TX- Jocelyn Nungaray,12 strangled, left under bridge. Houston June 17, 2024

[Megnut]

Sincere question: Can the state impose the death penalty if the defendant confessed?

For some reason, I think that cannot happen (as it would be like a state-implemented suic*de). I honestly don't know, though, and perhaps someone here does.

jmo

Sentence is attached to the crime. I doubt anything would bring the DP off the table for these two, with or without confession.

Even if they confessed, they'll likely plead not guilty at arraignment. It's how it goes.

JMO

 

[Vaderman]

I just don't get it. What causes a person to do things like this? To pick someone at random, assault them, and then murder them? What is the motivation? Just a complete lack of control over urges?

I think cases like these disturb me more because they just seem so random. "At least" with serial killers some kind of logic can be made out with their pre-planning and habits. No less awful, to be sure, but I really don't understand these truly senseless crimes.

 

[Inthedetails]

I just don't get it. What causes a person to do things like this? To pick someone at random, assault them, and then murder them? What is the motivation? Just a complete lack of control over urges?

I think cases like these disturb me more because they just seem so random. "At least" with serial killers some kind of logic can be made out with their pre-planning and habits. No less awful, to be sure, but I really don't understand these truly senseless crimes.

The word predator fits, imo. They preyed on a young, vulnerable girl.

jmo

 

[airportwoman]

I have a feeling they've done something like this before, even if it wasn't in the U.S.

 

[whitelilac]

I have a feeling they've done something like this before, even if it wasn't in the U.S.

Or even in the US. They need to investigate where these guys have been prior to living in that apartment location, and whether any unsolved predatory crimes have occurred where they were or travelled. Much like in the Rachel Morin case.

 

[di anna]

Or even in the US. They need to investigate where these guys have been prior to living in that apartment location, and whether any unsolved predatory crimes have occurred where they were or travelled. Much like in the Rachel Morin case.

Is it not possible that these guys are in a gang? I watched a documentary on gangs currently in the US and there are plenty.

 

[Dotta]

"One of the suspects
crossed the border illegally less than a month before the shocking murder,
and was released into the US
after claiming he feared for his life
if he was sent back to his home country.

Johan Jose Rangel Martinez, 21,
and Franklin Jose Pena Ramos, 26,
were charged Thursday with capital murder.

Department of Homeland Security (DHS) sources said Pena Ramos crossed into El Paso, Texas,
on May 28.
He was released soon after his interaction with border agents.

He told authorities that he planned to live with
his cousin
in Houston until his court appearance in July,
sources said.

Agents put a GPS tracker on Pena Ramos,
which was only set to monitor his location for 21 days.

It’s unclear whether he was wearing the tracker when Jocelyn was murdered.

The two migrants were arrested at a local apartment complex,
where they had been living as roommates,
cops said.

Homeland Security
has opened an investigation into the suspects’ immigration histories."

Migrant charged with murder of 12-year-old Jocelyn Nungaray was released into US just weeks ago

Johan Jose Rangel Martinez, 21, and Franklin Jose Pena Ramos, 26, were charged Thursday with capital murder for the death of Jocelyn Nungaray.

nypost.com

 

[JoeFromLB]

It will be interesting to know the background of these two monsters. I don't want to say anything more.

 

[JoeFromLB]

Rest in Peace, Jocelyn. There will be justice for you!

 

[Gizmo3]

DM is saying Ramos cut his ankle monitor and it was found on Wednesday. Doesn't say where it was found, I'm guessing his apartment? MOO

Migrant charged over murder of girl, 12, arrived in US days earlier

Franklin Jose Pena Ramos, 26, crossed the border at El Paso in Texas on May 28 and was fitted with a GPS tracker to monitor his location after being interviewed by border agents

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

Suspects had dinner at a restaurant.

Then were captured on CCTV talking to Jocelyn. Then walking with her to the bridge.

I can't fathom her terror from there.

She was only 12.

