TX TX - Caleb Harris, 21, Texas A&M University student, Corpus Christi, 4 Mar 2024 #4

[SMK777]

LE won't tell his family the person found is him until it's confirmed by dental records or DNA. A clothing match could theoretically (although not likely) be a staged scene or coincidence. So I guess his family still doesn't "know," but that's just my opinion.

Yes, agreed. It may be that Caleb’s family know that it is him, or likely to be him, but LE are not saying anything to media until all the official investigations have been concluded.

 

[buyerninety]

I've let go of the serial killer kidnapping theory on
this disappearance. I don't give any weight to the
alleged 'Simmons Rd' surveillance footage sighting.
I'm thinking you, SMK777, might have shown the
info that gives the most likely explanation for his
disappearance - in this post:
TX - TX - Caleb Harris, 21, Texas A&M University student, Corpus Christi, 4 Mar 2024 #3
Although the picture you posted states there is an
uncovered manhole in that area, the information
displayed on or about page 55 of the well known
LSRP-EPA-Approved-2020-08-20.pdf
LSRP-EPA-Approved-2020-08-20.pdf, shows no
manhole in that area - possibly there is a manhole
not recorded, or possibly there is a hole down into
the piping system (say if plowing of that field had
gouged and broken into the top of that pipe). This
area in the field has been noted before in this thread,
I'm just suggesting that to get into the piping system,
it seems a heck of a lot more likely to me that Caleb
Harris may have wandered over to that [now]overgrown,
unplowed area to see what was there, and simply
fallen down into a hole (be it an uncovered manhole or
a broken-into pipe) in the dark, rather than some of
the wackier 'hide a body' foul play scenario's being
apparently seriously considered currently in this thread.
Hechlar St · Corpus Christi, TX 78412
That supposed manhole/hole in the field is on an
almost direct line from a manhole that is shown
in the pdf (and can be seen in the google maps link
above, in the lower right as the black dot in the
road), from there across the field to the two
manholes known to be just southwards of &
immediately outside of the pump lift station.

 

[SMK777]

I've let go of the serial killer kidnapping theory on
this disappearance. I don't give any weight to the
alleged 'Simmons Rd' surveillance footage sighting.
I'm thinking you, SMK777, might have shown the
info that gives the most likely explanation for his
disappearance - in this post:
TX - TX - Caleb Harris, 21, Texas A&M University student, Corpus Christi, 4 Mar 2024 #3
Although the picture you posted states there is an
uncovered manhole in that area, the information
displayed on or about page 55 of the well known
LSRP-EPA-Approved-2020-08-20.pdf, shows no
manhole in that area - possibly there is a manhole
not recorded, or possibly there is a hole down into
the piping system (say if plowing of that field had
gouged and broken into the top of that pipe). This
area in the field has been noted before in this thread,
I'm just suggesting that to get into the piping system,
it seems a heck of a lot more likely to me that Caleb
Harris may have wandered over to that overgrown,
unplowed area to see what was there, and simply
fallen down into a hole (be it a manhole or a
broken into pipe) in the dark, rather than some
foul play scenario.
Hechlar St · Corpus Christi, TX 78412

I’m in agreement, and glad if my post helped clarify things!

 

[buyerninety]

( P.S. it took a while, but I found where I saw
that LSRP-EPA-Approved-2020-08-20.pdf
first posted, at or about this post
TX - TX - Caleb Harris, 21, Texas A&M University student, Corpus Christi, 4 Mar 2024 #3
by PommyMommy .)

 

[Batgirl 2.0]

I disagree that the public has no right to know. If Caleb has been found they MUST remove him from the list of missing persons. If he is deceased they are REQUIRED to report that information and issue a death certificate which is PUBLIC INFORMATION. They of course may withhold information until they are absolutely certain the body found is Caleb, but not beyond that finding. And no way does the family know his fate but continues to pretend they are looking for Caleb. There also is no advantage in any kind of investigation for LE to keep it a secret should they determine Caleb is deceased; it would actually be a hinderance to any such investigation. I hope it isn't Caleb and that he is soon found alive and well, but that seems rather unlikely at this point.

Death certificates in Texas are sealed for 25 years; within that time, only immediate family members or other applicants who can provide legal documentation that documents a direct, tangible interest are eligible to request a copy:

Death Record FAQs | Texas DSHS

www.dshs.texas.gov

 

[EllaMae]

