trial thread: 3/30/2012

[matou]

Right but I don't get what he has to do with this case except he is someone who the accused killer mentioned in the interview claimed scared the **** out of him. Are some speculating this Brad was James? Was James onto MR, perhaps? It would make sense with the question this alleged Brad asked.

By May 15th., I think the word was out (in Woodstock) that TLM was the woman seen with Tori. IMO

Can't wait to hear what the accused killer did following that interview. Chapter 10.

I don`t think he has anything to do with this case and it was a diversion to detract the police away from him by naming someone TLM or Carol knew. It kind of backfires when the police ask why this guy would approach him in the Canadian Tire store though. lol JMO

 

[snoofer]

In the video Det Smyth asked TLM if you were just going to leave Tori out there and were not taking her body back to the city...why the garbage bags. Why did you need garbage bags. She said I don't know, she didn't know why they decided to put her in garbage bags.

Follow this. TLM bought the garbage bags. Why? She said she doesn't know why. Did MR tell her to buy them...so she did... Why did MR want garbage bags??? We won't know unless he tells us..maybe it is so the animals wouldnt drag pieces of clothing out where people might find them etc. The point is.....the garbage bags were bought because SOMEONE thought it was a good part of the plan and a good thing to have. TLM looked really confused by that question...why garbage bags...by Det Smyth. JMO It could go to premeditation and that MR WANTED this...or he knew he would cover her before hitting her to stop splatter or something like that. But they were bought for a purpose not an impulse buy.

 

[~n/t~]

Well, that could be possible, but then why wouldn't he just tell LE what happened to begin with? Because he was afraid of TLM?

He missed his opportunity to tell the cops that he was forced to kidnap, rape and murder an 8 year old because he was afraid of the woman with hammer and garbage bags. :moo:

 

[antiquegirl]

It's changed since TLM was there, it now says its a facility for boys.

Maybe they didn't want to include content on the site that doesn't inspire growth and change. At least I hope that's why we aren't seeing pictures of cells (or locked rooms) and visitors behind glass talking to an inmate.

You'd think they would at least tape the phone calls.

(BBM)

I would bet a lot that they do.

Gerry Dewan ‏@GerryDewanCTV

McClintic says she talked with #Rafferty days prior. She says he told here it doesn't matter because you didn't do anything wrong.

Gerry Dewan ‏@GerryDewanCTV

Derstine says having someone tell you don't worry you didn't do anything when you did something is kind of odd, isn it.

Gerry Dewan ‏@GerryDewanCTV

McClintic responds "on a phone that could be monitored."

JMO

 

[matou]

In the video Det Smyth asked TLM if you were just going to leave Tori out there and were not taking her body back to the city...why the garbage bags. Why did you need garbage bags. She said I don't know, she didn't know why they decided to put her in garbage bags.

Follow this. TLM bought the garbage bags. Why? She said she doesn't know why. Did MR tell her to buy them...so she did... Why did MR want garbage bags??? We won't know unless he tells us..maybe it is so the animals wouldnt drag pieces of clothing out where people might find them etc. The point is.....the garbage bags were bought because SOMEONE thought it was a good part of the plan and a good thing to have. TLM looked really confused by that question...why garbage bags...by Det Smyth. JMO It could go to premeditation and that MR WANTED this.

I`ve wondered why the bags were already out and available according to TLM`s version 2 of what happened. All of a sudden she snaps and goes into a rage and Tori`s head is in a bag while she is lying on the ground. I have to wonder if MR already placed the bag on Tori`s head while he was raping her since he was so disappointed to get such an old child instead of what he was hoping to get. Maybe he needed to fantasize that she was much younger than she actually was. The snapping into a rage doesn`t fly with me. The true rage and stewing that would be boiling inside of her as explained would make her blind to all the details she absorbed while she was out there. JMO

 

[daisy.faithfull]

He missed his opportunity to tell the cops that he was forced to kidnap, rape and murder an 8 year old because he was afraid of the woman with hammer and garbage bags. :moo:

I'd be afraid of TLM even if she only had a freaking q-tip.

But I'm just saying that either way the cops would get to TLM via MTR through his direct or indirect statements, so she'd be after him either way. He would be the first person she would think of as the snitch, no matter what reason LE gave her for their interest in her.

