Tire Tracks, Shoe Prints and DJH's cars

[KeepHopeAlive]

Thinking about this some more. The tire tracks by the footprints most likely indicated that the car was traveling by the footprints. In other words, the car would not have been parked at that spot. The reason I say this is, if the car would have been parked there, there would have been some indication in the tracks of the car starting out. If starting from a dead stop, there would have been some slippage of the tires in the dirt. Apparently investigators did not see any sign of slippage in the tire prints.

So that, coupled with Dan Rassier's eyewitness account of seeing a car with another person in it turn around in his driveway, would have led LE to conclude that the abduction was by car, and that the driver drove all the way into the DR property AFTER taking Jacob.

Once that car was identified (Kevin) in 2003 - it changed the whole theory of the crime. Again - it's all about the cars. If Dan Rassier truly did report (in 1989) two other cars in his driveway that day / night - then he is probably innocent. If he didn't report that right away, then he is probably guilty of the crime, or of covering it up.

That being said - there is nothing to support the notion that he reported multiple cars back in 1989.

Good insight. That did not occur to me. But how do we explain the dogs losing his scent, other than dogs are not necessarily 100% reliable?

Also, this just came to me. I haven't had time to think it through, but I'm going to put it out there anyway. I wonder if a car could was parked on the main road (16th?) just on the other side of the driveway AFTER the boys had gotten to store (so they would not have passed it on the way to the store, and they would not have noticed it on the way there or the way back). Could someone have pulled into the driveway (assuming that there were two or more people involved) once the two boys started running and were safely out of sight? Then the driver could have pulled into the driveway to pick up the abductor and Jacob? I wonder if there were any tracks at the very end of the driveway indicating which way a vehicle drove in and out. The idea might be a stretch, but I thought I'd put it out there anyway.

 

[Sasquatch321]

Jacobs last known footprint.

If Jacob steps straight forward into a vehicle on sand/dirt/gravel how is the pattern of the bottom of the shoe so intact?

To me this print looks pressed in, or stepped into and out of. this does not appear to be forward step into a vehicle, there would have been slipping.

Why do we only have a picture of this footprint, surely the perpetrator had to get into the vehicle as well? Is it just not there?


http://www.kare11.com/story/news/cr...ors-take-fresh-look-at-similar-cases/9064905/

 

[shergal]

Jacobs last known footprint.

If Jacob steps straight forward into a vehicle on sand/dirt/gravel how is the pattern of the bottom of the shoe so intact?

To me this print looks pressed in, or stepped into and out of. this does not appear to be forward step into a vehicle, there would have been slipping.

Why do we only have a picture of this footprint, surely the perpetrator had to get into the vehicle as well? Is it just not there?

If Jacob was trying to use his weight plus gravity to get away from the abductor he would have been pressing hard down into the ground. This may have been just before he was either picked up and tossed in the car, or picked up and carried off somewhere (to a car or other area). (JMO)

http://www.kare11.com/story/news/cr...ors-take-fresh-look-at-similar-cases/9064905/

 

[human]

If Jacob was trying to use his weight plus gravity to get away from the abductor he would have been pressing hard down into the ground. This may have been just before he was either picked up and tossed in the car, or picked up and carried off somewhere (to a car or other area). (JMO)

I see what he means though because people would naturally press with their toes rather than flat footed

 

[shergal]

I've created a photobucket account (under shergal1) that is public and solely for this board, so that anyone here can go look at pictures. I made screen captures of the various footprints and casts made from that video with the faded Jacob pic on it. You can click on the pics and zoom in so they can be larger than I can make them here on WS (without blowing margins).

There are several shots of Jacob's footprint, plus some others near his. Trackergd had noted there were horse hoof prints on some of those pics, so some may be from after Steve Mund made the casts.

There are also 3 articles there about the Huber Trial that I got from a paid subscription, and thus have no link. So I made them into photos so I could link to them here.