I've let go of the serial killer kidnapping theory on
this disappearance. I don't give any weight to the
alleged 'Simmons Rd' surveillance footage sighting.
I'm thinking you, SMK777, might have shown the
info that gives the most likely explanation for his
disappearance - in this post:
TX - TX - Caleb Harris, 21, Texas A&M University student, Corpus Christi, 4 Mar 2024 #3
Although the picture you posted states there is an
uncovered manhole in that area, the information
displayed on or about page 55 of the well known
LSRP-EPA-Approved-2020-08-20.pdf
LSRP-EPA-Approved-2020-08-20.pdf, shows no
manhole in that area - possibly there is a manhole
not recorded, or possibly there is a hole down into
the piping system (say if plowing of that field had
gouged and broken into the top of that pipe). This
area in the field has been noted before in this thread,
I'm just suggesting that to get into the piping system,
it seems a heck of a lot more likely to me that Caleb
Harris may have wandered over to that [now]overgrown,
unplowed area to see what was there, and simply
fallen down into a hole (be it an uncovered manhole or
a broken-into pipe) in the dark, rather than some of
the wackier 'hide a body' foul play scenario's being
apparently seriously considered currently in this thread.
Hechlar St · Corpus Christi, TX 78412
That supposed manhole/hole in the field is on an
almost direct line from a manhole that is shown
in the pdf (and can be seen in the google maps link
above, in the lower right as the black dot in the
road), from there across the field to the two
manholes known to be just southwards of &
immediately outside of the pump lift station.

I thought none of those manholes in that field led directly into the holding tank which is part of the sewer system.

 

[EllaMae]

I kind of disagree. If it appears to LE that Caleb met with foul play, and the perpetrator is still out there potentially harming other partners, the public needs to know everything that might identify this predator, ASAP.

LE will ask for the public's help if and when they need it. We do not have the right to demand that they share sensitive information.

 

[SMK777]

I thought none of those manholes in that field led directly into the holding tank which is part of the sewer system.

I’ve had a very difficult time getting the facts on this.

 

[Muddy K]

I’ve had a very difficult time getting the facts on this.

Me neither, nor have I been able to find  definitive information about the diameter of the lift station's incoming pipe, even if it is the one the supposed "uncapped" manhole ports to. The best I've been able to determine about that pipe is the diameter would be between 10 and 15 inches. I spent way too much of my Sunday poring over a 110-page public works document to learn more about the Perry Place lift station, which is the one in which the remains were found.

Because if in fact those remains included parts as large as a torso, I'm not at all convinced they could freely flow through a 15-inch-diameter pipe and into the wet well chamber. After all, it appears they could not then pass through the outbound 18-inch-diameter pipe, which is why they were discovered in the wet well chamber, either hung up on the pump or just suspended in the liquid, unable to drift into the outbound pipe. Something doesn't make sense, but it could also be just me not being an urban engineer.

What I wouldn't give for a complete schematic of that lift station...

 

[jshhanson]

I wonder if they are waiting for all the results to be in before making any announcements: DNA, autopsy and toxicology. It may make sense for all this to be released together ?

The other thought is that perhaps if the determination ends up being death by misadventure, maybe only Caleb’s parents will be notified and no public notification will be made? I’m not sure how that is usually handled?

I know different jurisdictions handle these things differently. IMO.

They would at least indicate that the remains found were in fact Caleb and let the public know if or if not they believed there was foul play involved. They would probably not release additional details to the public.

 

[LauraAnne]

LE will ask for the public's help if and when they need it. We do not have the right to demand that they share sensitive information.

I think the public has the right, if LE believes at this time that he was murdered, to know that. Because if that's the case and they have no idea who did it, the public is in danger.

 

[Martin22]

In clarifying an earlier statement that Death Certificates are PUBLIC INFORMATION. In Texas the actual death certificate with many of its details is sealed for 25 years with access limited to various authorized recipients. This may prevent the cause of anyone's death being unknown to the public. If the death is believed to be the result of a crime, that WILL become PUBLIC INFORMATION. However the actual death of a person from any cause is NOT sealed and MUST be reported to a number of sources and agencies including social security, credit bureaus, etc. Death of an individual cannot be kept confidential for a number of reasons such as preventing fraud, bring closure to any obligations, and distribute any assets to the proper heirs however minimal those assets maybe. Again, hopefully Caleb is alive and soon to be returned to his family. If not, his passing will be reported as soon as such as passing has been verified by the authorities.

 

[DoctorRose]

Me neither, nor have I been able to find  definitive information about the diameter of the lift station's incoming pipe, even if it is the one the supposed "uncapped" manhole ports to. The best I've been able to determine about that pipe is the diameter would be between 10 and 15 inches. I spent way too much of my Sunday poring over a 110-page public works document to learn more about the Perry Place lift station, which is the one in which the remains were found.

Because if in fact those remains included parts as large as a torso, I'm not at all convinced they could freely flow through a 15-inch-diameter pipe and into the wet well chamber. After all, it appears they could not then pass through the outbound 18-inch-diameter pipe, which is why they were discovered in the wet well chamber, either hung up on the pump or just suspended in the liquid, unable to drift into the outbound pipe. Something doesn't make sense, but it could also be just me not being an urban engineer.

What I wouldn't give for a complete schematic of that lift station...

I think we also have to factor in pressure differences between the pipes and the well. With enough pressure I think a body could fit in small spaces because it can be squeezed. Sorry for how gross that imagery is. IMO.

