Trial Discussion Thread #19 - 14.04.07, Day 17

[Interested Bystander]

I'm reading back and remembered I lost a post that was quite important; the defence pathologist said he believes Reeva voided her bladder very shortly before her death....so that could mean she had just gone to the toilet, as OP says.

As I don't feel they ever went to bed, I suspect she did void during the preceeding half hour or so. All hypothetical of course but she may have voided, and flushed, whilst first in the loo (thereafter continuing an argument via the closed door) and before OP went back to get his gun.

 

[Patagonia]

Apologies for the graphic-ness, but I would assume if that were the case they would have noted this on the shorts she was wearing.

Absolutely, and it would certainly be mentioned. So we can exclude that posibility.

 

[Cherwell]

This might shed a little light on the topic.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/03/paul-ryan-inner-cities-problem

The problems of crime in inner cities was being related to African-Americans and the culture of the inner cities.

I'm unclear on how posting a politically left website (Mother Jones, not an MSM article related to this case) insisting Paul Ryan is secretly saying racist things without actually saying them clears anything up.

The word 'urban' does not men black.

The word 'culture' does not mean black.

Unless Mother Jones insists it's racially loaded rhetoric. Then it is so. :banghead:

I'd like to ask something. Are all "African-Americans" black? Because lots of Africans are white, and there must be Americans descended from white Africans.

Also, I've never heard anyone described as "English-American". Why is that, do you think?

 

[kittychi]

There were actually a handful of times that Roux had to go back and ask OP the question in a different way because OP didn't understand the question and answered it differently.

Mm hm...regarding the boating accident, OP said didn't drink that day before the tea break, but said he had one drink that he can remember after the tea break.

 

[Carol70]

... or RS was so terrified at OP's final bat bangings she peed her pants.

Or she hadn't even got so far as to take down her pants to sit on the loo before hearing OP shouting about an intruder and really did just empty her bladder at death.

Or she did empty her bladder and as she pulled her pants up, before reaching to flush, heard OP screaming about intruder.

Possibilities are endless and sadly, we may never know!

 

[Suthrnqt]

Well, all in all, it was an interesting day of testimony. Thanks again to Zwiebel---- you rock!

Time to go count sheep.
See y'all back here later tonight.

:loveyou:

 

[04009margaret]

A gentle rub of the shoulders or a hug from family and friends I can get. But a full on face-stroke from your psychologist?! Weeeeird.

Sounds more like a mothering affectionate gesture, don't know if it's appropriate for a professional relationship. I'm amazed she didn't whisk him away from the prying eyes of the press, he should have been given some privacy.

 

[Magdalyn]

I'd like to ask something. Are all "African-Americans" black? Because lots of Africans are white, and there must be Americans descended from white Africans.

Also, I've never heard anyone described as "English-American". Why is that, do you think?

Good point. One of my hubbies buddies is a blond haired blue eyed 'African American'. Immigrated here from SA in the 90s.

 

[steveml]

Well, Steve, that's still not good enough. OP can give a perfectly reasonable explanation for it and it's still, "nope, no way, the air gun did that." Similar if the broken door and Reeva's jeans get brought up and OP also has a reasonable explanation for those. I knew Roux would get to that stuff as opposed to just leaving it in the air.

Must try harder :smile:

The window need not have been on a photograph, I can't see the purpose of it. All it could do is mislead...hmm.

If that pane is in OP's garage, the PT knew without a doubt it was there prior to submitting the pre-trial photographs.

 

[DebinGA]

Which means if his version is to be believed she must have been shot immediately after locking the door otherwise she would have been sat on the loo.
How on earth can we believe he didn't hear a door close and the key turn .I do keep really trying to see his version work but it sure is hard .He heard a window slide at a much further distance but didn't here door and key closer mmmmm.....

His hearing the bathroom window slide open didn't make it into OP affi II.

 

[zwiebel]

LOL, for sure!

I saw someone mention earlier about "who throws a cricket ball around a glass window"? (sorry, cant remember who it was). I have a son and boys IMO, are destructive. He has managed to send a dining table through a glass window while arm wrestling with a friend (don't ask :facepalm: ) and he threw a smallish rock in the yard that landed up going through a "shatterproof" glass door. I find nothing strange about tossing a cricket ball around a garden.

