December, when you joined WS a few months ago, I encountered you on several threads and thought, wow, here's a new poster who is really jumping right in with some very insightful posts. But I did not realize, then, that you had joined largely for Kathy's case -- I had read in her thread before a little, but before you came along. You are really delving into her case for her, and you have some great help joining in, too. I wish you well -- would love to see this one solved!
I am so glad to see her case featured and hope it will help somehow to bring some things to light/needed action. It is just horrendous, what happened to Kathy. I see how it would haunt a family and community for many years, especially unsolved.
It is tragic, to me, too, that there was no autopsy. As you say -- if only there had been, so many questions might have answers.
So -- bessie, you stated no rape kit -- you think nothing of that sort, not even some rudimentary version? No fingernail clippings, etc.? The coroner did say she was raped, but I guess that was from the obvious physical damage, then?
December, I was kind of thinking, like you mentioned, that there may have been semen on some of her clothing or other possessions, possibly from the perp "cleaning up", as you said -- or maybe even something really bizarre like excrement at the scene (it seems some really out-of-control violent perps do that).
I haven't finished reading all the newer posts (since December came along and since being featured), but I will try to get up to speed. Not sure how I feel about whether the bulk of the attack occurred right where she was found -- December and bessie have both made good points, IMO, toward the two different possibilities.
One thing that crossed my mind -- if it turns out to be true that the grass wasn't crushed, Kathy's body wasn't dirty from the ground, etc. -- what about the idea that she may have been attacked inside a vehicle? You know, especially something like a van or delivery truck -- OR that bus. It could have been parked very close by -- maybe even IN the vacant lot -- and Kathy and her belongings just dropped out on the ground afterwards.
I wonder -- the part of her sock used as a gag, was it torn or cut? Seems it would be hard to tear a sock, but I don't know. Attacker must have had something sharp to inflict the wounds, guess he could have used that. But I wonder WHY he would have taken the time/trouble to cut/tear the sock, anyhow -- it doesn't seem like it would make that much difference in size, it was just a sock. Maybe just one more opportunity to use his big bad knife or whatever he had -- ugghh. Just one little curious thing, to me.
Thank you for the compliment.
I did join for Kathy.
But, I am also interested in other cases because I know how it feels. Not only from Kathy, but my friend's murder went unsolved for many years. Officially.
Unoffically, the police knew exactly who did it. They did look into other possibilities, but they knew who did it. Eventually, they managed to piece together a case and had him arrested in tried. His lawyers got a lot of the evidence thrown out (sometimes it seemed unfairly), but for every piece of evidence that was thrown out it seemed the prosecution had two more pieces of evidence to prove the same thing. Now that they had him in a court room, they weren't going to make any mistake that could let him walk because he was a danger to other people.
To be clear, the person who murdered my friend could not have murdered Kathy. It is impossible. However, I have learned a lot about murderers from this individual. And how the police act when they have a very good suspect and are gathering their evidence.
In my friend's case, the DNA matched their prime suspect. But, they needed more. I wonder if this is what has happened with Kathy's case. This may be why they aren't saying where they obtained this DNA. I don't think they said in my friend's case either.. they just said they had DNA until the trial and then it was all explained.
I can't figure out the deal with Adcox how they are saying yes no yes no yes no maybe with him. All I can figure out that this is part of their case. Somehow. Their case can't really be with him at this point because he's dead. They could just declare him the murderer now if they wanted to. Maybe the key is something Adcox did for the murderer more than something he did to Kathy.
And yes, I have long considered the possibility that the attack occurred in a vehicle. A larger type of vehicle and one no one would have made any particular note of at the time when the attacks were occurring. The vehicle could easily be moved to other locations if the murderer felt the other people around were casting a few too many glances his way.
Adcox's roller drome bus is a definite possibiity. However, I feel the police must have searched it. I don't know how thorough that would be in 1969. If there was blood all over, clearly they would see that. And if it looked like it had just be scrubbed to within an inch of its life, they would take note of that (it wouldn't prove anything, but it would be something they would notice). However, if Adcox or someone took the precaution of putting down some newspapers or drop cloths or something and then wiping the place down a bit.. would that have passed muster in 1969?
I have to say at this point that guess who else had a van/bus/something like that? KRISPY KREME! I wonder how much they looked at the people who worked there?
