The ransom note & Patsy Ramsey, letter by letter.

[slug]

The way the Q is written is an odd one and I'd never
Seen it written that way till a few days ago, whilst looking
Through some letters from a distant relative from Australia and
had written a Q and it looked like an 8.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I agree this was someone who knew her. A family member, IMO. And I also agree it was someone who was not an expert at this, mistakes WERE made.
But you still don't offer an explanation of how someone could have forged a three-page note in Patsy's handwriting right there after they had bashed her and she screamed WITH THE PARENTS IN THE HOUSE. Ockham's Razor - things are usually what they seem and all things being equal, the most obvious answer is usually the right one. Four family members came home from a party. Only THREE were alive the next morning. NO sign of forced entry, NO barking dogs to announce a wee-hours scramble through a metal-grated window. No forensic evidence of an intruder. (Touch DNA can't be counted because it COULD have gotten there from unrelated source). Fibers and prints from all THREE of those family members found on items SPECIFIC to the crime. NONE of them willing to talk to police. So the likely answer? One of them killed her and the others are covering it up. Pretty simple, really.

The whole ochams razor thing doesn't work for me here. Mainly because there is nothing about this that makes sense. To me this applies to things of science and biological things.
There is nothing logical about what people do to each other. It's all emotion and power and crazy and hate and evil in crimes.

I think there are sometimes that you can look at a case and say this follows these rules. But not this one. I believe this was someone who had no experience in such things took their planning info from movies, books and imagination.

It think there are people that are career criminals and follow the criminal code. And then I think there are some people that break the mold

Every once in a while there are some things that make me question my IDI theory. But then the mass of evidence pulls me back. I don't believe that any one trying to get away with murder would write a random note in her own handwriting. I think it was made to look like she wrote it.

 

[OpenMind4U]

The whole ochams razor thing doesn't work for me here. Mainly because there is nothing about this that makes sense. To me this applies to things of science and biological things.
There is nothing logical about what people do to each other. It's all emotion and power and crazy and hate and evil in crimes.

I think there are sometimes that you can look at a case and say this follows these rules. But not this one. I believe this was someone who had no experience in such things took their planning info from movies, books and imagination.

It think there are people that are career criminals and follow the criminal code. And then I think there are some people that break the mold

Every once in a while there are some things that make me question my IDI theory. But then the mass of evidence pulls me back. I don't believe that any one trying to get away with murder would write a random note in her own handwriting. I think it was made to look like she wrote it.

Remember, we made a deal to not rely on FEELINGS without knowing the FACTS, right? As much as possible FACTS! Read books, documents, police interviews, experts report.....and only AFTER that: you'll know where 'MASS OF EVIDENCE' takes you.

Because everytime you'll say 'I don't believe that....' - you should be ready to answer the question 'Why? Based on what?'....and today, IMO, you're not ready for answers yet....makes sense?...so, my friend, start reading.....:seeya:

On the Ransom Note subject, I highly recommend to start with our own expert analyst from FFJ. The lady who wrote this is the TRUE HANDWRITING EXPERT (believe me, she is expert in not ONLY handwriting field!!!)

[ame="http://www.forumsforjustice.org/forums/showthread.php?t=6404"]Analysis of the Linguistics and Handwriting in the Ramsey Ransom Note - Forums For Justice[/ame]

jmo

 

[DeeDee249]

The whole ochams razor thing doesn't work for me here. Mainly because there is nothing about this that makes sense. To me this applies to things of science and biological things.
There is nothing logical about what people do to each other. It's all emotion and power and crazy and hate and evil in crimes.

I think there are sometimes that you can look at a case and say this follows these rules. But not this one. I believe this was someone who had no experience in such things took their planning info from movies, books and imagination.

It think there are people that are career criminals and follow the criminal code. And then I think there are some people that break the mold

Every once in a while there are some things that make me question my IDI theory. But then the mass of evidence pulls me back. I don't believe that any one trying to get away with murder would write a random note in her own handwriting. I think it was made to look like she wrote it.