She just wanted a soda.

JMO

What gets me most is she probably thought she couldn't call mum for help because a) she had snuck out and b) she thought mum wouldn't be able to leave because of her younger brother, but mostly a).
The witness who saw her HIDING behind the storage unit must feel terrible.
I imagine she has snuck out before to get a soda or candy and maybe to call her boyfriend, and it has always been short and sweet. The fact that she was hiding, I feel, means she knew she was in danger.
Why didn't she go into the store and just stay there? Maybe the next shift would have been more alert and noticed she was hovering.
There are no links; it's just my ponderings. It is just so sad.

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

Honestly,
I earlier doubted it was them as there were clear cctv pictures - in colour even!!!
for Goodness' sake,
there was a witness - a shop assistant.

They handed themselves to Police on a silver platter.
Not only monstrous but so stupid.
Didn't they realise they were being recorded???

RBBM
I think that was their mistake. I honestly do not believe they realized they were being recorded.
Their mistake was an excellent clue for justice.

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

I just don't get it. What causes a person to do things like this? To pick someone at random, assault them, and then murder them? What is the motivation? Just a complete lack of control over urges?

I think cases like these disturb me more because they just seem so random. "At least" with serial killers some kind of logic can be made out with their pre-planning and habits. No less awful, to be sure, but I really don't understand these truly senseless crimes.

Piggybacking off your excellent points, I wonder how much and WHAT they drank at the restaurant. I am in no way excusing them for being drunk; I just think that the motivation could be, like you mentioned, a lack of control over urges also fuelled by alcohol and an encouraging 'friend.'

 

[Tricia]

Dear Websleuths Members,
Illegal immigration is not the topic of this discussion. If we allowed it to be discussed, this thread would flame out in seconds. Please stick to the facts of the case and please stop with the politicizing.
Tricia

 

[Angelcat13]

I just don't get it. What causes a person to do things like this? To pick someone at random, assault them, and then murder them? What is the motivation? Just a complete lack of control over urges?

I think cases like these disturb me more because they just seem so random. "At least" with serial killers some kind of logic can be made out with their pre-planning and habits. No less awful, to be sure, but I really don't understand these truly senseless crimes.

IMO - these two are either already serial killers or serial killers in the making.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

One of the suspects tried to jump off a balcony and escape before officers caught him, a neighbor told CBS affiliate KHOU-TV.

The medical examiner has determined that her cause of death was strangulation.

It was unclear if the two suspects had attorneys yet to speak on their behalf. Their names were not listed in jail or court records as of Thursday afternoon.

Arrests made after 12-year-old Houston girl found dead in creek; one suspect allegedly tried to escape off balcony

The two men were seen on surveillance footage with Jocelyn Nungaray before her body was found in a Houston creek.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[sunflowermomma]

Did one of the POIs cut the ankle bracelet off on Wednesday the 12th or the 19th?

My only knowledge of ankle monitors is from tv/movies...aren't the police notified if it is tampered with or removed?

 

[Occam's Zebra]

I'm glad they have suspects in custody. MOO they look nothing like the CCTV footage so I appreciate there was a witness able to provide more information.

 

[Cryptic]

I just don't get it. What causes a person to do things like this?

Though I dont think anybody has an answer, But.... In this case, the crime was perpetrated by people.

As with mob violence, sometimes two or more perpetrators can "feed off" each other both before and during the crime by bringing out the worst in each other. Likewise, two or more perpetrators can lead to actions intended not just to advance the crime, but also to "impress" the other partner(s).

Sometimes the totality of partnering creates an environment where as individuals, the men (well, usually its men) are simply criminal in a variety of ways- but only turn murderous when committing crimes together.

As a side note...

For what its worth, Father Malachi Martin observed that when two willfully evil people (his theologically based description of psychopathic behavior) commit crimes together, one person will be the dominate partner. This dominance maybe slight or noticeable, but it will exist.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

*facing Texas death penalty.