems to occur to you that a flesh-and-blood human person could do it. Takes me back to those many conversations we've had about why IDI is much more comforting than RDI.

2) I've talked to a LOT of RDIs in the last eight years, and I know for a fact that some of them DO see the Rs as monsters. But I'm willing to bet that if you asked around, an equal if not greater number would see them as people, people who made a mistake and didn't see a way out.

and I have no explanation for that.

I'm sure you don't.

RDI is folly at this point, and I've said this many many times.

We KNOW you have.

But what the heck whatever trips your trigger.

I wouldn't talk about tripping triggers at this point, HOTYH.

 

[BBB167893]

One more, off the top of my head... Hey, kids! Here's Pogo the Clown:

.

You must have read my mind, otg.

 

[BBB167893]

Your own argument works against RDI. Let me explain: These killers were no secret AFTER they became suspects. Investigators peered into their lives for a lot less than 14 years and discovered the truth.

What truth has RDI discovered after 14 years of peering into the life of JR?

He's still a mild-mannered man. No ugly truths discovered. Therefore your comparisons are irrelevant as these cases have not developed similarly.

I don't think it was meant to be a straight comparison, HOTYH. If anything, it merely illustrates the folly of looking for an obvious Richard III-type when most of the worst among us look the best. I think Wendy Murphy said it best (referring to the Rs specifically) that those who look nice on the outside can be dastardly on the inside.

You cant project a serial killer personality on JR or PR just because other people did it.

That's true. And I don't think anyone here is trying to do that.

How is this RDI investigation going?

That's the whole problem as I see it, HOTYH: an RDI investigation NEVER got going! It was never ALLOWED to get going! People refer to this case as a miscarriage of justice. But it wasn't a miscarriage. It was an ABORTION

 

[otg]

En garde.

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otg:
Megumi Yokota was kidnapped, along with at least a dozen other Japanese citizens, for the express purpose of teaching the North Koreans the Japanese language, dialects, and culture. The purpose of that was to educate North Korean agents so they could successfully spy on Sorth Korea.
(Préparation)

Holdon:
Stated as fact that which you cannot confirm. Not unusual for RDI.
(Battement, et Riposte)

otg:
No, I cannot confirm it personally, but I can read :
“Megumi Yokota is one of at least thirteen Japanese citizens kidnapped by North Korea in the late 1970s and early 1980s. She was abducted on November 15, 1977 at the age of thirteen and apparently forced to help train North Korean spies to pass as Japanese citizens.”
[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megumi_Yokota"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megumi_Yokota[/ame]
Note: Even though Wikipedia uses the word “apparently” in this quote, the assumed NK motive is largely supported by many other sources which you can easily research for yourself.
(Contre-riposte)

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otg:
This has absolutely nothing to do with a six-year-old American girl. It had nothing to do with pedophilia or the Gippeumjo. The Gippeumjo, or "Joy Brigade", were (or are) mostly between the ages of 18 and 25 -- though some were younger and some older. They are further divided into three groups: Manjokjo (those who give sexual pleasure), Haengbokjo (massages), and Gamujo (who perform half-naked).
(Redoublement)

Holdon:
Age stated as fact again you cannot confirm, in fact there are reports contradicting what you say: reports stating jr high school age which is 12-13. Known kidnap victims as young as 13. Feel free to contradict/circumvent those reports.
(Contre-attaque)
otg:
So what is it about “mostly between the ages of 18 and 25 -- though some were younger and some older” that you say “jr high school age” contradicts here? Is it the fact that since I “cannot confirm” this, it’s questionable? Can you confirm it? Can you dispute it?
(Contre-temps)

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otg:
Again, this has nothing to do with JonBenet Ramsey, and it's even more "off-topic" than anyone else discussing other murder cases in the U.S.
(Redoublement)

Holdon:
How do you know? Since when is foreign faction kidnapping off topic? have you read the ransom note lately?
(Coup fouetté)

otg:
Touché, Holdon. Point for you. That is, if you really believe that the RN was a legitimate ransom note. Not many people do, but that shouldn’t stop you. I, on the other hand, have to rely on what most of the experts say. And yes, before you say it, I know that for just about every "expert" who says one thing, you can find another who says something else. But I tend to try and filter out the BS.
(Coup d'arrêt?)

