TX - Botham Shem Jean, 26, killed when police officer entered wrong apartment, Dallas, Sept 2018

[Cryptic]

The arrest warrant says "slightly ajar."

This claim is apparently being contradicted by a witness who has related that she heard the officer order the victim to open the door.

Even in Texas, where home owners have very large "checks" regarding self defense, summoning an identified intruder to the door, then executing him would be pushing the limit.

This officer needs to be quiet and offer to plead guilty to Manslaughter ASAP. The prosecutor has stated that he will consider additional charges if the investigation warrants them. I don't think it would take too many contradictions or implausibilities for him to file Second Degree Murder charges.

 

[kaen]

I don't think she was actually interviewed by DPD. The search warrant that DPD got does indicate the first version of the story we heard (victim opened the door), but I am not sure where exactly DPD got it from.

Then, the department did not follow its own procedures, which needs to be acknowledged so there is not this continual confusion for the public.
According to their own published documents she should have been interviewed in their two tier system-- supervisor and special resource detective. As of now, it is starting to look like they made up the procedures in the field--the shooting was not covered as an OIS or civilian shooting (which would have led to her being interviewed by field officers and, most likely, at the station). In either case, Mr. Jean has lost his life and she will find loopholes to not go to jail for entering his apartment and killing him.

 

[weedemout]

"If a jury believes that Guyger reasonably thought she was in her own apartment when she shot Jean, she's covered by Texas' castle law, which allows Texas residents to shoot intruders in their homes on sight, without criminal repercussions."
Fate of Officer Who Killed Botham Jean Will Come Down to Two Juries

guess what's next....she just placed a red mat outside her door, just two days earlier.

 

[MKZoo]

"If a jury believes that Guyger reasonably thought she was in her own apartment when she shot Jean, she's covered by Texas' castle law, which allows Texas residents to shoot intruders in their homes on sight, without criminal repercussions."
Fate of Officer Who Killed Botham Jean Will Come Down to Two Juries

Good heavens. I cannot imagine that the Texas legislature intended for someone who unlawfully enters the home of another person to be able to use castle doctrine. Doesn’t the castle defense belong the person who has the right to be there? Her confusion about where she was didn’t give her the right to be in that apartment.

I understand that she is saying this was a tragic accident, but she didn’t accidentally discharge her weapon. She made a series of mistakes and decisions leading up to this and ultimately she is responsible for being in the apartment, he’s not.

 

[rosesfromangels]

"If a jury believes that Guyger reasonably thought she was in her own apartment when she shot Jean, she's covered by Texas' castle law, which allows Texas residents to shoot intruders in their homes on sight, without criminal repercussions."
Fate of Officer Who Killed Botham Jean Will Come Down to Two Juries

I can state, with relative confidence, that if the Victim in question, Botham Shen Jean, had of shot the officer in question in his apartment, he wouldn't prevail based on this law. Just a hunch. Hope I'm wrong on that, but doubtful.

As for the Officer, who had a *prior* previous questionable incident involving a weapon, it will come down to her state of mind, stability, intoxication, and any notable similarities to the first weapons incident.

As long as she had been properly screened and evaluated in the hiring process and trained properly, I don't see this as the fault of the DPD. The exception to that statement is whether they took the correct actions following her first weapons incident. Should she have been removed from the force? Given retraining, etc? Perhaps there were critical signs that were overlooked?

I speculate that this is going to come down to the tox reports and mental stability. My guess is neither will be favorable for the Officer. The situation is so off the charts bizarre, only intoxication or instability, or both, can explain it.

BTW, I am a vigorous supporter of The Blue. I do not see this as a police incident. I see this as a wacko citizen gunning down another citizen while she happened to be wearing her work uniform.

*Amateur speculation and opinion only*

 

[newmember]

if it is true a neighbor heard her asking to be let in, does anyone think its possible we will learn they knew each other? (i want to be clear i am 10000% NOT victim blaming; this would make me just as disgusted with the cop, if not more but for different reasons: the current & likely scenario of her totally abusing power on an innocent stranger and the possible scenario of her knowing him also still being a misuse of power on a personal level by using her gun and status bc of a personal matter.

-the latter scenario has run through my mind because he is 26 and attractive, shes 30 and also attractive (despite her mugshot). it wouldnt be the most unlikely pairing of random ppl in a building to be acquainted.

-i know jean's phone has been taken and chances are something will be discovered if they were acquaintances but since they lived a floor apart, their texts could have been minimal. and maybe this version of events was the best story she came up with on the 911 call/police arrival?

-again, imo, this scenario still makes her entirely at fault because based on what the neighbor is saying, she was asking to be let in and NOT that the neighbor overheard an ongoing argument that escalated (which doesnt excuse shooting someone but a one hour domestic argument would make it harder to prove exactly what happened). nobody, man or woman, is required to let someone into their apartment.

-ik articles have stated theres no reason to think they know each other but i am curious if anyone has found confirmation that they absolutely didnt know each other, in which case my post would be irrelevant.

 

[Gigglingtoes]

I just can’t with this!

Saying how “identical” her apartment was to his really bothers me. That is a POOR excuse for someone who has taken a career to supposedly protect us.

It’s a garbage reason to NOT pay attention to her surroundings. That was her friggin job. To pay attention!

Also- he didn’t obey her commands. Well, he’s probably wondering why in the heck she is in his apartment! Not only that- but she was OFF duty. Why is she giving commands? Call the cops! Leave!