 

[Janitor101]

Vail,

OMG, yes, Caleb and Noah's cases are strikingly similar. Both men are slim, similar in age, outgoing, well liked, adventerous, have fantastic smiles, like to go barefoot, and were/are students.

& then we have the Lift Station

I believe that 'suicidal cause of death' is the default for, "We don't have the resources to keep the investigation going." (No judgement).

This is why the Harris' have to raise money on their own to find out what happened to their boy.

 imo

The weird thing about Noah Dewitt's case is that he had been missing for almost the same length of time as Caleb....3 months, yet the ME made a positive ID within 4 days of the body being discovered. Although his death was ruled as "undetermined", he had been very distressed at the time he left a friend's home.

The pipe that fed into the wet well was reported to be 52".

 

[buyerninety]

EllaMae said;
"I thought none of those manholes in that field led
directly into the holding tank"...

Well, (cited previously up the thread page), the
LSRP-EPA-Approved-2020-08-20.pdf , at or about pdf
page 55, (showing pump lift station #1051), has a
representation of a 'gravity main' pipe laid and flowing
under that field to the (orange) 'overflow' manhole
south of the pump lift station and thence into the
pump lift station. (Remember, we're unclear if there
is an actual manhole in that field or if there may be
some broken-into-the-pipe-top 'hole').

Your post had my head spinning for some time...
we've definately got the correct pump lift station,
as here is the link for the Corpus Christi Police Dept.:
UPDATE ON INVESTIGATION INTO HUMAN REMAINS
which locates the pump lift station "off the 5300
block of Lexington Road." Inputting that into Google
Maps/Earth lets you see the lift station if you zoom in
a few times. ('Perry Place' doesn't return anything
currently, but I assume that's the name for the service
road that leads down beside the water ditch down to
the lift station?)

 

[10ofRods]

In clarifying an earlier statement that Death Certificates are PUBLIC INFORMATION. In Texas the actual death certificate with many of its details is sealed for 25 years with access limited to various authorized recipients. This may prevent the cause of anyone's death being unknown to the public. If the death is believed to be the result of a crime, that WILL become PUBLIC INFORMATION. However the actual death of a person from any cause is NOT sealed and MUST be reported to a number of sources and agencies including social security, credit bureaus, etc. Death of an individual cannot be kept confidential for a number of reasons such as preventing fraud, bring closure to any obligations, and distribute any assets to the proper heirs however minimal those assets maybe. Again, hopefully Caleb is alive and soon to be returned to his family. If not, his passing will be reported as soon as such as passing has been verified by the authorities.

Can you get access to death certificates in Texas without paying a fee? Anyone know?

Where I live (CA), one must pay a fee to get the death certificate. Reporting is done to SS, but not to banks or creditors. That is the duty of the executor of the estate, where I live. And it's not mandatory. SS itself apparently reports to credit bureaus after it receives the death notice (and this is an "eventual" thing that happens, it's unclear how long it takes the SSA to do this).

If the cause of death is undetermined or unknown and manner of death is undetermined, the only details released are simply that the person is dead.

I would think in this case, determining manner of death has to be the principal task of the ongoing investigation, with a badly decomposed body in a very unusual circumstance. I think the idea that he "just fell in" to the pump station when the manhole cover was off for an innocuous reason and then someone comes and replaces the manhole cover without checking inside is pretty...outlandish. I find it hard to believe.

That leaves, in my mind, one main option (homicide) and one unlikely option (suicide - I mean, how can it be a suicide?).

There's still the option of accident/misadventure if in fact this is like those times when someone goes down a chimney, thinking they can fit through to somewhere else, and gets stuck. But how did the manhole cover get replaced in that case? Someone knows.

IMO

 

[Janitor101]

Can you get access to death certificates in Texas without paying a fee? Anyone know?

Where I live (CA), one must pay a fee to get the death certificate. Reporting is done to SS, but not to banks or creditors. That is the duty of the executor of the estate, where I live. And it's not mandatory. SS itself apparently reports to credit bureaus after it receives the death notice (and this is an "eventual" thing that happens, it's unclear how long it takes the SSA to do this).

If the cause of death is undetermined or unknown and manner of death is undetermined, the only details released are simply that the person is dead.

I would think in this case, determining manner of death has to be the principal task of the ongoing investigation, with a badly decomposed body in a very unusual circumstance. I think the idea that he "just fell in" to the pump station when the manhole cover was off for an innocuous reason and then someone comes and replaces the manhole cover without checking inside is pretty...outlandish. I find it hard to believe.

That leaves, in my mind, one main option (homicide) and one unlikely option (suicide - I mean, how can it be a suicide?).

There's still the option of accident/misadventure if in fact this is like those times when someone goes down a chimney, thinking they can fit through to somewhere else, and gets stuck. But how did the manhole cover get replaced in that case? Someone knows.

IMO

If it was an accident/misadventure one would think if you are striding across a darkened field at night and you fail to see an open manhole, it seems that only one of your legs would fall into the open manhole....not both? Unless we are talking about a fairly huge manhole?