 

[Macright]

I wonder why they didn't leave her clothes with her body..could be because of fingerprints but yet they did leave a shirt on her. If she was hit over the head with the hammer as TLM has said then putting the child in the garbage bag was to avoid blood etc. IMO.

 

[Ardy]

In the video Det Smyth asked TLM if you were just going to leave Tori out there and were not taking her body back to the city...why the garbage bags. Why did you need garbage bags. She said I don't know, she didn't know why they decided to put her in garbage bags.

Follow this. TLM bought the garbage bags. Why? She said she doesn't know why. Did MR tell her to buy them...so she did... Why did MR want garbage bags??? We won't know unless he tells us..maybe it is so the animals wouldnt drag pieces of clothing out where people might find them etc. The point is.....the garbage bags were bought because SOMEONE thought it was a good part of the plan and a good thing to have. TLM looked really confused by that question...why garbage bags...by Det Smyth. JMO It could go to premeditation and that MR WANTED this...or he knew he would cover her before hitting her to stop splatter or something like that. But they were bought for a purpose not an impulse buy.

Good point, but I think she was surprised by the question because she knew the answer wasn't going to fit her statements that she didn't know what was going to happen to VS, because she was only mindlessly following the directions of MR.

So she did what she has done so often throughout........she buys time to formulate an answer that fits.........by stammering, sputterng, crying, babbling, sobbing, getting kleenex..........anything to buy time to formulate an answer that won't backfire on her.

The trademarks of liars are.......their stories change, they avoid eye contact, they fidget and squirm, they buy time to formulate an answer when needed, they change the subject, or they claim they can't remember.

TLM has exhibited not some of the trademarks........but all of them at one time or another.

Also......judge a person by what they do...........not what they say.

She abducted VS. She bought the hammer and bags. She killed VS.

She is accusing MR of rape in between........and of planning the whole event.

 

[maxfactor]

I`ve wondered why the bags were already out and available according to TLM`s version 2 of what happened. All of a sudden she snaps and goes into a rage and Tori`s head is in a bag while she is lying on the ground. I have to wonder if MR already placed the bag on Tori`s head while he was raping her since he was so disappointed to get such an old child instead of what he was hoping to get. Maybe he needed to fantasize that she was much younger than she actually was. The snapping into a rage doesn`t fly with me. The true rage and stewing that would be boiling inside of her as explained would make her blind to all the details she absorbed while she was out there. JMO

Exactly Matou!! I can see now why the Crown feels it is so important for the jury to see the crime scene. I can't get over how many details she remembered especially since she was high. I feel even more sure now that she was wandering around while Rafferty was sexually assaulting Tori. And I don't believe for a minute that she was the one who killed Tori. Not for one minute.:moo:

 

[snoofer]

Good point, but I think she was surprised by the question because she knew the answer wasn't going to fit her statements that she didn't know what was going to happen to VS, because she was only mindlessly following the directions of MR.

So she did what she has done so often throughout........she buys time to formulate an answer that fits.........by stammering, sputterng, crying, babbling, sobbing, getting kleenex..........anything to buy time to formulate an answer that won't backfire on her.

The trademarks of liars are.......their stories change, they avoid eye contact, they fidget and squirm, they buy time to formulate an answer when needed, they change the subject, or they claim they can't remember.

TLM has exhibited not some of the trademarks........but all of them at one time or another.

Also......judge a person by what they do...........not what they say.

She abducted VS. She bought the hammer and bags. She killed VS.

She is accusing MR of rape in between........and of planning the whole event.

Good point..never thought of her reaction to the question..in that way...makes sense. IMO:twocents:

 

[snoofer]

Total "hard on the head" trying to figure those two out IMO...they are headache makers!

 

[matou]

That is just horribe. Absolutely horrible.:twocents:

Fake ID`s: I wonder if MR had one that said Mike Reynolds or any other names he was using? JMO

 

[daisy.faithfull]

I wonder why they didn't leave her clothes with her body..could be because of fingerprints but yet they did leave a shirt on her. If she was hit over the head with the hammer as TLM has said then putting the child in the garbage bag was to avoid blood etc. IMO.

