TX - Nichol Olsen, 37, & her 2 daughters found shot dead inside mansion, Bexar County, 10 Jan 2019

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NO’s father died before her mother? I don’t remember seeing anything about him.
 
MathildaM said:
Consider this, take out it being NO who is suspected of murdering her kids and replace her with 'Katie'.

Katie gets pregnant at 14 / 15 (could have been consensual, could have not, we don't know), decides to have the baby and gets married. The marriage doesn't last long. Around this time her mother dies, father has already died and Katie is looking after her younger brother. Katie meets a new man and gets married and has another child (there is around 5-6 yrs difference in age btwn the kids, probably not unusual for second relationships). This 2nd husband 16 years later speaks highly of her, despite the relationship not lasting and the pressure of parent’s death, young children, brother etc... Katie still has a close relationship with her brother who speaks highly of how she supported him. Katie has trained as a hairdresser, earned cosmetology accreditation(s) and pulled herself up out of being a presumably, uneducated teenage mother. Her first child, the one she had at 15, is at college. Katie has a large group of loyal friends, seems to be successfully self-employed and generally seen as a really nice person.

I might have some of the timelines and examples wrong, and I haven't dragged out the Katie story to include a 3rd child but I just want to highlight there are many flags of positivity, success and determination on how NO lived her life. Having 3 kids to 3 fathers is not necessarily a reason to judge. Maybe she was a romantic idealist with poor taste in men? We don't know that at 16 she was messed up and severely depressed. Can we please all recognise the fact that she achieved an education / trade, provided a stable / supportive environment to enable her first child to get to college and all the photos and videos of AM and LB show two young girls who look happy, loved and loving.

I'm not at all defending her actions if she did what is presumed, I feel as emotionally devastated as you do about this case, but can we balance how we examine and dissect her life?
Click to expand...

What if we substitute
MathildaM said:
Consider this, take out it being NO who is suspected of murdering her kids and replace her with 'Katie'.

Katie gets pregnant at 14 / 15 (could have been consensual, could have not, we don't know), decides to have the baby and gets married. The marriage doesn't last long. Around this time her mother dies, father has already died and Katie is looking after her younger brother. Katie meets a new man and gets married and has another child (there is around 5-6 yrs difference in age btwn the kids, probably not unusual for second relationships). This 2nd husband 16 years later speaks highly of her, despite the relationship not lasting and the pressure of parent’s death, young children, brother etc... Katie still has a close relationship with her brother who speaks highly of how she supported him. Katie has trained as a hairdresser, earned cosmetology accreditation(s) and pulled herself up out of being a presumably, uneducated teenage mother. Her first child, the one she had at 15, is at college. Katie has a large group of loyal friends, seems to be successfully self-employed and generally seen as a really nice person.

I might have some of the timelines and examples wrong, and I haven't dragged out the Katie story to include a 3rd child but I just want to highlight there are many flags of positivity, success and determination on how NO lived her life. Having 3 kids to 3 fathers is not necessarily a reason to judge. Maybe she was a romantic idealist with poor taste in men? We don't know that at 16 she was messed up and severely depressed. Can we please all recognise the fact that she achieved an education / trade, provided a stable / supportive environment to enable her first child to get to college and all the photos and videos of AM and LB show two young girls who look happy, loved and loving.

I'm not at all defending her actions if she did what is presumed, I feel as emotionally devastated as you do about this case, but can we balance how we examine and dissect her life?
Click to expand...

The problem with that is it's a very surface-level, one-sided, airbrushed picture of a life, that leaves out many legal issues (custody, dv, very close relatives, etc). There is another side to her evidenced by her suicide and the likelihood she killed her daughters. It's important to note she likely killed her daughters , pending official sheriff statement. We're not hearing from those who may be able to paint a different picture of her life, either due to legal advice or simply not wanting to speak ill of the dead.
 
At the present time, we are left with the ME’s ruling that this truly tragic case is M/S. I am puzzled why it is taking so long for the Sheriff to formally accept these findings, but maybe there is no formal process to that end. Maybe to avoid stirring emotions further the Sheriff is not required to publically “accept” them, and thus never does. Unfortunately that only keeps the controversy flamed with no closure in the public eye. Even WITH a formal statement from the Sheriff, LE is certainly aware of the difficulty family and friends have coming to terms with such a horrific scenario. They may never be able to bring themselves to believe it. We have several cases like this on WS, with Rebecca Zahau being one of the highest profile ones. My point is that I do not think there will ever be a definitive ruling in this sad case that will allow everyone involved to come to peace about it. Suicide does that to the survivors, and I imagine it is compounded tenfold when innocent children are caught up in the awful drama. The Christy Sheets case, also in TX, is similar. Christy shot her daughter’s to death with witnesses around so there was no doubt who had killed them. And she basically committed suicide-by-cop. But the pain and turmoil in her life that caused her to do this is unimaginable to most. I think without witnesses or LE involvement that case could have played out like this one, with those closest having a very difficult time with denial.
 