Makes PERFECT sense to me. The family comes home from a party. All 4 are alive. The next morning, only 3 are alive. NO forced entry. Parents in the house. Brother's room right down the hall. Patsy admittedly up late preparing for their early-morning trip. BR tells police his sister walked into the house, the parents say she was asleep and carried. She ate pineapple- it was found in her small intestine and testing proved it came from the bowl found on a table off the kitchen. The autopsy proves she ate the pineapple about 2 hours before her death, also proving she was awake after arriving home- the parents deny this despite ONLY Patsy and BR's prints are on the bowl.
At some point after this, JB is molested, screams, bleeds, and is bashed on the head. She was wiped down, redressed and placed in the wineceller and d three-page fake ransom note was written, from which ONLY Patsy could not be excluded as the author. It is logical to me, and makes sense, that her death was not intended, but when she was bashed that hard, she immediately collapsed and may have SEEMED dead to an untrained person. The other family members covered up this because there had also been sexual assault with associated bleeding. The bleeding is FACT- it was found at the autopsy. NO intruder would wipe her down or care that she was bleeding.
NOTHING about an intruder makes sense, EVERYTHING about a family coverup makes sense. And I am not one of those people who thinks that a parent could not do this. Read the news. They CAN and DO, sadly, more often than should ever be the case. No priors? So what? There is always a FIRST time for every assault and i believe she was not intended to be killed. Patsy herself said "We didn't mean for this to happen". VERY telling.

 

[Rashi'sDaughter]

Spot-on as always, DeeDee!

 

[redheadedgal]

The whole ochams razor thing doesn't work for me here. Mainly because there is nothing about this that makes sense. To me this applies to things of science and biological things.

There is nothing logical about what people do to each other. It's all emotion and power and crazy and hate and evil in crimes.

I think there are sometimes that you can look at a case and say this follows these rules. But not this one. I believe this was someone who had no experience in such things took their planning info from movies, books and imagination.

It think there are people that are career criminals and follow the criminal code. And then I think there are some people that break the mold

Every once in a while there are some things that make me question my IDI theory. But then the mass of evidence pulls me back. I don't believe that any one trying to get away with murder would write a random note in her own handwriting. I think it was made to look like she wrote it.

you do realize that you've contradicted yourself in this post? (the underlined vs. the bolded)

nothing makes sense, people act illogically, criminal had no experience and broke the mold... but PR couldn't have written the ransom note?



:waitasec:

 

[Chrishope]

The whole ochams razor thing doesn't work for me here. Mainly because there is nothing about this that makes sense. To me this applies to things of science and biological things.
There is nothing logical about what people do to each other. It's all emotion and power and crazy and hate and evil in crimes.

I think there are sometimes that you can look at a case and say this follows these rules. But not this one. I believe this was someone who had no experience in such things took their planning info from movies, books and imagination.

It think there are people that are career criminals and follow the criminal code. And then I think there are some people that break the mold

Every once in a while there are some things that make me question my IDI theory. But then the mass of evidence pulls me back. I don't believe that any one trying to get away with murder would write a random note in her own handwriting. I think it was made to look like she wrote it.

You're on the right track with the statement in bold. It makes little sense to give one's self away as the RN author by writing it in one's own hand. It also makes little sense (well, no sense at all) to expect that a RN would throw the police off the trail once the body was found. Since Patsy calls the police in before 6am, guaranteeing the body will be found, we can conclude that she did not write the RN.

As far as the RN looking like PR's writing see http://solvingjonbenet.blogspot.com/2012/10/the-experts-see-patsy-part-1cina-wong.html and subsequent posts.

