Trial - Ross Harris #5

[TexMex]

I don't think our founding fathers ever expected what happened to Cooper at the hands of his father. Can you even imagine them imagining a little boy dying in a hot car while his father sent pictures of his penis!

This is a whole new ballgame from what our founding fathers ever imagined.

I must admit part of my anger is as a vet I've seen dogs dead/dying/sick from being left in a car on a hot day in Houston. Or left in a yard with no shade or water, sometimes chained. It's a horrible death. To me toddlers, pets and some elderly...they are the most vulnerable among us. A dog can't unchain himself and turn on a water faucet. A baby cannot unfasten his car seat belts and escape the heat. They rely on humans/parents to provide safety and essentials like food and water. To allow harm to come to them is the ultimate betrayal.
IMO Ross purposely allowed his son to suffer a terrible death to escape his own responsibilities.
If he somehow "forgot" his son because he was in a hurry to get inside to continue his sexting with several women? Well that's not much better. I think the jury might just find him guilty of malice murder after seeing the close quarters he and his son shared in that vehicle.

 

[Cardinal47]

Scott Peterson lied about having a wife and expecting a child. He wanted a future with Amber, by all accounts. Ross never lied about being married. In fact he made it quite clear he was only looking for temporary escapism. I see no comparison between him and SP. None at all. In fact, he stood to gain nothing by getting rid of his child. He was already acting out any way he choose. Leanna and Cooper were more of an asset to him, than any hindrance. SP's family was clearly in his way, of the good life with Amber.

I kind of think the red head Jaynie that testified might have become Ross Harris's Amber. He liked that she would not have sex with him in a car or anywhere else. She was making him wait and he killed Cooper. Maybe he was moving on. Maybe Cooper dying in that hot car was part of his plan to make his move with Jaynie!
Was she the ONE!

 

[TexMex]

Scott Peterson lied about having a wife and expecting a child. He wanted a future with Amber, by all accounts. Ross never lied about being married. In fact he made it quite clear he was only looking for temporary escapism. I see no comparison between him and SP. None at all. In fact, he stood to gain nothing by getting rid of his child. He was already acting out any way he choose. Leanna and Cooper were more of an asset to him, than any hindrance. SP's family was clearly in his way, of the good life with Amber.

He lied to his mistress about it but to his family and associates he portrayed the happy husband and expectant father.
Ross portrayed the family man but to others expressed the desire to be single to drink and bang girls.
Double lives = stress whether you're Scott or Ross

 

[Hope4More]

Idk Hope. I think he's another Scott Peterson.

Everyone loved Scott. Handsome, college grad had a job. Great golfer. Beautiful pregnant wife who enjoyed decorating the nursery in their nice suburban home. His family loved him, so did hers. He seemed excited to have a son to be born very soon.

Thing is...Scott had a double life. He hit on women all the time. He'd call them, make himself out to be a big shot (in reality he's a fertilizer salesman) meet up and drink and bed them. One became his mistress. Scott truly was terrified that he was about to be a father. He'd be expected to be home more. He'd be stuck in his modest house with his modest salary having a modest life. He thought he deserved better. He deserved freedom to chase women, golf, do as he pleased. He wasn't really mad at his wife but resented the prospect of being tied down. The clock was ticking. Baby due in weeks. Should he divorce? He's a narcissist. He doesn't want to be that guy..divorce a pregnant woman, pay money every month for a child he never wanted. Plus, man...his family....her family...it'll just be bad. The other option...the one he chose? The baby would never be born! His pregnant wife would "disappear" and all his responsibilities along with her. He killed her, put her body in a new boat he'd just conveniently bought, dumped her in SF Bay, came home and reported her "missing". A day later he's calling his mistress (luckily Scott predates texting!) from his missing wife's memorial service.

To me, by making Cooper disappear from the scene...Ross will then free himself from his wife without further obligation. He splits any property (no house, just a car IIRC) and move on. He will have the life he feel he deserves.

