TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #8

[glorias]

I find it odd that a husband who is possibly headed into a divorce and a custody battle would not JUMP at the opportunity to call the police when he came home to find his kids left there unattended.

Excellent point. By all accounts, it was a contentious divorce. Matt finds the kids left alone and he doesn't say a word? Not even to document it for the upcoming divorce case? He was so keen very early on to tell the media in a phone interview that Gail would leave all the time, was paranoid and writing down license plates. Since her disappearance, his lawyers have released info from the G's who claim Gail was very mentally unstable, plus they told Jammer Scott that Gail's brother killed herself so he could imply Gail was stressed (and also imply a family history of suicide, IMVHO). Yet the day she left the kids unattended, not a word. Didn't call LE until Diane did first and urged him to do so.

So very curious.

 

[ThoughtFox]

Oh thank God ~ at last!

Chatt. Times Free Press: FBI Will Assist in Palmgren Case

The FBI is not taking a lead role in the investigation, Galloway said, but is offering technical support and letting local authorities access its lab to process any evidence collected in the case.

"We'll help in any way we can and lend any assets," he said.

The federal agency also is reviewing the case along with Tennessee Bureau of Investigation, which came onboard earlier this month.

 

[Annie_61]

I know at the moment the thread is focused pretty much on the FBI involvement but I have spent a long time pondering over the situation of Gail’s siblings and to be honest I feel for them so badly because they are damned if they do and damned if they don’t.

Imagine being in their shoes, if they come out all guns blazing accusing Matt of foul play and it turns out in the long run that he was innocent, they will have burned any bridges re being part of their niece and nephews life. At this stage nobody can confirm that Gail is missing because she met with foul play or she left on her own accord, then there is the accident theory. If either of the last two scenarios are the case and they have come out claiming Matt was behind Gail’s disappearance the children would have a hard time understanding why they publicly bashed their father.

Their public silence could be from looking at the big picture and what the future hold for their sister’s two children. They could believe they don’t have enough information on any of the possible scenarios to publicly come out and say anything, instead they are quietly working with the right people to hopefully get the answers.

I just think that although their silence now might seem wrong, it could be that their silence will be right for future involvement with two precious parts of Gail’s life. Who else will be able to tell the children about their mother when she was little, or about their grandparents on Gail’s side of the family, even family medical history and who else will be able to tell them family stories?

Without a doubt Matt holds all the cards on the subject of who can have contact with the children now and who would blame him from cutting D & K out of the children’s lives if they were out there publicly bashing him and it turned out he had nothing to do with the disappearance. God forbid if this becomes a cold case and as the children grow up they may search for answers on their own re their mum, how would it look to them to find articles on the net from aunty and uncle bashing their father. If the children were kept from D & K in younger years but later they researched family they might be more inclined to make contact if there is no hostility being shown in the media towards their father.

When you look at what D & K have already lost as far as family goes it might just be for the best they use the gentle silent way to go forward if they are to stand any chance of being part of their nieces and nephews lives.

Sometimes silence might be the only choice if people want a voice in the future.

But their silence can be judged by so many… so again I say they are damned if they do and damned if they don’t.

To all of Gail’s loved ones I hope there are answers soon.

I apologize for my long ramblings and as always if this post contains anything out of line please let me know and I will remove.

 

[hollyblue]

Very nice post Annie61. I keep wondering if the children know Matt is not talking to LE. I've even wondered if they may have ask him if he has--- or ask the so many questions a young child might have? Are they too afraid to ask? Because of Matt...and/or what the answer may be. Maybe they have compartmentalized it and are just trying to go on taking each day at a time. Everytime I have these thoughts I have to tell myself surely the counseling involves Matt along with children as much as needed. If not, it's just one more compartment that has to be dealt with at some point. Too, I just can't imagine a mother deliberately putting her children through this kind of situation. Gail's family should be able to give them just as many hugs and express their love for them as Matt's. How can anyone say this is right and not fault him.... Let's get real. JMO

 

[Some1Nose]

Interesting MSM info to revisit imo:
www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_203035.asp

(Note by me: “she” refers to AD in first sentence.)
“However, she said the sudden drop in the family's income to one paycheck escalated the problems. She said in November when Gail got her last paycheck there was an incident where their dog, Dottie, got loose and Matt became enraged. She said Gail told her she had told her husband that she "couldn't take it any more" and she was thinking of moving out. She said Gail told her she retreated to her bedroom and her husband broke the bedroom door down.

