The SODDI Defense (Some Other Dude Did It)...If not KC, who?

[Jolynna]

Actually, we know very little about the Defense case except they what they have said paraphrased below:

1. Casey is innocent.

2. Casey should never have been arrested.

3. This case is similar to the Sam Sheppard Case.

4. When you hear Casey's story, everything will make sense.

5. Casey is the mother of a missing child. She is going through a nightmare.

6. There is NO evidence against Casey.

So based on the above, what do YOU think the Defense story will be? Who is their SOD?

I think the defense will go after the state attorneys and LE.

The investigators zeroed in on Casey. The science can't be trusted. The State's Attorneys used below the belt tactics and were unfair.

The closing argument will be lots of dramatic testimony about mean, tunnel-visioned cops, sloppy junk science, contamination, meaner prosecutors and the biased-against-Casey media getting rich from their boosted ratings.

About the SOD...Who???:waitasec: How????:waitasec::waitasec: Actual evidence of SOD???????:waitasec::waitasec::waitasec:

IMO, just like in the O.J. criminal trial, the defense won't say any more about the SOD than that there COULD have been one...maybe.

 

[Seebra]

When I first heard about this SO I started a list of similarities in the two cases.

Similarities:
hispanic perpetrator (ie:zanny)
preference for young girls
drives jeep (neighbour saw jeep outside anthony home)
duct tape/rag to silence victim
same area(5 miles or 14 mins drive between hopespring and attempted abduction)
houses have attatched garages
back fence leads to very isolated area for watching victim/staking out house
sliding glass doors
shorts involved
backyards both had pool and childrens toys

Of course this doesnt mean that I automatically believe that he killed Caylee.

But it does show that when you have information to work off, you can begin to piece it together to see them as possible suspects, or rule them out.
I would like to see LE rule out this guy along with the many other SO's in the area...just to see that they are dotting their I's and crossing all their t's in preparation for the defense at trial.
JMO

You have pointed out the similarities, but what about the differences between this SO and baby Caylee's story?

Differences:
SO made his moves at night - Caylee went missing in the day
Caylee almost ALWAYS slept with KC (when did SO get Caylee?)
This SO (at least on crimes he was pinned to) did not KILL the child

Also:

Caylee was not reported missing for 31 days! I don't care how scared you are of losing friends, losing respect of your parents... Sleepless nights would ensure with a missing child, and forensics show KC's sleep pattern actually picked up by hours each night after Caylee went missing.

KC did not give one INDICATION that something was wrong. SHe told friends that Caylee was with her mom or the nanny - she told Cindy Caylee was with her but sleeping, or with the nanny... KC abandoned her car, which contained evidence of decomposition...

Now, suppose an SO did in fact take Caylee.

Why place a heart shape sticker over the duct tape? Why not just the duct tape? Didn't he have his own duct tape? Did he also get the tape from the A's home? What about the pooh blanket and other items - how did he have this much time alone with Caylee to get this stuff AND kidnap Caylee without ANYONE seeing it?

What about KC backing her car up to the garage - what about borrowing the shovel? What about her texts to Amy about a dead squirel smell in her car? What about telling her boyfriend that Caylee was with the nanny for the weekend? What about telling the police she spoke with Caylee on July 15th? What about KC telling the police she dropped Caylee off at an abandoned apartment?

It doesn't add up. When the police got there, if KC was innoocent and an SO took her child, she would break down and admit everything... unless she had something to hide.

 

[Gaia713]

I am not defending the SO. Bringing him specifically into this discussion is what I object to without basis.

and wisth no evidence to boot.

 

[Balthazar]

Why do you think he hasn't been investigated?

He was only arrested on May 19, 2009, so it's unreasonable to expect that there has been sufficient time for LE to complete an investigation on him for the crime he was arrested for, much less to look at any other crimes in the area he might have been involved in over the years. They need time to do the research necessary for any kind of investigation of this type.

 

[Brini]

Yet you stated earlier that you're certain that le has investigated them, and the information just hasnt been released yet.I'm confused.
It is normal procedure to look at SO's in case like this. If you read the article re the So recently arrested in orlando, 13 other so's were also looked into during the investigation.(brilliant work by LE in that case.kudos to them). Its not a mob mentality, its normal procedure.
Note that I am intelligent enough to eliminate the SO's who's crime were likely against their younger girlfriends, and focusing solely on those who had a preference for little girls, or child p.

Th procedure is generally to follow the evidence.

In this case, the evidence if ovrwhelmingly agaionst KC, and there is no evidence of an SO.

