Theory Thread - What happened at Pistorius' house on the night of Feb. 13, 2013?

[Mr Fossil]

ACOUSTICS OF THE OSCAR PISTORIUS TRIAL – WHAT HAPPENED NEXT

http://www.dbxacoustics.com/oscartrialupdate/

 

[mister happy]

There's been so many delays in this case, I think there will be a lot of people (myself included) who would be disappointed to hear on Thursday if the judgement was delayed for another couple of weeks. Let's hope this case keeps moving forward, verdict and then penalty phase.

I know what you mean, vansleuths! It seems the SA courts are even more drawn-out than the US courts. I can just hear the announcement on Thursday, "My Lady is feeling a bit under the weather today. Thus, the verdict will given 2 weeks from now. Of course, if there are high winds, the delay will be longer."

 

[AJ_DS]

I've had a very disturbing thought. We know that this is a "show trial" designed to demonstrate to the world that South Africa can deliver justice without corruption. Suppose Pistorius is found guilty of murder and given a lengthy prison sentence, all well and good and showing that it doesn't matter if you're rich, white and powerful, yadda yadda yadda

But he isn't immediately taken into custody, he is allowed to go home and "sort his affairs out" - and he defects. There would be much shock and disappointment expressed at what a naughty dishonest boy he's been, but the point about justice will have been made, he had a fair trial etc etc. but his freedom will have been bought after all, kwim.

Please someone tell me that this can't happen.

Rest easy Cherwell… there is no such thing as "being allowed to go home and sort out one's affairs" after a guilty verdict and a prison sentence… sentence is meant to be carried out immediately (unless application for leave to appeal and bail are granted)… accused facing possible prison sentence are deemed to have prepared themselves adequately for a possible incarceration prior to the scheduled date of the reading of the verdict.

… Even single mothers with children at home are immediately taken into custody after a guilty verdict and a prison sentence…

… and as Viper correctly stated, there isn't much hope for OP to "successfully" disappear himself to avoid SA justice : he is VERY recognizable and has NOTHING substantial to offer to illicit 'sympathy' from a foreign country.

 

[foxbluff]

I'm assuming (hoping) we'll be getting a new thread for verdict on Thursday. Will the link be posted on this thread, do you think? Or will old thread50 get reopened and link provided there???

o/t some more here... the reason I'm not giving out many "thank you for post" for the last couple of days is because I've been having to "refresh the page" each time I've given two. With slow dialup service that's been taking forever and has been making playing "catch up" when I log on here take about four hours... Grrrh... and I've let this problem go on for over a week. lol

 

[Val1]

I'm assuming (hoping) we'll be getting a new thread for verdict on Thursday. Will the link be posted on this thread, do you think? Or will old thread50 get reopened and link provided there???

o/t some more here... the reason I'm not giving out many "thank you for post" for the last couple of days is because I've been having to "refresh the page" each time I've given two. With slow dialup service that's been taking forever and has been making playing "catch up" when I log on here take about four hours... Grrrh... and I've let this problem go on for over a week. lol

I've been having the same refresh problems, I'm sure most of us are playing hit and miss these days but I expect it'll pick up tomorrow night as everyone checks in.

 

[Hoosen_Fenger]

The talk in legal "corridors" is that he will serve between 8-12 years which, to me, sounds as though it is thought he will get CH OR does it mean his sentence will be longer and he is likely to serve only half of it?


“The talk in the corridors is that Pistorius will serve between eight and 12 years,”' said Stephen Tuson, criminal law and procedure professor at Johannesburg's Witwatersrand University. - See more at: http://www.skynews.com.au/news/worl...-on-thursday.html#sthash.1mCDzJPg.dpuf”

For 'The talk in legal corridors' read - 'Here is yet more speculation without foundation.' I am getting tired of the so called 'experts' with apparent inside knowledge. From the article itself, 'Evidence in Pistorius' favour includes testimony that he was shocked after finding Steenkamp wounded and desperate to save her.' Really? Anyone that has followed this trial knows this is simply HIS VERSION!

One can immediately discount this statement by pointing out that the first call he made was to a friend to help him move the body, not get the Emergency Services on the phone & keep them on the line for advice on saving her. (Let's face it, she was already dead as per the Pathologist's report.)

However, the spin machine is working and the briefings have worked their way into the sub-conscious of Lazy Journalists.

Luckily, there is a Judge who will look at the facts of the case, not the speculation that is selling Newspapers & getting on-line clicks…

 

[Interested Bystander]

For 'The talk in legal corridors' read - 'Here is yet more speculation without foundation.' I am getting tired of the so called 'experts' with apparent inside knowledge. From the article itself, 'Evidence in Pistorius' favour includes testimony that he was shocked after finding Steenkamp wounded and desperate to save her.' Really? Anyone that has followed this trial knows this is simply HIS VERSION!