A friend of mine used to work at a doughnut shop so I went in there all of the time. The guy who made the doughnuts I never saw even once. I'm not accusing this guy of anything, but just giving an example.. he worked quietly making his doughnuts and when there was enough doughnuts, he went out the back and went home (or wherever). Maybe that's just the way doughnut makers roll? Did someone from KK behave the same way? Just quietly in the back making doughnuts, but sometimes casting an eye out to the customers?
The KK van delivered boxes of doughnuts. Maybe this guy talked to Kathy now and then. Maybe that day, he offered her a box of doughnuts or maybe she even bought it. Or maybe he just offered to show her the van/bus/whatever (they had a van and a bus at one point).
It would be simple, when it was dark and quiet at night to open the doors and throw her outside. And throw her clothes, too. I always just assumed he put them in a paper grocery sack or something to keep them all together when he dumped her. Maybe he just turned the sack up and they dumped out on the ground wadded up like they had been when he took those things from her.
The sock has bothered me as well. I wonder if she started swallowing it (accidentally) when she was involuntarily gasping and trying to breathe. And he tried to get it out and cut it then (Not to help her, just because he wasn't ready for her to die yet)? Unless the whole thing just wouldn't fit. Weren't bobbie socks different from regular white socks in that they had a thicker cuff? Maybe that's what he cut off.
I know it is not in these newspapers except the one from North Carolina kind of mentions it, but an exam was done. It wasn't "forsenics" like we think of these days. But, they did do some kind of official exam of her body. Maybe the coroner just drove over to the funeral home? It mentions in the Banner (which, sigh) that someone from the DA was there when her body was taken by the funeral home.
I do not believe they could print in the newspapers what actually happened next. But, they really did examine her. Or the outside of her body. They didn't open her mouth and look into and the should have. But, they did examine her visually. And maybe even a little more. They might have taken some evidence..it's just compared to what they take now, it isn't much of anything is how I read the articles. I was a little surprised and I wonder if the police are being a bit coy on that aspect.. hiding what little they do have.
My father has always talked about this. He went down there and saw her and talked to them. He didn't act like it was just people working at a funeral home. His father died also in 1969, so he went to prepare for that funeral as well. But, it was from natural causes and it was an entirely different deal.
They may have done something similar to a rape kit.. this is something that absolutely would not have been in the newspapers. People would not have wanted to read such things. I will try to find out. But, they would have visually inspected the condition of her body and noted it was in very bad condition. From what the Scene writer said, you could even see this in the photos.
When they put her in the coffin they had to break her legs. So, maybe we can figure out from that about what kind of state she was in by the time they began to try to get her into some kind of condition to show the rest of the family (who were traumatized just by losing her).
My father and one particular uncle were the men in my family who took care of horrible things no one else wanted to do. Before them, it was my grandfather and his brother. But, my grandfather had a stroke, so he was confined to the hospital until he died. (this makes me so sad)
My father was the one who took on the duty of dealing with many horrible details related to Kathy's murder. My father was a combat veteran and a stoic person.. but seeing her, it was so hard on him. Not everything is in the newspapers, I wish I could prove this stuff.
I guess the thing to always remember is unless something worse has happened only recently (and I hope it has not), Kathy's murder is considered by police to be the most brutal child murder in Nashville's history. Many police publicly say this. Micky Miller of Metro Police said the murder is a "vicious and vile" individual (he may have said creature).
I am going to try to get as much detail from the police as I can, but quite honestly.. I'm scared. I'm scared to hear these details that even police who have only see photographs say it is the worst child murder. I'm scared to see what upset my father for the rest of his life. This wrecked my family because it was that bad.
I'm sorry to get emotional..
Also, using the victim's own clothing to bind them is a technique used by a certain type of person who has received training. The reason they do this is because then what evidence does this leave the cops? Nothing. They can't trace down ropes by manufacturer or anything like that because it all belongs to the victim. In this case, the victim is a kid and probably most of her stuff was bought in just a few stores right around where she lived. Her mom would know every piece of clothing where is came from, but that isn't going to help solve the crime. (just thinking aloud)
But, yes, for quite time I have wondered about a vehicle. Maybe the murderer had a particular time he had to return the vehicle to his place of employment?
Thank you for reading about Kathy. I want to get some justice for her.