The SO, BTW, would have had to have access to the car and the house, and be able to coerce KC to lie, obstruct, delay, and carry the body of her dead child in her car.

So.. whom are we talking about, that fits?

 

[Brini]

My defense theory on why Casey did not report Caylee missing is that she had a lot to lose by calling 911, so she "tried to handle it" on her own - as she said "which was stupid" as she said. Further, in my defense theory, Casey thinks that one of her friends took Caylee to teach her a lesson, so, she doesn't realize that a SO took her. She thinks it is one of her friends who has access to the Anthony house. But the truth of the situation is a SO broke into the house and took Caylee. So while Casey is busy covering up that she doesn't know where Caylee is to everyone (both her parents and friends) while trying to figure out which friend has Caylee and where he/she has her, unbeknowst to her, Caylee is killed or has been killed by the SO.

If the SO is this person:

http://www.wftv.com/news/19489838/detail.html

Well, what the heck was he doing with the 4 year old child in the garage? Was his plan to molest her and then kill her? Was he going to triple bag her with the toys, shorts and blanket and put her in the trunk of her parent's car? We have no way of knowing what his intentions were because, thank God, the child was able to get the duct tape loose enough to scream alerting her parents to the intruder. The report also mentions beer cans at the scene. There were beer cans where Caylee was found, along with a bunch of other junk, but that doesn't discount that there were beer cans there. And the perp has apparently been doing this since at least 2007. He tried kidnap an 8 year old in 2007 - but these are ONLY the ones we know about! AND if you read the report about the 8 year old, it appears the man tried to enter the home on more than one occaission.

So why did Casey lie to police?

I think because her friends were the MOST important thing to her, she didn't want to lose them, especially not the new boyfriend, so she made up the lie about the nanny hoping to pacify Cindy until she could go to her friends and ask for help - I think she didn't want to get her friends in trouble. Then Casey was stuck telling the lie to police because her mom was sitting right there. She really had no story, nothing to tell them. I think she didn't anticipate being questioned and arrested and figured she'd get away from police and beg her friends to return Caylee. But, of course, that wouldn't work if her friends never had Caylee to begin with.

Why didn't Casey tell the police the truth when they confronted her with her lies?

Because she thought the person who had Caylee was someone she has feelings for and didn't want to get them in trouble.

Why not talk to police afterwards and straighten the situation out?

Because her attorney advised her not to.

Again, I think Casey is probably guilty (like 99% - I'm giving her a 1% chance she could perhaps be innocent until the trial is over). But if I set aside personal prejudices, I do see how a SODDI case could be made and this is my attempt predict what the defense case may be.

Why did KC drive around with her child's dead body in the car, and lie about the smell?

How did the SO get access to the A's house and to the locked tow yard? How did her carry a dead child over the tall, wire fence, and shy did he put the body in KC's trunk?

Why is KC continuing to lie, now that Caylee is known to be dead?

 

[Brini]

When I first heard about this SO I started a list of similarities in the two cases.

Similarities:
hispanic perpetrator (ie:zanny)
preference for young girls
drives jeep (neighbour saw jeep outside anthony home)
duct tape/rag to silence victim
same area(5 miles or 14 mins drive between hopespring and attempted abduction)
houses have attatched garages
back fence leads to very isolated area for watching victim/staking out house
sliding glass doors
shorts involved
backyards both had pool and childrens toys

Of course this doesnt mean that I automatically believe that he killed Caylee.

But it does show that when you have information to work off, you can begin to piece it together to see them as possible suspects, or rule them out.
I would like to see LE rule out this guy along with the many other SO's in the area...just to see that they are dotting their I's and crossing all their t's in preparation for the defense at trial.
JMO

Didn't the jeep turn out to be TonE's green car?

 

[whiteangora]

The kind of firestorm that is brewing here in bits and pieces is the same as mob mentality.

I am not defending the SO. Bringing him specifically into this discussion is what I object to without basis.

I could understand all of this talk about some SO killing Caylee IF there were no suspects. That is not the case, there is a suspect, she is in jail and has been indicted by a Grand Jury. The evidence is overwhelming.

 

[Balthazar]

You have pointed out the similarities, but what about the differences between this SO and baby Caylee's story?

Differences:
SO made his moves at night - Caylee went missing in the day

We really don't know WHEN Caylee went missing - it may have been AFTER the fight on Father's Day - so that would be nighttime, it may have been the next day, but we all now know that George was wrong about what Caylee was wearing, so was he wrong about seeing them that day?
Many people think George's account of that day is an outright lie.