You should just be able to click here and view library. And zoom in on individual pictures by clicking on them.

http://s100.photobucket.com/user/shergal1/library/?sort=4&page=1

 

[Sasquatch321]

I've created a photobucket account (under shergal1) that is public and solely for this board, so that anyone here can go look at pictures. I made screen captures of the various footprints and casts made from that video with the faded Jacob pic on it. You can click on the pics and zoom in so they can be larger than I can make them here on WS (without blowing margins).

There are several shots of Jacob's footprint, plus some others near his. Trackergd had noted there were horse hoof prints on some of those pics, so some may be from after Steve Mund made the casts.

There are also 3 articles there about the Huber Trial that I got from a paid subscription, and thus have no link. So I made them into photos so I could link to them here.

You should just be able to click here and view library. And zoom in on individual pictures by clicking on them.

http://s100.photobucket.com/user/shergal1/library/?sort=4&page=1

There is no footprints of the perpetrator entering a vehicle. Its only of a person walking behind Jacob and then pulling him back into the ditch and into the farm. If a vehicle is involved the footprints I'm looking for have to exist and they aren't there. DR had been aware of "lovers lane" all his life, he knew to make it look like Jacob was taken from there in a vehicle.

 

[Sasquatch321]

My theory is that DR and Jacob walked along the side of the gravel driveway until DR commanded Jacob to step into the driveway, he then picked him up and DR backstepped back into the grass, and they headed towards the farm.

In Shergals photobucket, picture no. 7, no footprints in front of Jacobs indicating anyone entering a vehicle, except Jacob. The footprint is planted.

 

[Ifollowthis]

When we starting talking tracks and foot prints, my eyes start to glaze over because it is so far over my head. But lately there has been talk on here that Jacobs last foot print looks as he "lifted himself". Was it close enough to the edge of the drive way where it is sometimes part grass and part gravel, the type of terrain where tracks probably would not show, that it would have been possible for a motorcycle to be parked there and Jacob was told to get on the back of a motorcycle?

 

[shergal]

When we starting talking tracks and foot prints, my eyes start to glaze over because it is so far over my head. But lately there has been talk on here that Jacobs last foot print looks as he "lifted himself". Was it close enough to the edge of the drive way where it is sometimes part grass and part gravel, the type of terrain where tracks probably would not show, that it would have been possible for a motorcycle to be parked there and Jacob was told to get on the back of a motorcycle?

Possible, I guess. But aren't motorcycles usually kind of noisy? Wouldn't make for a very quiet getaway.

 

[human]

When we starting talking tracks and foot prints, my eyes start to glaze over because it is so far over my head. But lately there has been talk on here that Jacobs last foot print looks as he "lifted himself". Was it close enough to the edge of the drive way where it is sometimes part grass and part gravel, the type of terrain where tracks probably would not show, that it would have been possible for a motorcycle to be parked there and Jacob was told to get on the back of a motorcycle?

That is an idea, but why would Jacob stay on the motorcycle?

If your passenger is not a good passenger, it is not good for you as the driver either.

I think there would be tire prints from a motorcycle as well.

 

[Ifollowthis]

That is an idea, but why would Jacob stay on the motorcycle?

If your passenger is not a good passenger, it is not good for you as the driver either.

I think there would be tire prints from a motorcycle as well.

We do not know if he was a good passenger or not...gunpoint....or maybe the guy took off his mask, it was someone from the neighborhood and jacob was not as scared as he had been. we just do not know.

 

[Marzipan]

Well, I suggested a horse, so motorcycle isn't the craziest thing ever. Noisy, yes. I think at one point Trackerd or someone else thought of golf cart or atv, and others have mentioned farm machinery. I guess it looks to me like too far of a leap from Jacob's print to the grassy area, but maybe my mind is filling in gaps between the photos I've seen. (I'm not 100% sure I've seen where print is in relation to side of driveway.) And if it's too far, then there's still the issue of no known tracks for any of those other means of transport.

When we starting talking tracks and foot prints, my eyes start to glaze over because it is so far over my head. But lately there has been talk on here that Jacobs last foot print looks as he "lifted himself". Was it close enough to the edge of the drive way where it is sometimes part grass and part gravel, the type of terrain where tracks probably would not show, that it would have been possible for a motorcycle to be parked there and Jacob was told to get on the back of a motorcycle?

