TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #13

[Shelby1]

I thought the same thing because how could she hear a crash and then someone turning around? Gail couldn't turn around if she already went off the bluff, so who was it? If it was just someone driving along, why didn't they report it? Well, I can think of several reasons ~ it was someone chasing or following Gail, or it was someone who ran into her and they had car damage also.

If I had heard a terrible crash, I would have gone outside to see what happened, wouldn't you?

The crash and then someone turning around is big.

Why didn't a dang reporter ask that question at the presser???

Sigh.

I wish there was more follow up on Gail's claims that she was being followed. :banghead:

 

[Shelby1]

Yes, I would.

Relying on ya'll who can read the report, but...okay so there's no damage to the front of the Jeep. We know the weight of the rock but not the height? Could it have been dragged along by some portion of the undercarriage of the Jeep?

I am totally bummed that now that we have the official report, we seem to have just as many if not more questions. Urg.

Yes, somewhere in the report--I can find it later--it says the rock either went over in front of the jeep or underneath the jeep as it was going.

 

[almino]

Emeralgem, here you go per the report on page 37-38:

- brake lamps were "On" at 3.4 seconds, 2 seconds, 1.4 seconds and 0.2 seconds before the MRE (Most Recent Event)
- speeds were 16 mph at 5 seconds; 19 mph at 4 secs; 20 mph at 3 secs; 22 mph at 2 secs and 1 secs. The highest speed 24 at 2.2 and 2.3 seconds. All MRE times
- the gearshift position recorded as "Drive" until 0.3 secs before MRE, then "Neutral" at 0.2 MRE; then "Park" at 0.1 MRE. Perhaps the gearshift was bumped?
- calculated travel distance during the 5 secs was 142.8 t0 164.6 feet
- there was a sudden drop of Accelerator Pedal Percent from 77.2% ti 0.00% at 2.2 seconds prior to MRE

When car was found: gearshift was in "neutral"; the emergency flashers/lights were "on" when they started the car.

I'm not exactly sure what the Most Recent Event and First Prior Event is? They discussed the oversteering in relation to the MRE.

Hope some of this is helpful

 

[Elley Mae]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/2011/12/06/gIQA3u6sZO_photo.html



http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2011/dec/18/black-box-from-palmgrens-jeep-searched-for-clues/

 

[almino]

For some reason I can understand why the homeowners didn't report it. They sound middle aged, getting ready for a trip, the husband napping, she is packing in the back of the house. This is why all the SOUNDS are memorable to her - and given the time element, things were happening very quickly. By the time she got to looking out the window, there wasn't anything to be seen.

She didn't know about Gail whatsoever that day, that Gail had just dropped off her kids, that Gail had gone missing. She might have not known anything about Gail for quite some time, until she returned from her trip.

So really, what was there to report? She heard things, but nothing in sight. Then she probably forgot about it all while vacationing. After time passed, seeing that the rock was gone - she didn't connect it.

So it wasn't until they were recovering the vehicle that she pieced the SOUNDS back into place. I attribute it to age and getting ready for their trip to see kids/grandkids.

Makes sense to me.

 

[almino]

Yes, somewhere in the report--I can find it later--it says the rock either went over in front of the jeep or underneath the jeep as it was going.

The description of noise after the metal crashing, extended squealing of tires, was the RUMBLE just prior to hearing a crash. The rumble could be the rock under the jeep or caught in front and any jarring it caused to the gearshift or brakes.

 

[redfish]

The description of noise after the metal crashing, extended squealing of tires, was the RUMBLE just prior to hearing a crash. The rumble could be the rock under the jeep or caught in front and any jarring it caused to the gearshift or brakes.

Wow... I don't know how these guys are ever going to forget this case. I bet it keeps a few of them up at night like it does me. The biggest thing in this report to stand out for me is his statement that they found nothing that will stand up in court. In my opinion the report shows alot of room for "something" nefarious.

The witness statement by Dr. ME is very credible, it is a crying shame she was not in the front part of the house to witness the vehicle that turned around in her drive. (Funny OT it so happens I know this witness.... she is a very sharp woman.) Surely someone else heard or saw something and will put 2 + 2 together now that Dr ME has come forward publically.... I can hope can't I?

 

[Elley Mae]

I wonder who the other vehicle belonged to that they found down there.

 

[Emeralgem]

Arlene Durham responds to Matthew Palmgren's interview


http://www.newschannel9.com/news/durham-1007871-palmgren-gail.html

 

[cocomod]

I would love to see someone do an experiment and try to push a 400+ lb rock over the edge of a cliff with a jeep going 20 mph. It needs to be a rock that is placed there and "settled" into it's place. It needs to have a railroad tie next to the road before the rock. I just would love to recreate moving that rock without having some extra force behind the jeep helping the jeep move the rock. Just curiosity that won't settle within me about this piece of evidence.

 

[Emeralgem]

I wonder who the other vehicle belonged to that they found down there.

Don't know..LE claims it is/was not related to Gail's accident..JMHO

 

[almino]

http://timesfreepress.com/news/2012/...d-an-accident/

Wait a second, this article claims per MP's lawyer Lee Davis that: "Some of Gail's family members stayed at Matt's house this weekend. It's a large family. They are doing the best they can to get through a difficult situation."

Really and Wow! I wonder who stayed there. The articles we read prior is that Gail's sister and her husband stayed at a neighbors house and then MP called police on them when they were in his yard giving the kids Christmas gifts.

This is curious.