Caylee almost ALWAYS slept with KC (when did SO get Caylee?)

Could Casey have gotten up AFTER Caylee was asleep and left the house to text or chat on the phone? Could she have left a door unlocked and gotten into her car to do this so others couldn't hear her? Maybe driven away from the house?

This SO (at least on crimes he was pinned to) did not KILL the child

We don't know what his intentions were as he was stopped during the commission of the crime. Did he have weapons? We don't know. Where did he get the duct tape? We don't know. What was the composition of the makeshift bed? We don't know.

Also:

Caylee was not reported missing for 31 days! I don't care how scared you are of losing friends, losing respect of your parents... Sleepless nights would ensure with a missing child, and forensics show KC's sleep pattern actually picked up by hours each night after Caylee went missing.

Not if Casey really is a sociopath. All she would really care about is herself. The ONLY reason she would want to get Caylee back would be to protect her "meal ticket" but Casey was also moving on to her new boyfriend. She might have decided it was just as well Caylee was not around and figured whoever had them was taking care of her.

KC did not give one INDICATION that something was wrong. SHe told friends that Caylee was with her mom or the nanny - she told Cindy Caylee was with her but sleeping, or with the nanny... KC abandoned her car, which contained evidence of decomposition...

There's a lot of evidence she attempted to get gas for the car, but couldn't.

Now, suppose an SO did in fact take Caylee.

Why place a heart shape sticker over the duct tape? Why not just the duct tape?

Sexual fantasy.

Didn't he have his own duct tape? Did he also get the tape from the A's home?

There is no proof of where the duct tape came from, only that there was some duct tape of the same brand on a gas can at the Anthony's. Other than that, we don't know if the duct tape on Caylee's mouth was a match for that on the gas can. That information has not been released.

What about the pooh blanket and other items - how did he have this much time alone with Caylee to get this stuff AND kidnap Caylee without ANYONE seeing it?

How did he get in the house, find the 4 year old's bedroom, take her out of bed, make a makeshift bed in the garage, put duct tape on the 4 year old's mouth and get a pair of ladies shoes, then go around the house to look for other stuff without the parents noticing?

What about KC backing her car up to the garage - what about borrowing the shovel? What about her texts to Amy about a dead squirel smell in her car? What about telling her boyfriend that Caylee was with the nanny for the weekend? What about telling the police she spoke with Caylee on July 15th? What about KC telling the police she dropped Caylee off at an abandoned apartment?

She might have been moving out of her parents house when she backed the car up to the garage. In this theory, Casey is protecting the friend she thinks might have Caylee not realizing that Caylee was taken by a SO, that's why she lies.

It doesn't add up. When the police got there, if KC was innoocent and an SO took her child, she would break down and admit everything... unless she had something to hide.

Again, in my theory of the Defense story, KC thinks a friend took Caylee to teach her a lesson. She has NO idea an SO took Caylee. She tells her mom the nanny story hoping to pacify her and buy time, but gets stuck with it when her mom calls 911. Casey has no idea she's going to get arrested so she lies to police. Once arrested, she hires Baez who tells her not to talk about her case anymore and that's the end of the information from her.

Again, remember, I'm 99% sure Casey is guilty. But she hasn't been convicted. So I'm only trying to theorize on what the Defense case may be based on the clues they have given us - which is not much.

 

[Balthazar]

Didn't the jeep turn out to be TonE's green car?

No, TL's Jeep is black and the vehicle you are referring to is a small green pickup - definitely not a Jeep or SUV - the neighbor was very clear about this.

 

[butwhatif?]

I don't understand why you are confused. I have stated, and will again for ya, that I am certain LE has investigated known SO's in the area simply to rule them out or follow up on their findings. And, again I will state it here, that this information has NOT been released to the public. If it has, I missed it. I think I have stated this clearly again.

The mob mentality is not directed at LE in any way, shape or form. Why are a number of posts here insisting that an SO could have murdered Caylee when the A clan has not even discussed or acknowledged an SO and all statements said by the A clan have acknowledged a nanny. CA herself has pointed the nanny finger at JG or AH. JB in court said as much. JB is looking for a SODDI but it not an SO. Even JB is smart enough to know that isn't even a consideration. Why can't others here?

Sorry I was confused by you saying that it was a lynch mob mentality to look at SO's at all, just because they have offended before.that is exactly why they need to be eliminated.