 

[StinkSprings]

Let's use this thread to gather as much visual information as possible to analyze.

 

[Jennifermn]

A search revealed that shergal had a photobucket link that was shared a while back. Hope it's okay to share it now, it has a lot of pics.

http://s100.photobucket.com/user/shergal1/library/?sort=4&page=1

 

[777]

Ok, I admit I have never looked much at tire tracks before this case. But, I have read a lot of hearsay.
Here's a track-related thought chain for your consideration:

1. The driveway is undoubtedly two hard-packed ruts corresponding to where the tires repeatedly drive over the decades,
2. ....surrounded on the left, center and right by a softer area where the tires rarely go.

xxxxx0000xxxx0000xxxxx
xxxxx0000xxxx0000xxxxx
xxxxx0000xxxx0000xxxxx
xxxxx0000xxxx0000xxxxx​

driveway aerial depiction

x=softer sand
0=packed, harder surface
graphic artistry provided by 777
© 2015 by 777, used by permission

​

3. The harder packed area may not be conducive to any kind of tracks. My own experience with a dirt driveway makes me believe this. There are never any tracks where cars usually drive.

4. The softer area could catch tracks very well.

............which leads my pea brain to two big points:

4a. there could be plenty of car activity on the driveway with no recoverable tracks
4b. the recoverable tracks are likely on the softer sand part of the driveway OR in the turnabout cul-de-sac area by the house

5. A well known person in these parts and active on Joy's site has determined that Jacob's footprint is facing south. (the big clear picture of his shoe print at the edge of a tire track (top row of Shergals pics)). This is based on shadows, more specifically that in MN the sun is always on the southern half of the sky. (he's posted here, forgot his name...)

6. based on all of the above, Jacob was standing on the northernish side of the driveway when his feet left the ground.
7. furthermore, based on the 2nd row of Shergals pics, it seems the tire track they are casting is in the middle soft sand...NOT on the more expected hard packed tire ruts.
8. also, the tire track is small. It's a small car. Or a motorcycle.
* Why isn't a motorcycle more discussed as an option here?*

9. finally, Jacob's shoe print is exceptionally clear. And deep. He weighs less than 100 pounds and his track is a lot deeper and easier to identify than what is presumably the track of a car weighing at least 1000 pounds (probably more).
9a. why the heck is Jacob's print so pronounced? Dropped on the ground? Fell back onto this foot while trying to maneuver?





777

 

[StinkSprings]

Trackergd - Taking a look at the bias ply scenario LE would have had a fairly accurate depiction on the width of the vehicle based on the remnants of the prints. One of the cars LE was looking for was an AMC Pacer or Gremlin. Both compacts would be about the same weight as a Volkswagen Beetle and were available from the factory with bias plys.

<modsnip>

 

[ELOCsoul]

Ok, I admit I have never looked much at tire tracks before this case. But, I have read a lot of hearsay.
Here's a track-related thought chain for your consideration:

1. The driveway is undoubtedly two hard-packed ruts corresponding to where the tires repeatedly drive over the decades,
2. ....surrounded on the left, center and right by a softer area where the tires rarely go.

xxxxx0000xxxx0000xxxxx
xxxxx0000xxxx0000xxxxx
xxxxx0000xxxx0000xxxxx
xxxxx0000xxxx0000xxxxx​

driveway aerial depiction

x=softer sand
0=packed, harder surface
graphic artistry provided by 777
© 2015 by 777, used by permission

​

3. The harder packed area may not be conducive to any kind of tracks. My own experience with a dirt driveway makes me believe this. There are never any tracks where cars usually drive.

4. The softer area could catch tracks very well.

............which leads my pea brain to two big points:

4a. there could be plenty of car activity on the driveway with no recoverable tracks
4b. the recoverable tracks are likely on the softer sand part of the driveway OR in the turnabout cul-de-sac area by the house

5. A well known person in these parts and active on Joy's site has determined that Jacob's footprint is facing south. (the big clear picture of his shoe print at the edge of a tire track (top row of Shergals pics)). This is based on shadows, more specifically that in MN the sun is always on the southern half of the sky. (he's posted here, forgot his name...)