So yes, I think he's a sociopath.

The rather huge difference being, RH and LH had a difficult time bringing a baby in the world, both wanted a child, and Ross was in fact, by every single account, THRILLED when Cooper was born, and continued to be so. There isn't a person anywhere who has said otherwise; even the prostitute testified RH seemed to dote on Cooper (and his reason for "acting" that to a hooker would be what ?)

It's flying in the face of actual evidence to say otherwise,. IMO one of the major weaknesses of the State's case is they simply had no evidence to back up any narrative of intent relating to wanting to divorce (or be "free" of Leanna, or of wanting to be "free" of Cooper.

I'm walking off this particular battlefield now. We're all here for different reasons and with different interests <modsnip>. Peace out, Tex. (And, did your daughter get married yet?)

 

[monkeypants]

I think it's possible RH didn't see Cooper, or even if he did get a glimpse of him out of the corner of his eye, didn't register what he was seeing. If his mind had gone on autopilot and he didn't think Cooper was in the car, didn't expect to see him and wasn't looking for him, he could have failed to notice him even if he was in his line of vision.

Like in the invisible gorilla experiment, where scientists showed a video of people passing a ball between themselves and told their subjects to count the ball passes in the video. In the middle of the video a guy in a gorilla suit walks in between the people playing ball, thumps his chest, and walks off again. Fully half of the subjects were so engrossed in counting the ball passes that they did not see the gorilla and had no memory of it afterwards. If your mind is on other things, you can fail to see what is right in front of you.
http://theinvisiblegorilla.com/gorilla_experiment.html

Believe me, if you have a baby and "got a glimpse of him out of the corner of your eye" you don't NOT see your baby. Not when you are looking over your shoulder to reverse into a parking spot or to lean right next to the
Car seat to grab your briefcase, coffee and phone.

 

[just the facts pls]

Oh but there is the key phrase (BBM) - they thought they KNEW him. None of these people apparently knew he was texting teenagers, sending photos of his penis, visiting prostitutes, having sex with another man, etc. So perhaps there were other character flaws related to Cooper that they also did not KNOW about.

Yes and it's good to keep in mind that nobody really knew him, and what we have learned is only the stuff we know about so far. Who knows what else went on in JRH's life. Since his own family and friends didn't know who he really was, I doubt anyone should assume that they can succeed where people closest to him weren't allowed to.

This is something else that has bothered me during this trial. The fact that nobody else really knew him is disturbing. I am also perturbed by the characterization of his behavior as "sex addiction." Assuming this is correct JRH would be having sex with lots of different kinds of women of varying ages. That he is only having hookups with barely legal teenagers doesn't seem like a sex addiction. I am no expert but looks more like a paraphilia. Plus people who have friends and family members who are alcoholics or drug users typically know that their family member has a substance abuse problem. JRH's family doesn't know he's addicted to sex? His own friends don't know? Perhaps his wife knows he cheated, but media reported she was angry at the testimony going on in court, so perhaps even she didn't know the full extent? I've read places that he confessed at church like Josh Duggar but somehow I doubt even they knew the extent of JRH's behavior.

There is just something disturbing about the fact that JRH can wear masks depending on who he is with and what he can get out of it. It's not good, it indicates he is capable of a lot more than we're seeing in court.

 

[turaj]

Something I ask myself each court date. Where are the Ross Harris supporters? Where is his family, friends, coworkers and church group? I have not seen one person that knows Harris sit behind the defense team and support him? Yes a few might be witnesses but certainly not all.

His brother has testified why isn't he there with his wife? Harris much have parents, aunts and uncles, cousins or friends. Where are they?

Maybe they are just as disgustedd as most of us are and want nothing to do with him. The worst of the worst have family support in the courtroom. Think Jodi Arias, Casey Anthony and Scott Peterson.

My biggest fear is that even though many posting here see Harris for what he is there are many here that believe Harris rights must be protected more than Coopers. That always scares me about a jury.