 

[kaen]

IF they took his phone, did they also take hers? We know she made at least on call beside 911 that night.

 

[Gigglingtoes]

So lame to quote myself, but if the witnesses are correct, and Amber actually said “Let me in”, that means that she thought that someone she knew was in the apartment. That means that after the door opened, IF it was totally dark, wouldn’t she have tried to made sure to verify who was in the apartment before shooting?

This tells me that the lights were on, and she saw Bo clearly before she shot him.

I will have to find it but I did post it at some point. A neighbor actually said she saw lights ON in his apartment.

 

[cybervampira]

From the DallasObserver article. bbm

Whatever questions they asked her and whatever answers she gave, they are obviously not letting it out. I assume the search warrant described her initial statement, and that was also backed up by the anonymous DPD source.

 

[rosesfromangels]

I don’t think he left his door “ajar” at 10pm at night while all his lights were off in his house. Doesn’t sounds correct.

Sounds like a concocted narrative to me.
Suspending the seeming unreality of this woman's version of events, what are we missing here?
I don't believe this story as reported....at all. AT ALL.

What do we really think happened here?
Throwing out some possibilities, although only based on random conjecture:
A) An exhausted sleep-deprived and stressed Officer makes a tragic mistake that costs a Citizen their life
B) An Officer is found with altering levels of substance in their system
C) Officer is mentally unstable; prior weapons incident was ignored as warning sign
D) Officer knew Victim and had some grudge
E) Officer was suffering from mental delusions
F) Officer went to Victim's apartment for different purpose and situation escalated to deadly force
G) Officer had romantic interest in Victim, and this was a personal matter that escalated

What other possibilities are there? I simply can not subscribe to her version of events.

*Amateur speculation and opinion only*

 

[newmember]

IF they took his phone, did they also take hers? We know she made at least on call beside 911 that night.

Family disputes official account of the moments before Amber Guyger shot Botham Jean | Dallas Police | Dallas News

this article states his phone was taken (and i read it as the laptop was not taken bc it was damaged, which seems weird). i would hope they took hers bc agreed, it would be interesting her night leading up to her arrival at the building but havent seen any confirmation of that.

 

[Jax49]

How could anyone miss that rug...

moo

 

[Gigglingtoes]

Sounds like a concocted narrative to me.
Suspending the seeming unreality of this woman's version of events, what are we missing here?
I don't believe this story as reported....at all. AT ALL.

What do we really think happened here?
Throwing out some possibilities, although only based on random conjecture:
A) An exhausted sleep-deprived and stressed Officer makes a tragic mistake that costs a Citizen their life
B) An Officer is found with altering levels of substance in their system
C) Officer is mentally unstable; prior weapons incident was ignored as warning sign
D) Officer knew Victim and had some grudge
E) Officer was suffering from mental delusions
F) Officer went to Victim's apartment for different purpose and situation escalated to deadly force
G) Officer had romantic interest in Victim, and this was a personal matter that escalated

What other possibilities are there? I simply can not subscribe to her version of events.

*Amateur speculation and opinion only*

I’m going with her being drunk or high.

 

[rosesfromangels]

How could anyone miss that rug...

moo

This makes me so sad, and so angry! Can you imagine that being your son or brother in that apartment getting gunned down by some gun-slinging wannabe cop? And yes, "wannabe" is right, because the men and women in Blue are stable, skilled, and honorable. This shoot em' up nightmare has nothing to do with Police work. NOTHING.

My deepest prayers for this family. I pray this will be a catalyst for change in the screening procedures for police hires, and for training on when, and how, weapons are used. Obviously the existing processes failed Botham Shen Jean. I am profoundly saddened by this. God rest his young and beautiful soul.

 

[Isabelle]

guess what's next....she just placed a red mat outside her door, just two days earlier.

Are you serious??? Or are you just saying this could possibly happen??? Good God!!!

 

[Isabelle]

"If a jury believes that Guyger reasonably thought she was in her own apartment when she shot Jean, she's covered by Texas' castle law, which allows Texas residents to shoot intruders in their homes on sight, without criminal repercussions."
Fate of Officer Who Killed Botham Jean Will Come Down to Two Juries

I would consider a jury’s belief that she is covered by Texas’ castle law a worse crime than the murder itself. It would prove some sort of manipulation of the jury by authorities. This is just beyond stupid!!!

 

[Isabelle]

IMO dark circles under eyes are only visible in some people with different complexions. Dark eyed people seem to be more vulnerable to it and it is often related to liver impairment from a drinking habit.

And sometimes it’s just genetic.

 

[Isabelle]

I don't think she took the time to notice---she had tunnel vision. I think she opened the door, saw him, and shot him.

The only time we hear that she actually entered the apt was after she shot him to call 911. It was then she realized it was not her apt and had to go look at the door to see what apt she was at.

I don’t believe Amber Guyger is law enforcement material!!!

 

[RickshawFan]

I would guess there should be a window in this living room, and probably on the side behind the photographer.

So if there was ample street light outside that window, it might be possible to see a silhouette in front of it.

Exactly, if a person's silhouette was visible, so should silhouettes of furniture, indoor lights, decorations etc.

The affidavit seems to paint a picture of the victim as if he was setting a trap for her in the dark. Unbelievable. Then there was suggestion that he might be waiting for someone to arrive. That's why LE has taken his iPhone for examination. Looks like they are working very hard to find those mitigating factors, and they are not defence attorneys!

The light in the hallway would have been on, and the front door to the hallway was open.