6. based on all of the above, Jacob was standing on the northernish side of the driveway when his feet left the ground.
7. furthermore, based on the 2nd row of Shergals pics, it seems the tire track they are casting is in the middle soft sand...NOT on the more expected hard packed tire ruts.
8. also, the tire track is small. It's a small car. Or a motorcycle.
* Why isn't a motorcycle more discussed as an option here?*

9. finally, Jacob's shoe print is exceptionally clear. And deep. He weighs less than 100 pounds and his track is a lot deeper and easier to identify than what is presumably the track of a car weighing at least 1000 pounds (probably more).
9a. why the heck is Jacob's print so pronounced? Dropped on the ground? Fell back onto this foot while trying to maneuver?





777

Good thought here, you have a lot of helpful insight!

We had figured out the direction of Jacobs print on here some time last year or so. I'm intrigued by your idea of the print being in the north edge of the driveway. How did you arrive at that idea?

 

[Sasquatch321]

I believe the tire and shoeprints are still a story of mass confusion for everyone, or have we figured something out?

 

[777]

... I'm intrigued by your idea of the print being in the north edge of the driveway. How did you arrive at that idea?

777's numbering scheme of Shergal's footprint photos referenced in discussion below

1.....2.....3.....4
5.....6.....7.....8
9....10...11...12​

​

1. We know Jacob was facing south from the shadow evidence. Pictures 1, 2 & 3.
   
   ​
2. We know the tire track they are making plaster casts of is getting towards the south side of the driveway, or rather the south side of the middle. Pictures 5,6, 8 & 9.
   
   ​
3. Note particularly in picture 9 we can see the yellow crime scene tape in the background, meaning the photographer is standing on the east side of the man working the tracks.
   
   ​
4. See Shergal's post #21 on this thread. Note where the yellow crime scene tape is. Also note the fence is on the south side of the driveway according to the aerial view in post 21.
   
   ​
5. Compare known location of yellow tape and fence to Picture 9. Man is facing south. Towards fence.
   
   ​
6. Note where the tracks are compared to the overall width of the driveway in picture 6. Note the relative position of the red tape changing between pictures 5/6 and 8 and how this implies the position of the tracks relative to the north, south or center of the driveway.​

.....meaning.....IMO PICTURE 9 SHOWS US A GOOD IDEA OF WHERE JACOB WAS LAST STANDING, INCLUDING the direction he was facing.

.....JACOB IS well represented by the photographer in picture 9, except he would have been a foot or so to the left (south).

So, let me adjust my statement a bit...Jacob was facing South and had WALKED from a slightly northerly side of the driveway towards the middle or even southerly side. He started walking up the driveway from the northerly side of it and got into the car just to the southerly side of the middle of the driveway, facing south.

....implying to me the car was pulled over stopped on the southern side of the driveway.

....meaning the car was either facing towards the house & Jacob got in the driver side OR facing towards the road and Jacob got in the passenger side.

....Best guess from 777: the car was facing TOWARDS THE HOUSE, but parked towards the right (south) of the driveway, with the right side of the car at the south edge or beyond the south edge of the driveway. Jacob got in the drivers side. The nice car prints seens in pictures 5 & 6 are of the left/drivers side of the car.

....meaning the car would have had to turn around at some point after Jacob was already in it if Jacob left the area right away. This is probably the main take-away of my track studies - the car was likely headed the wrong direction on the driveway. The abductor either had to turn around at some point to leave or did not leave the property.




777

 

[Trackergd]

Jacobs last known footprint.

If Jacob steps straight forward into a vehicle on sand/dirt/gravel how is the pattern of the bottom of the shoe so intact?

To me this print looks pressed in, or stepped into and out of. this does not appear to be forward step into a vehicle, there would have been slipping.

Why do we only have a picture of this footprint, surely the perpetrator had to get into the vehicle as well? Is it just not there?


http://www.kare11.com/story/news/cr...ors-take-fresh-look-at-similar-cases/9064905/

The front of the print is deeper than the center, but not fast enough to push back a ridge, plate or plate fissure. Moving forward as climbing into a car.