TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #7

[BeanE]

I question whether someone who is trying to disappear would just toss a phone out a car window where anyone could pick it up and find out info via the phone. Seems to me they would thoroughly destroy the phone and dispose of it in a way to minimize it being traced back to their new location. If nothing else, tossing it out the window would be like leaving an easily traceable breadcrumb showing their path and possibly time of movement.

I agree. One can take a hammer and smash the phone before tossing it out the window. Tossing the phone out the window and into the back of a passing pickup truck with out of state tags gains you extra points.

The way Elizabeth Johnson tossed her phone, and what happened subsequently with the pings (and her, and her vehicle) is a cautionary tale for anyone interested in using pings to attempt to locate a person and/or their vehicle. Info in the LE docs in Gabriel Johnson's case.

 

[Ladydoc]

I wonder if there is a landline phone at the SM house and if those records have been checked. I'm just thinking that she could have been lured out of the home to meet someone that way. A smart person would know cell records would be easily checked and he wouldn't want to be her last call.

Even a hand-written note left for her could've accomplished the same thing and could be easily disposed of when the ex arrived to get the children...

 

[Oriah]

IIRC, the manufacturer installed one was removed and given to Arlene. Gail bought a new GPS and put that on the Jeep.

I don't know how GPS works. I researched OnStar in a case and after a surprisingly short time of the car being turned off, it stops pinging, even for the emergency signal they can send to it, unless/until the car is turned back on.

How long does a GPS ping after a car is turned off? Does it vary by manufacturer?

BBM:
Wait....what?? :waitasec:

Have we researched Uconnect?

Also- how the heck would Gail have disconnected the installed cable?


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[glorias]

I wonder if there is a landline phone at the SM house and if those records have been checked. I'm just thinking that she could have been lured out of the home to meet someone that way. A smart person would know cell records would be easily checked and he wouldn't want to be her last call.

Even a hand-written note left for her could've accomplished the same thing and could be easily disposed of when the ex arrived to get the children...

According to Arlene in an interview (I don't remember which one, unfortunately) she called the house landline after Gail didn't answer her cell phone.

 

[BeanE]

If Gail had done all of this research into leaving, why all the calls to LE...especially the last one? Would she really want LE to be part of that ruse? I haven't read any of the above mentioned books, but I truly doubt and would do a jaw drop, if any recommended contacting LE. :waitasec:

I don't see any indication of Gail wanting LE to be part of a ruse? I'm not sure what you mean, holly.

I didn't see any recommendations in what I read to call LE, and I'd be surprised to find them as well.

So far as why did Gail get Diane to call LE on the 30th if she was planning on leaving - I'm not sure that when Gail called Diane to ask her to call LE that she'd already made up her mind to leave that day, rather than wait until school let out as she'd planned.

In fact, I tend to think more that, if she left willingly, whether to commit suicide or to start a new life, her final decision to leave on that day, was made after her conversations with Diane and LE.

 

[BeanE]

BBM:
Wait....what?? :waitasec:

Also- how the heck would Gail have disconnected the installed cable?

Susan Milano Murphy interview with Arlene.

ETA: There are two of them, June 16 and June 23. I think it's the June 16 one. They're both audio.

ETA again: I don't know if Gail physically did the work herself of putting the new GPS on the Jeep, or if she had it installed. I don't know who took the old manufacturer's one off and gave it to Arlene. If it was done at a shop or what.

 

[Oriah]

Susan Milano Murphy interview with Arlene.

ETA: There are two of them, June 16 and June 23. I think it's the June 16 one. They're both audio.

Ah, I see.

But this is my curiosity regarding any other phones and/or devices that may have pinged from somewhere- along a route Gail may have taken. And I just don't get how the factory-installed GPS could have been easily removed. :waitasec:

Perhaps we should look at service records for the Jeep?

ETA- if anyone in the vehicle were utilizing this function either during the trip to AL or back... it would ping off of a tower somewhere. Thus my concern. Kwim?

ETA again- do we know what devices may have been in Gail's Jeep when it disappeared? For example, did anyone use a video or game system that might be in the vehicle?

<An in-car router that connects any Wi-Fi-enabled device to the Internet at
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[MacKat]

This is again not directed anyone specifically. I just want to speak my opinion about a certain thing I've seen mentioned by multiple people.

Personally, I'm not convinced Gail's family isn't doing anything or even not doing much. We know so little about what anyone is doing, not just the family but LE, Matt's PI, Matt himself, etc. In light of our lack of knowledge about what goes on behind the scenes, I really, really question the necessity of asking why the family hasn't done more to find Gail.

The family has a lot going on. I can't imagine what it must feel like to have a missing sibling and want to both find her and pursue justice if it turns out a crime was committed, but at the same time not want your niece and nephew to be hurt any more than they already are. How helpless they must feel because they have lives in other states, their own families and jobs that need to be cared for. Maybe they're in denial. Maybe they don't know what else to do than the things they've already done. Maybe they're speaking with a lawyer and their own law enforcement experts quietly.

What I'm saying is that maybe what we perceive as lack of action isn't lack of action at all.