 

[dodie20]

I've been thinking about the last paragraph of the note and the Victory! S.B.T.C. Since I believe the lines, 'Use that good southern common sense of yours. It's up to you now John!', is a personal plea from PR to JR to unite with her, I started wondering what the ' S.B.T.C', might mean. I know it's pretty accepted that it either stands for Saved By The Cross or is some kind of foreign reference, but neither of those is consistent with a 'plea', so I started playing around with the letters until something seemed more consistent. I know this isn't right, (we'll probably never know what it means), but this is the direction I was thinking. Separate we're Broken Together we're Complete. So, then the consistency of the line would be, 'It's up to you now John! Victory! Separate we're Broken Together we're Complete. all moo

 

[cf1140]

What two letters are the "2 out of 26" which do not match Patsy's handwriting?

The more I look at the note and the exemplars I think that Patsy might not have written the note. Check the word "delivery" which occurs twice out of three words on the first page of the ransom note.

Note the differences.

1. The most general one is that on PR's exemplar the letters are much closer together than the ransom note.
2. The "upper half" of the "d" is much larger on the ransom note than PR's exemplar.
3. The "d"s on the ransom note lack the bottom right mark, instead the lower half of the circle seems to be made with the same movement as the right hand "shelf" of the d. The "d" on PR's exemplar looks more like a type written "d" and has the bottom right mark.
4. The "e" is much larger on PR's exemplar than the ransom note in comparison to the other letters in the word "delivery."
5. The dot of the "i"s is placed much higher on PR's exemplar than the ransom note.
6. The "v" on PR's exemplar is rounded much less than the ransom note.
7. The "r" on the ransom note look like quick one stroke letters. They lack the point on the top left, while the "r"s on PR's exemplar do not.
8. Look at the left angle of the letter "y". On PR's exemplar, that angle is close to 90 degrees. On the ransom note, that angle is much greater than 90 degrees.
9. The "e"s on the exemplar are much closer to a full circle than the "e"s on the ransom note?

How can so many differences on one word be explained/rebutted?

 

[UKGuy]

I've been thinking about the last paragraph of the note and the Victory! S.B.T.C. Since I believe the lines, 'Use that good southern common sense of yours. It's up to you now John!', is a personal plea from PR to JR to unite with her, I started wondering what the ' S.B.T.C', might mean. I know it's pretty accepted that it either stands for Saved By The Cross or is some kind of foreign reference, but neither of those is consistent with a 'plea', so I started playing around with the letters until something seemed more consistent. I know this isn't right, (we'll probably never know what it means), but this is the direction I was thinking. Separate we're Broken Together we're Complete. So, then the consistency of the line would be, 'It's up to you now John! Victory! Separate we're Broken Together we're Complete. all moo

dodie20,
Why should Patsy do this, how can she assume JR will unite with her, he might point the finger at her, Patsy cannot know in advance.

The inclusion of the word Victory! sounds like an attempt to give the RN a militaristic tone, if so, then SBTC probably refers to some imagined para-military organization?


.

 

[midwest mama]

There is a good grouping of Patsy's handwriting and the RN at this link :http://blabbieville.tripod.com/

I browsed through and checked 3 letters on her exemplars and the RN.

Patsy's "c" almost always started with a little downward "hitch" before coming around. The "c's" in the RN rarely did.

Patsy's dotted "i" often placed the dot high and offside from the base. She did sometimes line them up. The dotted "i" in the RN almost always lined up the dot with the base, close together.

Patsy's "v" was almost always written with a uniform size down and up mark.
The RN "v's" almost always had a shorter downstroke, and a taller upstroke ending.

I do not think Patsy's "left hand exemplar", as compared to the RN has much similarity.

I also looked at her "London Letter" and her other samples with "q's". I urge you to look again, as well. Most of Patsy's "q's" are started out on top, coming around to the left forming an upper circle, then dropping rather straight down, and finished with a flattened loop behind and midway back up the drop stroke, sometimes then adding a little "tail" to the right. I have a difficult time seeing any of those "q's" looking like a continuous figure 8. Even the "q's" on the word sample chart she wrote for police show no continuous figure 8 movement. :moo:

 

[DeeDee249]

It should be mentioned that it was noticed that Patsy changed the way she wrote her small "a" after the crime. It was noted by one of BR's teachers that any correspondence or note from Patsy was always handwritten before JB's death and typed after.