I for one stand for Cooper.

Yes I ask that same question daily...no matter what the circumstances at least as a parent I would want to be sure that my son got a fair trial. ...and Leanna could as the mother also have gotten permission to be in the courtroom if nothing else to make sure that Cooper's rights are respected. I have seen some video of her with her mother going here and there but mostly I think her family is all about making sure their daughter is not charged.

 

[turaj]

Idk Hope. I think he's another Scott Peterson.

Everyone loved Scott. Handsome, college grad had a job. Great golfer. Beautiful pregnant wife who enjoyed decorating the nursery in their nice suburban home. His family loved him, so did hers. He seemed excited to have a son to be born very soon.

Thing is...Scott had a double life. He hit on women all the time. He'd call them, make himself out to be a big shot (in reality he's a fertilizer salesman) meet up and drink and bed them. One became his mistress. Scott truly was terrified that he was about to be a father. He'd be expected to be home more. He'd be stuck in his modest house with his modest salary having a modest life. He thought he deserved better. He deserved freedom to chase women, golf, do as he pleased. He wasn't really mad at his wife but resented the prospect of being tied down. The clock was ticking. Baby due in weeks. Should he divorce? He's a narcissist. He doesn't want to be that guy..divorce a pregnant woman, pay money every month for a child he never wanted. Plus, man...his family....her family...it'll just be bad. The other option...the one he chose? The baby would never be born! His pregnant wife would "disappear" and all his responsibilities along with her. He killed her, put her body in a new boat he'd just conveniently bought, dumped her in SF Bay, came home and reported her "missing". Then he ordered some *advertiser censored* channels for his DishNetwork package. A day later he's calling his mistress (luckily Scott predates texting!) from his missing wife's memorial service.

To me, by making Cooper disappear from the scene...Ross will then free himself from his wife without further obligation. He splits any property (no house, just a car IIRC) and move on. He will have the life he feel he deserves.

So yes, I think he's a sociopath.

i think Scott Peterson would be quite insulted to be compared to RH....but honestly both have many things in common...

 

[TexMex]

The rather huge difference being, RH and LH had a difficult time bring a baby in the world, both wanted a child, and Ross was in fact, by every single account, THRILLED when Cooper was born, and continued to be so. There isn't a person anywhere who has said otherwise; even the prostitute testified RH seemed to dote on Cooper (and his reason for "acting" that to a hooker would be what ?)

It's flying in the face of actual evidence to say otherwise,. IMO one of the major weaknesses of the State's case is they simply had no evidence to back up any narrative of intent relating to wanting to divorce (or be "free" of Leanna, or of wanting to be "free" of Cooper.

I'm walking off this particular battlefield now. We're all here for different reasons and with different interests, but mine don't include engaging in fact-light, opinion based free for alls. Peace out, Tex. (And, did your daughter get married yet?)

Happily engaged. Wedding in May. Taking the mother of the bride out for our monthly practice dancing for the wedding date later tonight....after the Aggie game of course

 

[matou]

Did anyone ever ask RH if he could normally see Cooper inside of the carseat when he was driving?

 

[TexMex]

i think Scott Peterson would be quite insulted to be compared to RH....but honestly both have many things in common...

Lol. Yes they do. I imagine Scott is still having his delusions of grandeur...I expect he tells his pen pals that he lives in a historic, gated community overlooking the Bay with a state of the art security system, personal chef, etc

 

[Hope4More]

What I don't understand is the cheerleading that goes on for the defense. 'Hooray Hooray, the prosecution just got over ruled' or 'Bravo, the defense just scored big with that question!'
<modsnip>.