One can immediately discount this statement by pointing out that the first call he made was to a friend to help him move the body, not get the Emergency Services on the phone & keep them on the line for advice on saving her. (Let's face it, she was already dead as per the Pathologist's report.)

However, the spin machine is working and the briefings have worked their way into the sub-conscious of Lazy Journalists.

Luckily, there is a Judge who will look at the facts of the case, not the speculation that is selling Newspapers & getting on-line clicks…

Of course it is speculation much like all that is written on this forum. That is why we post what we read so that it can be chewed over and spat out.

 

[jacalyn]

I'm assuming (hoping) we'll be getting a new thread for verdict on Thursday. Will the link be posted on this thread, do you think? Or will old thread50 get reopened and link provided there???

o/t some more here... the reason I'm not giving out many "thank you for post" for the last couple of days is because I've been having to "refresh the page" each time I've given two. With slow dialup service that's been taking forever and has been making playing "catch up" when I log on here take about four hours... Grrrh... and I've let this problem go on for over a week. lol

THANKS, thought it was something I was doing, I get kicked out and have to re-sign in a lot, or the thanks button does not work. However so glad Websleuths is hear and I'm not alone during some of these trials. I gave up and sign in seldom but read your messages and want to hit thanks so often. You take your time and express your feelings and its people like you guys that make these unreal trials easier to watch. SEPTEMBER 11th is almost here, bad day for the USA, hope its also for mean cry baby party boy.

 

[Cherwell]

Rest easy Cherwell… there is no such thing as "being allowed to go home and sort out one's affairs" after a guilty verdict and a prison sentence… sentence is meant to be carried out immediately (unless application for leave to appeal and bail are granted)… accused facing possible prison sentence are deemed to have prepared themselves adequately for a possible incarceration prior to the scheduled date of the reading of the verdict.

… Even single mothers with children at home are immediately taken into custody after a guilty verdict and a prison sentence…

… and as Viper correctly stated, there isn't much hope for OP to "successfully" disappear himself to avoid SA justice : he is VERY recognizable and has NOTHING substantial to offer to illicit 'sympathy' from a foreign country.

That's what I thought. Until the recent conviction of Rolf Harris. He was allowed to go home after sentencing.

As for your second point, I wouldn't underestimate the Pistorius family. They have property in a neighbouring country, do they not.

 

[Cherwell]

For 'The talk in legal corridors' read - 'Here is yet more speculation without foundation.' I am getting tired of the so called 'experts' with apparent inside knowledge. From the article itself, 'Evidence in Pistorius' favour includes testimony that he was shocked after finding Steenkamp wounded and desperate to save her.' Really? Anyone that has followed this trial knows this is simply HIS VERSION!

One can immediately discount this statement by pointing out that the first call he made was to a friend to help him move the body, not get the Emergency Services on the phone & keep them on the line for advice on saving her. (Let's face it, she was already dead as per the Pathologist's report.)

However, the spin machine is working and the briefings have worked their way into the sub-conscious of Lazy Journalists.

Luckily, there is a Judge who will look at the facts of the case, not the speculation that is selling Newspapers & getting on-line clicks…

To be fair, the bit about him being shocked etc is probably referring to the testimonies of Dr Stipp and the Standers.

 

[BritsKate]

hi everyone. Really sorry as I'm 99% sure this will have been asked and answered elsewhere on the board (I have looked but not exhaustively so it's likely I've missed it), but can anyone help me out with info regarding the form the delivery of the verdict will take? Will Masipa deliver her judgement and subsequently lay out the reasoning behind it, or will it be akin to the bail decision with a long preamble and then the verdict?

That one. There's a written judgement that will be read aloud (essentially findings for acquittal or conviction) following a verdict. If convicted, a future date will be set for sentencing. (And a separate application needs to be made to extend his bail.) AFAIK and HTH

 

[Sherbert]

BBM - I for one believe the reports of OP and Stear having an affair are true... supposedly confirmed from sources in both camps. And, I believe the part about them having gotten together the latter part of January. I'm remembering that OP tweeted about the guys being on a road trip to Cape Town and I'm also remembering RS saying in her text to him of January 26 (or) 27 that he had "picked on her" ever since Cape Town.


IMHO, a flirtation (or probably worse) message may very well have taken place at 1:48AM Feb. 14, 2013. All moo.

Yes, foxbluff - I also think there was something going on...Erin certainly seemed very keen and she's most definitely his type.

 

[vansleuths]

I know what you mean, vansleuths! It seems the SA courts are even more drawn-out than the US courts. I can just hear the announcement on Thursday, "My Lady is feeling a bit under the weather today. Thus, the verdict will given 2 weeks from now. Of course, if there are high winds, the delay will be longer."

I just had a flashback to when one of the assessors fell sick right when the defence was starting their case. At that time, it was believed that OP would be the first witness.