Theres a reason why the US has a public list of known sexual offenders, and that reason is that they are very likely to re-offend and the public has a right to know where they are because they are dangerous.
Statistics show that the average SO will violate between 45 and 160 victims in their lifetime....although most of the time the families of the victim do not want the child to have to re-live the trauma at trial, refuse to let them testify and the SO walks.
How do you know JB wont use an SO defense?

Why can some posters talk in such general terms as 'I'm sure he wont use that defence', or 'They would have looked into the local So's', yet you expect for the people offering alternative possibilities to speak only in absolute facts?

Lastly could you offer a reason as to why LE would release hundreds of pages of psychic tips and not release any info about investigation of So's in this case?
If they have been investigated, then they have to follow the discovery rules, and release it, just like they did the psychic tips, and all of the evidence that points to KC's guilt.
Unless of course they are holding it back because they have eliminated them all, but dont want JB to know that, so that he wastes time looking into every tom dick and harry as the SODDI, for which they have the evidence to refute at trial.
But then that would violate discovery rules....and apparently LE and the state never use dodgy tactics.
JMO

 

[Brini]

I agree. I thought the purpose of this thread was to see if we could come up with a viable SOD, not to put each other down.

But, we haven't come up with a viable SODDI. One that fits the evidence enough to warrant investigation.

 

[Balthazar]

Why did KC drive around with her child's dead body in the car, and lie about the smell?

Factually unproven as of yet, with contradictory evidence.

How did the SO get access to the A's house and to the locked tow yard? How did her carry a dead child over the tall, wire fence, and shy did he put the body in KC's trunk?

Garage door accidentally left open overnight? Open window? Opened the side gate and came in through sliding glass door? Door key? Anything is possible.

Where is the wire fence you're referring to? In my theory, he takes Caylee from her home.

Why is KC continuing to lie, now that Caylee is known to be dead?

Casey has not lied to anyone. Her lawyer has advised her to not talk to LE and she has followed his advice.

 

[Searchfortruth]

I have a hard time coming up with any possible suspects, in this case, other than Casey. If there was any evidence pointing to someone else, even a little bit, I could maybe understand...but, there is not ! I can't even play the game "let's theorize that SODDI", really I can't, I have read the book, front to back, Casey did it.

 

[Brini]

I'm willing to bet enough of us here have had those giant pizza boxes with leftover pizza in them sitting around until trash day.It gets hard.

Hard, dry, and odorless.

 

[countzero]

Again, in my theory of the Defense story, KC thinks a friend took Caylee to teach her a lesson. She has NO idea an SO took Caylee. She tells her mom the nanny story hoping to pacify her and buy time, but gets stuck with it when her mom calls 911. Casey has no idea she's going to get arrested so she lies to police. Once arrested, she hires Baez who tells her not to talk about her case anymore and that's the end of the information from her.

Again, remember, I'm 99% sure Casey is guilty. But she hasn't been convicted. So I'm only trying to theorize on what the Defense case may be based on the clues they have given us - which is not much.

Other than having this become a two part made for tv movie, it still doesn't fit with the released evidence. Hopefully you might get some money from it if JB and crew doesn't bet ya to it.

 

[butwhatif?]

So, Zanny is a guy? (sorry, had to.)

ROFL- Yeah ,maybe its zanny the man-ny.

 

[Brini]

Why do you think this is so impossible? Are you not aware of the Polly Klaas, Adam Walsh or Etan Patz? Seriously, have you never heard of a kidnapper taking a child and molesting and killing them? Have you never heard of a killer taking trophies from the victims' house? Or a kidnapper duct taping their victim?

The Defense is going to have a case of some kind and they have indicated it's a SODDI case, so I think, instead of us trying to tear down any possibility of a SOD, we should spend our time trying to figure out what the Defense case is going to be.

Let me remind you, I personally believe Casey is probably guilty. I won't say only Guilty until she has been tried and convicted. BUT I'm willing to consider lots of different ideas as to what the Defense case may be.

We've heard of all of the above, terrible cases. But, how many of them involve a mother who refused to report the child missing, drove the corpse of her child around in the trunk for days, and lied to and misled police?

How many of them involve a killer who climbed a tell wire fence to get into a locked tow yard, to put the body into the mother's car?

 

[countzero]

Casey has not lied to anyone. Her lawyer has advised her to not talk to LE and she has followed his advice.

BBM: Please, please tell me this is a typo. Seriously.

 

[Brini]

FYI I was agreeing with the poster and pointing out that even with FRESH ingredients, the odor is different than human or even animal decomp. That's why I described it at a vegetal decomp odor.

Vegetal decomp smells nothing like animal decomp.