Those are my two cents, it's all my opinion and nothing more.

BBM
Such good points. I mean do any of us really think the LE is going to come out and say, "We speak with Gail's family on a daily basis." I remember when the court date was announced and many people were pleased and surprised. It's not like that happens overnight. You also brought up the children which clearly the siblings have an interest in protecting as well as a pursuit of justice. I would think they are bound and determined to protect what they know in order to protect the investigation as well as the integrity of the facts, in case this does go to court...in any area.

 

[BeanE]

Ah, I see.

But this is my curiosity regarding any other phones and/or devices that may have pinged from somewhere- along a route Gail may have taken. And I just don't get how the factory-installed GPS could have been easily removed. :waitasec:

Perhaps we should look at service records for the Jeep?

ETA- if anyone in the vehicle were utilizing this function either during the trip to AL or back... it would ping off of a tower somewhere. Thus my concern. Kwim?

<An in-car router that connects any Wi-Fi-enabled device to the Internet at
3G broadband speeds, allowing multiple passengers to surf the Web and social networks, look
up directions, check eMail, or download music. Uconnect Web is an Authentic Jeep Accessory>

But that was taken off Gail's Jeep and put on Arlene's vehicle. Do you mean that they could have just taken off the GPS part and left something else that would have pinged? I'm sorry, Oriah. I'm lost. I'm no good with equipment like this.

 

[believe09]

Great post Oriah...

Sorry to muddy the waters even further but does anyone know for sure if Gail actually made it all the way home to SM on 4/30?

Is there someone who could have impersonated Gail when SB saw the Jeep being driven away from the SM home at approx. 12:15 pm on 4/30? Whoever was driving the jeep, Gail, or someone else, that person did not acknowledge SB as Gail typically would have done.

I think if Gail had of driven back to the AL lake house on 4/30 and stayed there until 5/2 (date of last known cell phone ping at base of SM), Gail would have managed to get in touch with AD.

Well, this is an interesting thought for sure. Someone dropped the children off. If it was not Gail, I dont know how she could have spoken with her sister and LE on her return to the mountain from the Lake House and not let someone know that the kids werent with her. If she split up from the children, for safety reasons, why wouldnt she have made some mention of it?

I guess she might have....hmmm. As for Gail reaching out to AD if she came back, wouldnt AD at least have seen her car and not have been frantically calling around looking for her friend? I would think that AD would have been free with any siting information of her own-she appears to have been pretty candid in her media campaign.

 

[believe09]

But that was taken off Gail's Jeep and put on Arlene's vehicle. Do you mean that they could have just taken off the GPS part and left something else that would have pinged? I'm sorry, Oriah. I'm lost. I'm no good with equipment like this.

BBM-boy I have missed something in my time away. Is this something we learned from LE?

 

[Oriah]

But that was taken off Gail's Jeep and put on Arlene's vehicle. Do you mean that they could have just taken off the GPS part and left something else that would have pinged? I'm sorry, Oriah. I'm lost. I'm no good with equipment like this.

No worries, Bean!
I'm trying to figure it out myself.

GPS's are (of course) satellite-based. They 'ping' off of the closest satellite signal they can find. A bit different than a cell phone ping, which is receiving signals from the ground, as opposed to 'outerspace' lol- for lack of a better to explain.

There are GPS's that you can buy and attach to your vehicle... and then there are installed GPS's in certain vehicles. Sometimes you have to pay a service fee to have them work (like OnStar), and sometimes you get a free trial, or something like that- and sometimes when you purchase a vehicle, it will come with a year or two of free service.

But no matter what- if you either have service, or activate service- or reactivate service- in a vehicle that has an installed GPS system... it should ping somewhere off of a satellite. Unless it is damaged. Does that make any sense??
I am probably confusing even more!

 

[Oriah]

BBM-boy I have missed something in my time away. Is this something we learned from LE?

I don't think so, believe. :waitasec:

I'm trying to clarify the GPS situation in order to figure out if there are any other devices in the Jeep that may have pinged off of either a cell tower or a satellite (or both) anywhere.

Does anyone know if Gails Jeep has factory installed game or video systems?

 

[believe09]

I think asking CC to post her flyer or distribute it in some fashion is a great idea.

I know everyone wants to find Gail-but one thing to consider is whether or not Gail wants to be found. IF she is out and about, she appears to have some very good reasons for disappearing. We want to make sure we are not crossing a line and outing a woman who does not want to be found. For example-I would not suggest attending AlAnon meetings or AA meetings in an attempt to find out if she voluntarily disappeared.

I am not saying anyone would do that....everyone here clearly has their heart in the right place.

JMO-but we have to balance our quest for information... ((hugs))

 

[believe09]

I don't think so, believe. :waitasec:

I'm trying to clarify the GPS situation in order to figure out if there are any other devices in the Jeep that may have pinged off of either a cell tower or a satellite (or both) anywhere.

Does anyone know if Gails Jeep has factory installed game or video systems?