Lol right back because it was me. And straight after I posted I thought to myself, "Mr Zwie does, you fool." And then I remembered he's also tried to play cricket with a bit of driftwood and two dogs....and an apple. That one didn't work at all. Splat.

 

[kittychi]

Must try harder :smile:

The window need not have been on a photograph, I can't see the purpose of it. All it could do is mislead...hmm.

If that pane is in OP's garage, the PT knew without a doubt it was there prior to submitting the pre-trial photographs.

Why wasn't it fixed then? It seems an intruder could much more easily get into a broken window on the ground floor rather than use a ladder to a second floor window. I think his paranoid story is pretty rubbished by the broken downstairs window unless it did happen the night of the shooting.

.

 

[DebinGA]

Sounds more like a mothering affectionate gesture, don't know if it's appropriate for a professional relationship. I'm amazed she didn't whisk him away from the prying eyes of the press, he should have been given some privacy.

More likely playing to the press to elicit sympathy.

 

[steveml]

Yep, so many of these things we still just have OP's word for .. they shouldn't be taken as absolute fact.

No you're quite right, it may not be fact.

That doesn't matter to the PT though, not being any part of the case is good enough.

 

[sorrell skye]

Sounds more like a mothering affectionate gesture, don't know if it's appropriate for a professional relationship. I'm amazed she didn't whisk him away from the prying eyes of the press, he should have been given some privacy.

That type of touching/comforting is not at all appropriate in a client/therapist relationship. Every licensed therapist knows (or should know) that physical contact increases the risk for transference and/or counter-transference to occur, not to mention the ethical boundaries it crosses.

 

[04009margaret]

http://mg.co.za/article/2009-02-24-pistorius-boating-accident-what-actually-happened

snipped
“The Barrage police are investigating the possibility that Pistorius did not hit a floating object like a tree trunk, but collided with a pier,” Inspector Kinnie Steyn said.

He said police divers found the boat Pistorius was piloting at the bottom of the river near a pier which had been ripped from its posts."

 

[soozieqtips]

I see OP felt the need to speak for Reeva again by claiming she went to bed 'loved' that night. Also agree with other posters that mentioning how he still smelt her blood was insensitive beyond belief. Is he trying to give the Steenkamps' nightmares or something? He's clearly out of his comfort zone here like no other time in his life. Here he is finally being held to account for his actions. He can't get anyone to take the rap for him, he can't bully his way out of it, so he has to man up and start explaining, not halt proceedings because he can't keep his blubberthons under control. He's been prepared for this for over a year, and Nel hasn't even started questioning him yet for goodness sake. If everything happened exactly like he said it happened, then all he has to do is tell the truth. He doesn't (and shouldn't) need to speak for Reeva.

 

[zwiebel]

During his testimony, when asked about drugs, OP kind of linked it to his mom's death, in a way I didn't understand. Then upthread someone wondered if she might have been Ashkenazi, and I know there are much higher rates of breast cancer than normal amongst some families...so I looked it up, but in his biography, it says she died 'following drug complications after an hysterectomy'.

So now I think that's why OP answered the question about drugs by mentioning his mom. I think he was presuming we all knew she died of drug complications and it was a shortcut way of illustrating why he'd never touch them?

 

[steveml]

Why wasn't it fixed then? It seems an intruder could much more easily get into a broken window in the ground floor rather than use a ladder to a second floor window. I think his paranoid story is pretty rubbished by the broken downstairs window unless it did happen the night of the shooting.

.

The only sensible explanation I can give to this is that OP isn't often there.

If he's elsewhere, training and such, I don't suppose he's worried if somebody's going to break into the house.
That sense of paranoia isn't brought on by worrying about your valuables or material things whilst your away, the vulnerability is created once your in the house.

The fact that the pane was measured and ready to go in, at least suggests that the repair was in hand.

 

[zwiebel]

That type of touching/comforting is not at all appropriate in a client/therapist relationship. Every licensed therapist knows (or should know) that physical contact increases the risk for transference and/or counter-transference to occur, not to mention the ethical boundaries it crosses.

Oh thank you. These are the terms I was trying to remember. I couldn't look them up either, not recalling anything about what they were called.