 

[dodie20]

It should be mentioned that it was noticed that Patsy changed the way she wrote her small "a" after the crime. It was noted by one of BR's teachers that any correspondence or note from Patsy was always handwritten before JB's death and typed after.

which makes me wonder why she didn't type the ransom note too! maybe she was out of paper? Really though, she probably thought she was clever enough to fool LE with her altered script. (because who would dare question, 'the mother'). And once she realized she wasn't as adept as she thought, she altered her writing, such as the 'a'. all moo. just thinking out loud here, but can you imagine how different this case would have been, if the note HAD been typed? I would have thought the note was strange and that maybe it sounded like PR, bur for the most part, I think she would have been given the benefit of the doubt here.

 

[DeeDee249]

which makes me wonder why she didn't type the ransom note too! maybe she was out of paper? Really though, she probably thought she was clever enough to fool LE with her altered script. (because who would dare question, 'the mother'). And once she realized she wasn't as adept as she thought, she altered her writing, such as the 'a'. all moo. just thinking out loud here, but can you imagine how different this case would have been, if the note HAD been typed? I would have thought the note was strange and that maybe it sounded like PR, bur for the most part, I think she would have been given the benefit of the doubt here.

She started typing AFTER the crime, after she knew her handwriting was being compared to the note. It is obvious to me that Patsy tried to disguise her handwriting, and she (also obviously) thought no one would think she wrote it. To the Rs- this was a kidnapping gone bad scenario which they fully expected everyone to believe.

 

[cf1140]

I also looked at her "London Letter" and her other samples with "q's". I urge you to look again, as well. Most of Patsy's "q's" are started out on top, coming around to the left forming an upper circle, then dropping rather straight down, and finished with a flattened loop behind and midway back up the drop stroke, sometimes then adding a little "tail" to the right. I have a difficult time seeing any of those "q's" looking like a continuous figure 8. Even the "q's" on the word sample chart she wrote for police show no continuous figure 8 movement. :moo:

There's only one "q" in the ransom note so I don't think people should any emphasis on examining that letter.

 

[dodie20]

dodie20,
Why should Patsy do this, how can she assume JR will unite with her, he might point the finger at her, Patsy cannot know in advance.

The inclusion of the word Victory! sounds like an attempt to give the RN a militaristic tone, if so, then SBTC probably refers to some imagined para-military organization?


.

I don't think she did know in advance, but was hoping he would join forces. In the note, she threatened that if he tried to deceive her, she knew countermeasures and tactics...so I think she might have been alluding to what she could do to him, if he did go against her? maybe? I've read this note so many times that I think almost everything is a subconscious clue, kwim? And although I realize this may not be the case, it's hard to see this as just a fake ransom note, posing as a foreign faction. I do realize that I may be reading 'subconscious clues' that aren't there though. moo

 

[dodie20]

Another thing about me reading the note so many times. I'm no criminologist, so I have no expertise at all, in how a criminal might behave, immediately after committing a horrible crime. I'm just forming opinions, based on life experience and what I've personally seen in human nature. IMO, writing a note, any kind of note, after committing a crime, would be a risky move. Because the crime, more than anything else, would be weighing on the criminal's mind, especially the subconscious mind, and the chance of NOT slipping up with clues, would be almost impossible, I would think. All moo.

 

[BOESP]

I think spending her last days in prison with a good probability her cancer would return weighed heavily on her mind.

 

[Ravyn]

About the ransom note..Did anyone ever noticed there are 111 a's that some say is the way Patsy wrote hers...And some even looks like they been done over again to look like her a's..And also about the accent mark over attache go down and the some y is over the word moniter..And also I didn't see one a like Patsy's in the left hand sample,just find that strange alittle cause she did slpipped up on her writting with the using of this a..

 

[anne11]

The word Victory had alway seemed to me to be an allusion to a foreign faction until I read this; "She's gone," Pam says. "She got her victory at 3 o'clock in the morning on Saturday." Patseys sister Pam speaking to the Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_3983709l