Speaking for myself, I don't like liars and dishonest people in general , and I really really don't like them when IMO they have abused their position of trust and power. That made watching Stoddard (in particular) getting shredded on the stand very satisfying <modsnip>

Beyond that, I follow trials largely because I'm interested in the law and most everything that is connected. Watching a gifted trial attorney in court is intellectually exhilarating, can't get enough of it, and there have been crosses by Kilgore that genuinely are, imo, real works of art, as in, exquisite demonstrations of his various lawyer's skills.

 

[JudyBolton]

Thank God people can't be convicted, based on the thoughts of people who assume things, that can't be proven. No matter how much one might want that to be true.

I don't think anyone is suggesting he should be convicted based on assumptions. The above conversation was about the lack of supporters in the courtroom. This is unusual in my experience of trial watching.

 

[Hope4More]

Happily engaged. Wedding in May. Taking the mother of the bride out for our monthly practice dancing for the wedding date later tonight....after the Aggie game of course

(Sorry for O/T)

I remember the engagement, just wasn't sure if you'd had the joy yet of walking your daughter down the aisle. Glad to hear all is still on track .

 

[matou]

4:31 p.m. Hawkins says he got on his knees right in front of Cooper and began doing CPR. He says Harris was fumbling around: "Whatever he was doing wasn't' CPR so I moved him out of the way."

4:32 p.m. He says as he began CPR Harris walked away behind the car. He says Harris never told anyone to call 911.
-----

4:56 p.m. Pantano says he yelled to another witness to call 911.
-----

4:55 p.m. Pantano says he asked Harris if he knew CPR and Harris responded that he did. Pantano says after he asked that Harris did a couple chest compressions. Pantano says Harris then stood up and walked away.

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/ross-harr...the-ross-harris-hot-car-death-trial/453298632

Why wouldn't RH do CPR properly on his kid? Why not call or shout to someone to call 911??? He claims to have medic knowledge and likely some training (but not sure).

 

[Safeguard]

He lied to his mistress about it but to his family and associates he portrayed the happy husband and expectant father.
Ross portrayed the family man but to others expressed the desire to be single to drink and bang girls.
Double lives = stress whether you're Scott or Ross

Complaining about the wife, is not the same as an, "expressed desire to be single". Most unfaithful men complain about the wife. Its kinda in the handbook. Complaining to one another about spouses, between affair partners, to justify things is a common as dirt.

 

[matou]

He didn't hold his baby to console him. He didn't want to touch him IMO. He dreaded how he would look. He "knew" he was dead because of Cooper's eyes. IMO he had no intention of being a hero to rescue his kid from the hot car, he wanted to be an advocate. Very very strange.

 

[Hope4More]

Complaining about the wife, is not the same as an, "expressed desire to be single". Most unfaithful men complain about the wife. Its kinda in the handbook. Complaining to one another about spouses, between affair partners, to justify things is a common as dirt.

The State probably can and will make a strong case for RH as sexual predator, imo, in that separate trial relating to minors.

Cheating on one's wife with prostitutes and legions of sexting partners is one thing, knowingly pursuing minors is a whole different disgusting kettle of fish.

That makes RH more than a cheating husband with a prodigious sexual appetite, imo, but it doesn't make him a murderer, nor does it make him a man who didn't also love his child, nor does it make him a sociopath.

 

[Cardinal47]

Least we forget. Perhaps Cooper was unable to cry out to anybody passing the car. He was in the depths of dying.

Former Cobb County Medical Examiner Brian Frist detailed Cooper's final hours, according to The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, saying his death would have been a slow one.

'I believe he went through various stages as he was passing,' Frist said. 'He would've experienced nausea, a headache, dehydration, seizures, anxiety&#8230;.'

Harris wept as jurors were shown 34 autopsy photographs of Cooper's body. The child died of hyperthermia after he was left in the SUV for roughly eight hours on that June day while his father, a Home Depot worker, sat in his office nearby.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...r-family-s-boiling-hot-SUV.html#ixzz4OVT8DgJV
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

 

[Hope4More]

I'm reading up on hot car deaths and FBS. Anyone have recommendations for good (fact based) sources? TIA