She said on a more recent occasion Gail showed up with a black eye. She said Gail maintained that she had run into a door. Arlene said she did not quiz her any further.

Arlene said Gail confided that the marriage continued to bottom as the Palmgrens went to St. Martin for a wedding in March. She said Gail told of Matt drinking heavily and of taking long strolls on the beach out of her earshot.”

More interesting MSM info to revisit:

http://m.newschannel9.com/news/palmgren-1001216-nichols-last.html


“Nichols says neighbors last saw Gail Palmgren dropping off her 9-year-old and 12-year-old children at home on the 30th. No one has heard from her since. Nichols says that is highly uncharacteristic of her sister. "She has her doctorate degree. She's sharp, she's well balanced and she loved her children."
Gail Palmgren's whereabouts are a mystery that has only been intensified by her last conversation with her sister Diane, moments before Palmgren was last seen.
"She was nervous. She was anxious. She sounded scared," says Diane Nichols. Palmgren wouldn't say why she was scared but the Nichols made out this much, "She just thought she was being followed."
It was a bizzare conversation and Diane wonders if it's in any way connected to Gail's husband, Matthew Palmgren. "I know they had some marriage problems."
Nichols says Gail and Matthew recently filed for a legal separation. Police came to the Palmgren residence the day before she was last seen, responding to a domestic dispute call.”

Also, I looked up some K9 SAR groups located in Tennessee. I think most, if not all, of you will find the info of interest…I certainly did. These are both volunteer groups requiring no payments.

http://trustterra.org

http://cumberlandk9sar.org

Wonder where LE’s thinking is on utilizing this type of resource??? Soon???

IMO...the top two contender scenarios are accident or non-stranger foul play (maybe made to look like an accident...hmmmm).

 

[Some1Nose]

I snipped for space but fully agree with everything you had stated.

This is my theory...so far with the little we know, but the surveillance systems is a good point. I believe it was fbx who said ADT was at the house a few days after GP's disappearance. Why? What was being done? Was it broken, damaged, being installed? Did they have one prior...like the house in AL---and it's now gone too? D & H? Vanished? AD stated that MP was not mechanically inclined, but that could be MP just not wanting to do it.

She was beyond just scared.

The trip to MN/PA is the catalyst, imo. Either MP had plans in the mist or the one call between them was GP telling MP that she had the goods (TH and the bogus trip) on him....and hinted of letting BCBS know. Ask him about PA when he said the conference was in MN. The argument on the 29th. At the moment, I'm going with MP had plans because he did return early. What man leaves his mistress early to return to the "hell house"? He could have spent the evening downtown Chatt enjoying himself and returned after his flight was due in. ??
JMO

Thanks Holly...it's good to feel appreciated! :great:

I'm going to do some more thinking about all of this...I've pretty much boiled my theories down to either an accident or foul play (or even foul play to look like an accident :crazy, but then every time I think about the possiblity of MP having been directly and deliberately involved in Gail's disappearance, I so don't want that to be the case, even though I'm quite familiar with the statistics involving controlling/abusive people going through a separation/divorce, there is that possibilty that it did involve MP but evolved from momentary rage vs. premeditation...anyone?

(The Queen of run-on sentences...

 

[Some1Nose]

To add to my last post...and then there are such things as very possessive gfs?? I haven't really narrowed down a theory, yet, as to who is/are involved if, in fact, Gail's disappearance is due to foul play. Of course, I have my suspicions.

 

[Oriah]

Yup-if the kids were in the car with Gail, and Gail transported them to the house, they probably have an idea of what she was wearing. I am still waiting to hear if they were carrying luggage. Did they pack bags on 4/29 and did they return with them? IE Did Gail have access to more clothing than whatever was on her back, and BTW what was on her back? Color of her purse, shoes etc...

I cannot understand this either, believe09.

What was Gail wearing when she was last seen? What clothing and accessories are missing from which home? What type of footwear was she wearing? Does she wear anything all the time- such as a watch, a ring, a necklace?

Such important information when trying to locate a missing person.

 

[Oriah]

I don't think a judge granted an order in relation to this. My understanding is that this is simply a search consent agreement that was drawn up between Matt's attorneys and the DA. An agreement for a consensual search.