Maybe other body fluids? Or because they weren't with her when they placed her in the bag?

That her pants weren't on when she was found doesn't outright say that she was raped, but it does make you wonder why they were removed? It does, however slightly, support TLM's story.

I too hope that Tori was not raped, but if she was I hope they were able to find DNA from MTR.

 

[Wondergirl]

And what does "Brad" have to do with this case? Did I miss something?

Wait for it.....

 

[K.Scarpetta]

In the video Det Smyth asked TLM if you were just going to leave Tori out there and were not taking her body back to the city...why the garbage bags. Why did you need garbage bags. She said I don't know, she didn't know why they decided to put her in garbage bags.

Follow this. TLM bought the garbage bags. Why? She said she doesn't know why. Did MR tell her to buy them...so she did... Why did MR want garbage bags??? We won't know unless he tells us..maybe it is so the animals wouldnt drag pieces of clothing out where people might find them etc. The point is.....the garbage bags were bought because SOMEONE thought it was a good part of the plan and a good thing to have. TLM looked really confused by that question...why garbage bags...by Det Smyth. JMO It could go to premeditation and that MR WANTED this...or he knew he would cover her before hitting her to stop splatter or something like that. But they were bought for a purpose not an impulse buy.

Maybe, just maybe she could not stand to look at Tori's face as she hit her with a hammer.
Maybe, jmo

 

[brighidin]

If facial expressions and movements are so important..........why not tweet on what the defense team is reacting.........or the Crown?

Because they aren't on trial for first degree murder.

If they did make exaggerated facial expressions or unprofessional gestures, that would be tweeted about. Anyone recall Jose Baez, Jeff Ashton and their theatrics?

 

[Ardy]

Well..........this is kind of gross........so I will try to be delicate..........

When people pass away, quite often the immediate relaxation of all body muscles, including those that help retain bodily fluids, causes the release of all body fluids and................

So I suppose it might be possible that they removed the pants from the scene because they would possibly emanate an odour and they decided to put them into a trash bag and dispose of them elsewhere.

I just put that out there as a possible other reason.

Perhaps the defense will call their own experts in an attempt to combat the impression that missing pants must equal rape.

 

[dilbert]

Derstine won't like anything that show the guilt of his client and the creditably of TLM[/I]. :moo: Too bad he was granted a trial. Hope he has to work extra hard in prison to pay for this unnecessary trial and putting Tori's family through so much more unnecessary heartbreak and pain. :moo:

I wonder if any of the Bandidos are housed where MR will be going if and when found guilty? JMHO

Too bad he was granted a trial? In Canada everyone is afforded the right to a trial, and thank God for that, otherwise, we all might as well be living in a communist country.

There's that reference to the Bandidos again, I wonder if any of the players in this case know any? Funny how everyone is appalled by bikers, that is until they want them to do their dirty work.

MOO

 

[dilbert]

Well..........this is kind of gross........so I will try to be delicate..........

When people pass away, quite often the immediate relaxation of all body muscles, including those that help retain bodily fluids, causes the release of all body fluids and................

So I suppose it might be possible that they removed the pants from the scene because they would possibly emanate an odour and they decided to put them into a trash bag and dispose of them elsewhere.

I just put that out there as a possible other reason.

Perhaps the defense will call their own experts in an attempt to combat the impression that missing pants must equal rape.

I see what you're saying, but I think a decomposing body would be more odiferous than the soiled pants.

MOO

 

[daisy.faithfull]

Well..........this is kind of gross........so I will try to be delicate..........

When people pass away, quite often the immediate relaxation of all body muscles, including those that help retain bodily fluids, causes the release of all body fluids and................

So I suppose it might be possible that they removed the pants from the scene because they would possibly emanate an odour and they decided to put them into a trash bag and dispose of them elsewhere.

I just put that out there as a possible other reason.

Perhaps the defense will call their own experts in an attempt to combat the impression that missing pants must equal rape.

No one said that missing pants equals rape but if you were a detective called to the scene of a murder and the female victim did not have their pants on wouldn't you be more likely to think that she had been raped than if her pants were on?

Or would you be more likely to think the murderer didn't want her possibly sticky drawers to draw attention?