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MyBelle said:
It's the ME who determined suicide/homicide. I believe the same ME is used by both LE agencies.

I don't have any problem in the fund-raising as long as it legitimately goes to things such as another autopsy and does not just go into somebody's pocket because they decided to exploit this tragedy for their own profit.

JMO
Click to expand...

I would assume the ME works with info gathered by the BCSO too, correct? They don’t literally JUST rely on the body? When I say people in the community don’t trust the BCSO, it is a real problem, long before this particular case. I absolutely would want a second autopsy by an independent ME. Hopefully that is possible with an active investigation going on.

My sense from living in the area and knowing some of the people who knew her and her girls is that people truly want answers, so I don’t believe the person who set this fundraiser page up is looking to make off with extra cash in their pocket. There’s a sense of... desperation, to have answers and feel like it’s a fair investigation instead of possibly a huge cover up.
 
yeah, not too hard. with the revolver though the hammer usually needs to be cocked, pulled back, prior to first shot. although some older ones require it for each shot, hence in the cowboy movies you see the one hand "fanning" of the hammer.
 
nightowl1975 said:
I would assume the ME works with info gathered by the BCSO too, correct? They don’t literally JUST rely on the body? When I say people in the community don’t trust the BCSO, it is a real problem, long before this particular case. I absolutely would want a second autopsy by an independent ME. Hopefully that is possible with an active investigation going on.

My sense from living in the area and knowing some of the people who knew her and her girls is that people truly want answers, so I don’t believe the person who set this fundraiser page up is looking to make off with extra cash in their pocket. There’s a sense of... desperation, to have answers and feel like it’s a fair investigation instead of possibly a huge cover up.
Click to expand...
The ME looks at all available evidence, including crime scene photos, police reports, etc.

As I've said before, it is very common for a preliminary death certificate to be issued with manner of death "pending.". If the ME was at all unsure, he would have done this instead of declaring it a suicide. With the issuance of the final death certificate and determination of suicide, I'm sure the ME was confident in his conclusion.
 
<modsnip - quoted post removed>

Honestly, I can see both sides of the case. Can see it being MS and can also see it a triple murder, which is probably unpopular.

At the very least, it seems that LE is looking at everything, so however it’s ruled, no one can say it wasn’t investigated.<modsnip - rumor>
 
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Sadly I do believe this is a murder suicide.

It's not the first time by any means where mothers have murdered their children nor will it be the last.

Other mothers have killed their children then unsuccessfully tried to commit suicide.

This one was successful while many others were not and stood trial for their violent acts that took the lives of their own children.

I wish she too had lived so her children could receive justice for what she has done. Seems she took the easy way out.

I will never understand anyone who murders their own children whether they try to commit suicide or not afterwards. It seems such a self absorbed violent act to even be capable of doing such horrific violence..

Why not just commit suicide if they choose to do so rather than deciding the children are going to be murdered in cold blood first?

Are they so egotistical thinking the children cant live without them? If so that is so ridiculous with grandiose thinking imo.

Many children have lost a parent while young yet had love ones who supported them and they went on to have a productive and meaningful life..

These precious children should have had a choice and I have no doubt if they had been given a choice they would have chosen to live life like they deserved rather than being murdered by their own mother.

She had no right to make choices for her children. None at all. It reminds me of when some mothers say to their children... they brought them into this world and they cant take them out.

Its painfully obvious this mother was of the same mindset as if they belonged to her as if they were a luggage bag or some other kind of material possession they owned.

Its heart shattering to read every case involving mothers or fathers who murdered their own children.

It shouldn't ever happen to any child or children but it does and it will happen again in the future.

Imo
 
<modsnip - quoted post removed>
I have no evidence the FBI is involved, but there are circumstances when they would have jurisdiction such as murder for hire, murders related to drug trafficking or child sexual exploitation, etc. If the local LE is not equipped or feels the FBI could help, they can request help and the federal agency can accept or decline that request. I’m sure the BCSO is aware of mistrust in the community and as this case becomes more high-profile, it seems like a prudent move to ask for any assistance that will improve confidence in the final rulings. MOO

https://www.wklaw.com/10-ways-murder-becomes-a-federal-crime/
 
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What may a big factor delaying the final reports:

"...How long does it take get forensic toxicology test results?
Popular “crime scene investigation” television programs are able to complete toxicology reports in a very short (and unrealistic) time frame. However, in reality, while an autopsy is usually completed within a day or two after a death, the final results of the toxicology report may take four to six weeks or longer."