My confusion is around her factory installed GPS. There should have been a log of her last "requests" or location if it was running. LE and/or family should have been able to obtain this information. I am uncertain how long the logs are kept at the manufacturer...I know with OnStar, a different type of service that works in a similar fashion, LE and family were able to obtain the logs even though initially OnStar said they do not keep them. This occurred in another case, but was instrumental to finding the missing woman.

As for the possibility that there was a PI installed GPS, like one that was allegedly installed on MP's car, I havent seen anything concrete indicating that this was going on. Was it established that MP had hired a PI prior to his current one? Perhaps this was the person who was "watching" her??

 

[Annie_61]

I don't see any indication of Gail wanting LE to be part of a ruse? I'm not sure what you mean, holly.

BBM
I can&#8217;t speak for Hollyblue but I think she is saying if Gail had read the books you had listed in your post and planned her disappearance would she have involved the LE or would the books have suggested she involve them. I also thought your post re the books was suggesting that she could have planned her disappearance easily with so much information readily available :innocent:

I didn't see any recommendations in what I read to call LE, and I'd be surprised to find them as well.

So far as why did Gail get Diane to call LE on the 30th if she was planning on leaving - I'm not sure that when Gail called Diane to ask her to call LE that she'd already made up her mind to leave that day, rather than wait until school let out as she'd planned.
In fact, I tend to think more that, if she left willingly, whether to commit suicide or to start a new life, her final decision to leave on that day, was made after her conversations with Diane and LE.

BBM
If as you indicate now that she didn&#8217;t decide until she got back to Signal Mountain she was going to up and leave I don&#8217;t think she said bugger this <-(please note this is a Aussie slang expression that is not offensive) I am going to run away, Googled how to disappear without a trace or popped into the nearest library and read up on how to get rid of your past life and a big red Jeep 101.

If I am wrong Hollyblue you can send me a note telling me I was wrong and BeanE you can just keep adding colours to your brilliant mindmap to worry and confuse me even more.:grouphug:

 

[Littleone48]

(snipped for brevity)

Another poster (sorry, not sure who it was, now) mentioned looking at surveillance cameras...are there any cameras inside, outside or in the general vicinity of your store that could be examined?

Does anyone know if Gail has any identifying marks on her face, neck, hands or other typically exposed areas of skin, i.e. birthmarks, moles, freckles, tattoos, scars, etc. that would assist in a nonconfrontational means of positive identification? TIA

It's a long story that will get confused in a post but I will try

1. Yes I have cameras however I cannot remember when I saw her. Time has no value to me. It was either May or June. I work Thursday-Monday. I am thinking it was a Sat because I will do anything not to work the register.

2. The reason I remember her is because I have a customer that looks like her. My store is kinda a "Cheers" of the area. I am great with faces, not so much with names. The customer is a drunk and she looks rough. I know that she was arrested for a DWI and I hadn't seen her for a while. She is a bit smaller than Gail, but doesn't wear glasses.

3. The day this happened the person came up to the counter and at first glance I thought it was our customer and thought to myself "she looks great". Then I realized that it was not her.

4. I happened to check out this thread and there she was. Not the professional picture but the 2nd picture. I am about 90% sure that it was her.

5. As I stated above, I did call LE. I also called the local Days Inn where a friend works and sent her the picture.

I cannot explain why this is haunting me. I can't even explain why at the time I made a mental note. Also there was something about the way she was looking at me...ugg I just can't explain it.

 

[BeanE]

BBM-boy I have missed something in my time away. Is this something we learned from LE?

Nope nothing new, believe. As I said, it was in one of the SMM interviews, I believe the June 16. It was discussed quite a bit in Gail's threads.

 

[BeanE]

No worries, Bean!
I'm trying to figure it out myself.

GPS's are (of course) satellite-based. They 'ping' off of the closest satellite signal they can find. A bit different than a cell phone ping, which is receiving signals from the ground, as opposed to 'outerspace' lol- for lack of a better to explain.

There are GPS's that you can buy and attach to your vehicle... and then there are installed GPS's in certain vehicles. Sometimes you have to pay a service fee to have them work (like OnStar), and sometimes you get a free trial, or something like that- and sometimes when you purchase a vehicle, it will come with a year or two of free service.

But no matter what- if you either have service, or activate service- or reactivate service- in a vehicle that has an installed GPS system... it should ping somewhere off of a satellite. Unless it is damaged. Does that make any sense??
I am probably confusing even more!

How long will it ping after the car is turned off? Or does that vary by manufacturer? I know OnStar from another case pings only for a very short time.

 

[BeanE]

BBM
If as you indicate now that she didn&#8217;t decide until she got back to Signal Mountain she was going to up and leave I don&#8217;t think she said bugger this <-(please note this is a Aussie slang expression that is not offensive) I am going to run away, Googled how to disappear without a trace or popped into the nearest library and read up on how to get rid of your past life and a big red Jeep 101.

No, I don't mean that she got home on the 30th and then suddenly googled and decided to disappear.

I mentioned about how she had already been planning to leave after school let out.

I was suggesting the possibly that, after those phone calls, she may have decided to enact her plan right then and there, instead of waiting until school let out, and with a variation - not taking the kids.