The only thing I can think of for the document copying is that it either puts the copying expenses back on Matt's tab, or, more likely, that it ensures that whatever LE wants copies of, the attorneys will have a record of each page copied. They could then verify, e.g., that complete documents were copied to ensure context etc.

I see, Bean.

But how (and why) would that work under a search consent for searches that are preplanned??

It seems to me that nothing gleaned from a 'search' of this sort would hold up in court due to the arrangement of the 'agreement'- so why even bother? :waitasec:

The DA essentially consented to searches that would have no merit in court, should Gail's case become a criminal investigation. :waitasec:

Oiy. Ok- I'm going back to trying to locate Gail's Jeep.

Do we know if there are any other storage facilities that either MP or GP had access to (other than the one on the search agreement)?

 

[glorias]

Oh thank God ~ at last!

Chatt. Times Free Press: FBI Will Assist in Palmgren Case

The FBI is not taking a lead role in the investigation, Galloway said, but is offering technical support and letting local authorities access its lab to process any evidence collected in the case.

"We'll help in any way we can and lend any assets," he said.

The federal agency also is reviewing the case along with Tennessee Bureau of Investigation, which came onboard earlier this month.

Finally. Gail's brother Kevin said he contacted them back on May 11.

http://www.wkbw.com/home/Day-12-in-...essee-Woman-From-Williamsville-121662839.html

May 11 is when he said they contacted the FBI. They may have actually called before the 11th.

 

[Oriah]

I am truly banging my head against a wall here.

If Gail dropped off the children at approximately 12:15pm; and then immediately left the SM residence- WHICH direction did she go? Looking at maps and wondering- up, down, or both??

I am back at the conundrum of possible sightings- and how they relate to pings.

 

[BeanE]

I see, Bean.

But how (and why) would that work under a search consent for searches that are preplanned??

It seems to me that nothing gleaned from a 'search' of this sort would hold up in court due to the arrangement of the 'agreement'- so why even bother? :waitasec:

The DA essentially consented to searches that would have no merit in court, should Gail's case become a criminal investigation. :waitasec:

BBM. Why even bother to search for Gail if they can't get proof they can use in court to prosecute Matt Palmgren for her murder?

I wish it was simply because all missing persons are human beings, and all human beings matter, but it's not.

It's because LE has a job obligation that we pay our taxes for to find all missing persons - no matter what happened to them - homicide, suicide, natural death, accident, ran off to join the circus.

By searching those properties they may not, to the gross disappointment of some, find evidence that will hold up in court that Matt Palmgren murdered Gail - but they just might find something that gives them a lead on what happened to Gail, and where she is. And that is their job - to find Gail no matter what happened to her.

It's certainly the job I pay my taxes for, and I'd be infuriated if I found out any LE on any missing persons case was only expending effort on activities that would lead them to prosecuting one person for homicide. Especially if they had no evidence of foul play, and don't even know that the person is dead, and that person has two children who need them!

 

[Cazzie]

I see, Bean.

But how (and why) would that work under a search consent for searches that are preplanned??

It seems to me that nothing gleaned from a 'search' of this sort would hold up in court due to the arrangement of the 'agreement'- so why even bother? :waitasec:

The DA essentially consented to searches that would have no merit in court, should Gail's case become a criminal investigation. :waitasec:

Oiy. Ok- I'm going back to trying to locate Gail's Jeep.

Do we know if there are any other storage facilities that either MP or GP had access to (other than the one on the search agreement)?

Perhaps that is why a criminal defense attorney was hired and orchestrated this deal?

So once again, is it possible that we (the people) are letting an alleged criminal have more rights and more power than an alleged victim?

God bless the USA. And God help the USA. And God bless and help us all.

 

[BeanE]

This indicates the FBI has been involved since HCSO joined the team, which was on May 17. That would align with Kevin's call to the FBI on or before May 11.

Two weeks later, the Hamilton County Sheriff's Office began investigating her disappearance and the FBI offered to lend its resources, said Special Agent Edward Galloway of the FBI's Chattanooga office.

Links upthread.

Very typical for FBI to offer its resources early on in a missing person case. I think I've seen that on just about every missing person case I've followed.

(May 17 may not seem early on in this missing person case, since Gail went missing Apr 30, but it seems it didn't become a missing person case until the 17th.)