Toxicology Tests & Reports
 
MathildaM said:
Consider this, take out it being NO who is suspected of murdering her kids and replace her with 'Katie'.

Katie gets pregnant at 14 / 15 (could have been consensual, could have not, we don't know), decides to have the baby and gets married. The marriage doesn't last long. Around this time her mother dies, father has already died and Katie is looking after her younger brother. Katie meets a new man and gets married and has another child (there is around 5-6 yrs difference in age btwn the kids, probably not unusual for second relationships). This 2nd husband 16 years later speaks highly of her, despite the relationship not lasting and the pressure of parent’s death, young children, brother etc... Katie still has a close relationship with her brother who speaks highly of how she supported him. Katie has trained as a hairdresser, earned cosmetology accreditation(s) and pulled herself up out of being a presumably, uneducated teenage mother. Her first child, the one she had at 15, is at college. Katie has a large group of loyal friends, seems to be successfully self-employed and generally seen as a really nice person.

I might have some of the timelines and examples wrong, and I haven't dragged out the Katie story to include a 3rd child but I just want to highlight there are many flags of positivity, success and determination on how NO lived her life. Having 3 kids to 3 fathers is not necessarily a reason to judge. Maybe she was a romantic idealist with poor taste in men? We don't know that at 16 she was messed up and severely depressed. Can we please all recognise the fact that she achieved an education / trade, provided a stable / supportive environment to enable her first child to get to college and all the photos and videos of AM and LB show two young girls who look happy, loved and loving.

I'm not at all defending her actions if she did what is presumed, I feel as emotionally devastated as you do about this case, but can we balance how we examine and dissect her life?
Click to expand...

Sure! However, nothing is being dissected differently than any other case we discuss. This seems rather tame, imo.
I’ve refrained from adding a few links, for info I’ve found. Perhaps another person will post them, once they run across them.

I’m a “realist”, all the way. Things are what they are, not what I or someone wants them to be.
Moo
 
<modsnip - quoted post removed>
Private citizens in the Berreth murder case called the ID FBI. I’m in KY. If a person calls the FBI regarding info on a crime, they respond. People complaining or unhappy with local LE contact FBI. I see crime news in my local paper, “Jayne Doe has contacted fBI due to.......regarding the case of.......currently being investigated by.........”
FBI works for Us, the people. Not all FBI agents are working internationally or huge
money laundering/drug schemes like in the movies.

Contact Us

Please contact your local FBI office to submit a tip or report a crime. Use our ... contributors. The FBI has offices around the world and can be contacted around the clock, every day of the year.
 
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Trudie said:
Private citizens in the Berreth murder case called the ID FBI. I’m in KY. If a person calls the FBI regarding info on a crime, they respond. People complaining or unhappy with local LE contact FBI. I see crime news in my local paper, “Jayne Doe has contacted fBI due to.......regarding the case of.......currently being investigated by.........”
FBI works for Us, the people. Not all FBI agents are working internationally or huge
money laundering/drug schemes like in the movies.

Contact Us

Please contact your local FBI office to submit a tip or report a crime. Use our ... contributors. The FBI has offices around the world and can be contacted around the clock, every day of the year.
Click to expand...

Calling the FBI and calling in the FBI are very different things.
 
<modsnip - quoted post removed>

Some investigations lead to the unearthing of entirely different crime rings. It’ll be interesting to see if things get “unearthed” here. MOO. Not implying or suggesting, only thinking.

<modsnip - rumor>
 
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i think there has to be a specific type of crime for the fbi to enter the picture. as far as KB case it might have been kidnapping or transportation of body across state lines. mostly, some type of federal crime. the NO case does not seem to me to have this unless someone is claiming local LE is engaged in some type of cover-up or something to that effect.
 
dkryder said:
i think there has to be a specific type of crime for the fbi to enter the picture. as far as KB case it might have been kidnapping or transportation of body across state lines. mostly, some type of federal crime. the NO case does not seem to me to have this unless someone is claiming local LE is engaged in some type of cover-up or something to that effect.
Click to expand...
If someone suspects murder for hire, it would likely involve communications via telephone, mail or internet which are federally regulated utility. That is always an entry point for the FBI if they feel it necessary to become involved. I’m not suggesting that murder-for-hire has ever been brought up, but it did cross my mind.

https://www.wklaw.com/10-ways-murder-becomes-a-federal-crime/

“Murder for Hire (18 U.S.C. Section 1958)
Why is murder-for-hire potentially a federal crime? Congress has legal jurisdiction over interstate commerce. Interstate commerce includes not only the paths that people can travel between states, but also the use of communication pathways such as the postal service, telephone lines, cellular towers, and other electronic communication.

If the killing can only be accomplished by causing a person to travel over state lines (including the victim), or by communicating the request by phone, mail, or the Internet, the murder-for-hire could be a federal crime.”
 
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