 

[foxbluff]

That one. There's a written judgement that will be read aloud (essentially findings for acquittal or conviction) following a verdict. If convicted, a future date will be set for sentencing. (And a separate application needs to be made to extend his bail.) AFAIK and HTH

BBM... Ohhhh, I so hope you're right!! I had feared the actual verdict might not be announced until Friday.

I wonder what SA prison uniforms look like. (OP's no doubt will have to be tailored.)

 

[geevee]

That one. There's a written judgement that will be read aloud (essentially findings for acquittal or conviction) following a verdict. If convicted, a future date will be set for sentencing. (And a separate application needs to be made to extend his bail.) AFAIK and HTH

That's what I thought I'd read, that sentencing would be later, will there also be mitigation testimony?

 

[Lux et Veritas]

Oscar Pistorius @OscarPistorius · 5 Dec 2012
"@MaryMasipa17: @OscarPistorius Favourite place to visit overseas?" Mozambique, Seychelles and Greek Islands

Hah. Now we'll know where to find Oscar! :lol:

 

[Interested Bystander]

Rest easy Cherwell… there is no such thing as "being allowed to go home and sort out one's affairs" after a guilty verdict and a prison sentence… sentence is meant to be carried out immediately (unless application for leave to appeal and bail are granted)… accused facing possible prison sentence are deemed to have prepared themselves adequately for a possible incarceration prior to the scheduled date of the reading of the verdict.

… Even single mothers with children at home are immediately taken into custody after a guilty verdict and a prison sentence…

… and as Viper correctly stated, there isn't much hope for OP to "successfully" disappear himself to avoid SA justice : he is VERY recognizable and has NOTHING substantial to offer to illicit 'sympathy' from a foreign country.

BIR

Sentencing will be unlikely to happen until 2-4 weeks after the verdict. I cannot see Masipa sending OP to prison before he knows what his sentence is, even though most of us will wish him there. His bail will IMO be extended to cover the time taken for mitigation and sentencing. I shall be delighted to be proved wrong. Not long now until we find out.

 

[Interested Bystander]

Hah. Now we'll know where to find Oscar! :lol:

:lol:

He can try the following. None of them have extradition agreements with South Africa and I am sure for the right amount someone will have him. Money talks, as we know.

Afghanistan, Algeria, Andorra, Angola, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Benin, Bhutan, Botswana, Brunei, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cambodia, Cameroon, Cape Verde, Central African Republic, Chad, China, Comoros, Djibouti, Equatorial Guinea, Ethiopia, Gabon, Guinea, Guinea Bissau, Indonesia, Iran, Ivory Coast, Jordan, Kuwait, Laos, Lebanon, Libya, Madagascar, Mali, Maldives, Mauritania, Mongolia, Morocco, Mozambique, Nepal, Niger, Oman, Philippines, Qatar, Rwanda, Samoa, Sao Tome e Principe, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, Togo, Tunisia, Uganda, USSR, United Arab Emirates, Vanuatu, Vietnam, Yemen, Yemen South, Zaire,

 

[4MrsB]

I know what you mean, vansleuths! It seems the SA courts are even more drawn-out than the US courts. I can just hear the announcement on Thursday, "My Lady is feeling a bit under the weather today. Thus, the verdict will given 2 weeks from now. Of course, if there are high winds, the delay will be longer."

My thoughts regarding any delay:

IF there was a delay, it would NOT likely be due to Judge M. She is very aware of all that is at stake (the defendant spending sleepless nights waiting to know his fate, knowing this is a high profile case & televised.....Judge M will make sure she & her assessors are ready to go come Thursday morning.

HOWEVER, if there is a delay (which is quite possible, knowing how this case as crawled along at a snail's pace), it would be due to OSCAR.
Some examples:
A) Oscar was admitted to the emergency room last night. He is unable to appear.
B) Oscar is missing! (Yes, his "legs" are gone too)

Hopefully, everyone will be in place & ready to go come Thursday morning. I even anticipate brother Carl to be there sitting in a wheelchair, as support for his brother (and it can't hurt to play the "my brother almost died card" and is still here to support me, the poor misunderstood victimized defendant).

 

[4MrsB]

What are you all predicting for Thursday?

Sadly, I am still stuck with dolus eventualis- which i went for back in spring, even though in my heart it is directus.
Whilst I bow to the superior knowledge of this legal expert you have linked to, I don't believe it will be CH.

I agree...I truly don't believe OP's verdict will be Culpable Homicide.

I believe the verdict will be MURDER (whether dolus directus or dolus eventualis, doesn't matter to me as it is my understanding both are murder convictions, and both have a min 15 year sentence, but I might be mistaken).
I also believe Judge M will sentence him to the min. 15 years & then add a few more years for his deliberate lying to the courts. So perhaps a 20 year sentence.

Personally....I believe the evidence & testimony warranted a verdict of premeditated murder. But I do not believe he will receive that as a verdict.