 

[Oriah]

BBM. Why even bother to search for Gail if they can't get proof they can use in court to prosecute Matt Palmgren for her murder?

I wish it was simply because all missing persons are human beings, and all human beings matter, but it's not.

It's because LE has a job obligation that we pay our taxes for to find all missing persons - no matter what happened to them - homicide, suicide, natural death, accident, ran off to join the circus.

By searching those properties they may not, to the gross disappointment of some, find evidence that will hold up in court that Matt Palmgren murdered Gail - but they just might find something that gives them a lead on what happened to Gail, and where she is. And that is their job - to find Gail no matter what happened to her.

It's certainly the job I pay my taxes for, and I'd be infuriated if I found out any LE on any missing persons case was only expending effort on activities that would lead them to prosecuting one person for homicide. Especially if they had no evidence of foul play, and don't even know that the person is dead, and that person has two children who need them!

BBM- I agree, Bean.

Respectfully, I am just concerned about the 'search' aspect of this.

If documents (or anything) are retrieved and/or taken in for evidence- how would that work in court? Is the expectation at this point that nothing will go to court? Is it simply Matt protecting his and Gail's assets?

Anything could have been altered by anyone at this point. So I guess that's my confusion. :waitasec:

 

[BeanE]

BBM- I agree, Bean.

Respectfully, I am just concerned about the 'search' aspect of this.

If documents (or anything) are retrieved and/or taken in for evidence- how would that work in court? Is the expectation at this point that nothing will go to court? Is it simply Matt protecting his and Gail's assets?

Anything could have been altered by anyone at this point. So I guess that's my confusion. :waitasec:

Well, suppose Gail hid a suicide note under her mattress, and after testing, the FBI determines it is authentic and unaltered, and that suicide note says "I'm going to Jordan Lake, take an overdose, and drive in."

That is worth finding, because it would likely lead to figuring out what happened to Gail and where she is, and give her children and other loved ones answers that will afford them an opportunity for closure and healing down the road.

Or suppose the FBI determines the note is not authentic, not written by Gail. Or had been written by Gail weeks before, and since been altered by someone else to make it look as if Gail committed suicide.

Or let's say they find a note from Tammy to Matt saying "I'm going to wait in the garage and leap in the Jeep and force Gail to drive to Jordan Lake, whack her on the head, and push the Jeep in the water."

And suppose after testing, they find that the note was not authentic, not written by Tammy, but in fact written by another girlfriend of Matt's - or by Matt himself. And say they couldn't use that in court.

These things are worth finding, because again, they lead to figuring out what happened to Gail and where she is, and give her loved ones an opportunity for closure.

And LE, with these things, I believe has probable cause, is able to get search warrants, and get other evidence that canbe used in court, and/or can then tie info they already have to the crime and use that in court.

 

[believe09]

Oh thank God ~ at last!

Chatt. Times Free Press: FBI Will Assist in Palmgren Case

The FBI is not taking a lead role in the investigation, Galloway said, but is offering technical support and letting local authorities access its lab to process any evidence collected in the case.

"We'll help in any way we can and lend any assets," he said.

The federal agency also is reviewing the case along with Tennessee Bureau of Investigation, which came onboard earlier this month.

Perhaps this includes analyzing the DVR AD has stated she has in her possession. I wonder if she turned it over to LE?

 

[believe09]

My understanding was that the FBI had a role in Mid May as well, even though they did not publicize it at the time. I suspect that the same holds true for TBI.

 

[Emeralgem]

Perhaps that is why a criminal defense attorney was hired and orchestrated this deal?

So once again, is it possible that we (the people) are letting an alleged criminal have more rights and more power than an alleged victim?

God bless the USA. And God help the USA. And God bless and help us all.

IMO.. Most definitely... VICTIM'S RIGHTS HAVE BEEN KIDNAPPED AND HIDDEN IN THE LAW TO PROTECT THE PERPETRATORS ...JMHO

 

[ThoughtFox]

Perhaps this includes analyzing the DVR AD has stated she has in her possession. I wonder if she turned it over to LE?

God, I hope so. The last I read from Arlene she still had it in her possession, but perhaps she has been visited by the FBI since then. She was also going to give a copy of something to the local police in Wetumpka, so maybe they wanted to give it to the FBI?