 

[Emeralgem]

I would love to see someone do an experiment and try to push a 400+ lb rock over the edge of a cliff with a jeep going 20 mph. It needs to be a rock that is placed there and "settled" into it's place. It needs to have a railroad tie next to the road before the rock. I just would love to recreate moving that rock without having some extra force behind the jeep helping the jeep move the rock. Just curiosity that won't settle within me about this piece of evidence.

Anyone recall reading anything in the documents about the neighbor claiming she had seen high chassis trucks on their property?

 

[almino]

Anyone recall reading anything in the documents about the neighbor claiming she had seen high chassis trucks on their property?

Here you go from the Homeowners Report: No one came by their house inquiring about an accident. "We thought no more about it because there have been several occasions where we have observed people parking high chassis pick-up trucks on our landing and leaving tire marks in the grass."

 

[Columbo]

The resident account is only part of the picture and considering she wasn’t even sure what day it was and only gave her story months later not having thought enough of it to alert LE even after a high profile mom was missing from a couple miles away coincidentally in that time frame.

Remember it was on the heels of the worst, most deadly line of tornados that ever struck the region. If that doesn’t stick in your mind I don’t know what does.

The rock was at the edge of the road so it had to be dealt with to access the grass.

I was thinking maybe the sound of the crash and tires was the hitting the rock and starting its propulsion.

Tires spinning as the jeep got its traction.

It doesn’t seem like the rock would damage a jeep especially if it was being moved not like running in to a rock face or an immovable object.

It would seem that since it is a sheer drop that the mountain itself and the resident’s position in the house would make the sound of the first downward impact distant.

As far as overcorrecting I’m thinking she made a wide turn

If she was trying to stop why didn’t she turn away from the steep drop? The tries tracks go right straight to the edge.

I forget which poster it was but they gave the best description – it is like looking out a airplane window at that spot.

If there had been another ear witness to collaborate it would be helpful but we only have a single person’s memory of the day and witness memories are not always accurate from what I gather in other cases.

IMO

How would you explain the fact that most of the damage was rear-end damage?

 

[Columbo]

You forgot skunk!

And I totally agree...for a closed case, there is still plenty of room for speculation. Which means her children will not have closure (because you'd better believe that no matter what they are told now, they will look into it for themselves later, "you" being the collective "you," of course).

And turtle! Let's not forget turtle!

Speaking of "closure": that's the other thing among many that bothered me about MP's interview, how he kept saying they just wanted closure. Usually it doesn't give me a bad feeling when a family member says this, but coming from him it just sounded fishy.

 

[Emeralgem]

Speaking of "closure": that's the other thing among many that bothered me about MP's interview, how he kept saying they just wanted closure. Usually it doesn't give me a bad feeling when a family member says this, but coming from him it just sounded fishy.

He definitely wants closure to the case...He also stated he is 100% in agreement with their findings too, eventhough LE flat out stated they didn't have enough evidence to properly analyze what really happened...JMHO
But IIRC... Didn't Hammond say.... "We will continue to entertain reliable information"?

 

[lalalu]

I don't remember where I read about how a vehicle in a similar situation falls, but at one point there was a posting either here or MSM that explained that although the weight is in the front of the vehicle (engine and all that), the vehicle does not fall straight down like a bullet. It was said that momentum would cause the vehicle to start an end over end roll.

If this is plausible, it could be that the jeep did hit the first bluff with the back end. (I believe the jeep was found sitting on it's wheels at the bottom of the second one, right?)

I also wonder about Ms. E's recollection after 8 months. She was unsure of date or time and memories can be susceptible to suggestion as well.

Anyway, I'm not an MP fan...he is a cad, but I do not think he is a murderer or accessory to such, however, many are not satisfied because the accident cannot be "proven". Isn't "burden of proof" just for determining a crime? What tangible evidence points to a crime?

 

[Analyze This]

How would you explain the fact that most of the damage was rear-end damage?

The accident report states:

On page 43:

There appeared to be a deep indentation matching the aspect of Vehicle # 1's rear trunk area on this ledge. (refers to a ledge that is 82 feet below the edge of the bluff where the right rear tail light assembly and the rock were found)

On page 44 of the accident report it is noted that:

The crush deformation to the trunk area of Vehicle # 1 indicated that it struck the first ledge, upside down, with the front of Vehicle # 1 oriented towards the east.

It was also stated in the report on page 44 that the Jeep hit a tree and knocked it over. It just gave me a sense of how hard of an impact the Jeep made while it was falling.

 

[Melodie]

So if a random person (perhaps the car that Mrs. Epperson heard turning around in her driveway) hit Gail from behind, his or her car must have sustained front end damage, and would possibly have been taken to a local shop for repairs. Wonder if any car mechanics remember a vehicle with red paint scrapes (I'm assuming) on a crashed-in front end?

ETA: or a wrecking company

When I read the report last night, I cried over the mention of the brakes and the gearshift. I read it aloud to my DH and he looked over at me and we just shook our heads. Seconds before she went over the edge, it sounds like she may have been trying to put the Jeep in reverse. It went from drive to neutral and the brakes were applied and possibly she was trying to use the emergency brake. I have been in a near accident before and I can tell you that when you lose control of your vehicle, you only have time to do two things: turn the steering wheel and hit the brakes. You don't have time when you have lost control and are trying to stop an accident to think to pull up the emergency brake or move the gearshift. So, did this take a little longer than they suspect? Why was she attempting to stop the Jeep, but yet picking up speed? Does the witness statement indicate that there was another vehicle there? Another possible vehicle....a longer amount of time.... Gail trying to utilize every available option to stop what was happening... This is what I took from the report, but I'm not a "yaw" expert. If anyone can help me understand, please educate me. JMO