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This was fun, Holdon. We must do it again sometime.

(Temps d'escrime, pour l'instant.)
.

 

[BBB167893]

And lets not forget Susan Smith. She didn't kill her sons because of socioeconomic concerns. She was worried her boyfriend didn't want her kids complicating the relationship.
She wasn't exactly thought of as a potential ax murderer before this happened. And she wasn't a serial killer.

Neither was Diane Downs.

Same deal with Marybeth Tinning.

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marybeth_Tinning[/ame]

She killed nine of her own children for reasons other than socioeconomic. Not for insurance money. Not because it would cost her less in food. But because she was an untreated psychopath. No one, not her husband, not the doctors who treated the children unsuccessfully at the hospital, not her neighbors had any notion that she might be doing it. The doctors foolishly attributed each death to natural causes. He neighbors even praised her for continuing to have children despite so much tragedy. It wasn't until her adopted son ended up dead that questions were asked. Marybeth Tinning killed her children because she was addicted to the sympathy of being a mother who lost her babies. She had undiagnosed Munchausen-by-Proxy Syndrome. Wanetta Hoyt and Wendi Scott fall into this, as well.

Andrea Yates was similar. She killed her children because of undiagnosed (there's that word again! Sure sounds familiar, doesn't it?) post-partum psychosis. Her husband was completely oblivious to her breakdown.

Another cause might be the "Medea" syndrome. In the Greek tale, Medea killed her two sons to spite her cheating husband. Jeannette Hernandez in Chile killed one of her children and seriously injured another with a hammer to punish her unfaithful husband.

We don't even have to go that far afield. We can talk about another one that was dropped right into Mary Lacy's lap, which she also screwed up: Jason Midyette. His parents weren't poor; heck, his grandfather owns half the town!

And it goes on and on. Ames posted an article outlining the various reasons parents kill. I'll see if I can find it.

 

[BBB167893]

You mean there are TWO people in this world that look like that?! :nerves:

What a DREADFUL thought!

 

[BBB167893]

Far be it from me to pull a punch...oh wait I pull punches all the time.

I know the feeling, my friend. You'd HATE to see what I'd do to someone i REALLY had it in for!

 

[otg]

otg:
The fact that the word "Korea" was printed on the portion of the paintbrush that was tied into the cord around JB's neck means nothing more than that it was made in Korea, and that it happened to be there and available in Patsy's paint supplies when someone decided to pick it up and use it for whatever purpose it was used (and we can debate that).

Holdon:
Again, stated as fact as if you know.

otg:
After I invited you to a debate, this is your counter-point?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Holdon:
How do you know?

otg:
Because I use that “good southern common sense” of mine.

Holdon:
Were you there?

otg:
Nope (and I can prove it, so don’t even go there).

Holdon:
Stated as fact many things which I presume you cannot confirm. Not unusual for RDI, seems like just a rant. Saying what you want to say regardless if its fact or not.

I think I understand now: PR writing the note is ON TOPIC, while foreign faction kidnappings are OFF TOPIC. Seems a bit totalitarian, doesn't it? Like you're dictating how it is supposed to go? Picking and choosing what YOU want.

otg:
And you call my statements rants?
(I think I’ll just walk away from that one.)

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Come on, Holdon. Those were sissy-punches. Fight, if you believe in something! Tell me your theory and back it up.
.

 

[my_tee_mouse]

I totally agree with you UKGuy, but I would also like to see hotyh's theory presented in a logical, mature way, that makes sense, so that it can either be considered or discarded, once and for all.

Here!Here!!!

 

[my_tee_mouse]

You must have read my mind, otg.

JUST when I was FINALLY getting that picture out of my mind.:banghead: lol