TX - Zuzu Verk, 22, Alpine, 12 Oct 2016 #2

[Gardener1850]

Trying to scrub blood stains out of a mattress would make the bed shake too.. A mattress being taken down stairs could cause a thump too. And I think would fit in the back of a Ford F-150. Just putting that out there.

*Thinking about LE taking a big interest in the laundry room - makes me think 'blood'

Or urine--if he choked her to death in the bed. I also wonder if he could have washed her clothes and then forgot about them. They asked the neighbor lady if any of the clothes were hers.

 

[SavetheQueen]

She is 5 feet tall and 110 pounds. I don't know his height but he worked out at a gym and "liked" a bunch of weight lifting groups on fb.
IMO, he could move her easily and the neighbor may have only seen him getting into his car after he put her in the back seat/trunk area.

ETA: I believe the stair area he was on is inside and may not be a shared entrance, so the neighbor may not have seen him on the stairs.

My understanding that he's 200 pounds-ish.

*All statements are that of my own opinion unless otherwise specified. *

 

[kuriouser]

The only weird thing about this scenario is that one would think if the neighbor heard the stair thump then looked out, they would see RF carrying her out in whatever she was in and not just see RF leaving. I wouldn't think he would move very fast carrying her body. So awful.
Has it been discussed RF's size compared to Zuzu?

He said his gf heard a thump and asked him to go check. It could have been the thump of his car door, parking is very close to the house and the neighbor lives on the bottom floor. Or the thump of the door to the house closing. Maybe the screen door has a spring and slammed shut? If RF had to carry her out, he may have done it before whatever caused the thump sound.

After a person dies, the muscles relax and internal waste is excreted (to be blunt, pee and poo). Rigor mortis (stiffening) can happen in a couple of hours. If she were deceased and he left her in his apartment for very long, would he have been smart enough to put her in a position that would be easily movable after rigor mortis sets in? Would he have thought ahead to put her somewhere where he could thoroughly remove traces of waste later? I suspect he didn't consider those things and just got lucky by moving her out right away.

Or she may have been alive when he moved her. What if he gave her some rohypnol (roofie)? Too much could put her into a coma (as well as kill her). Had he realized she was unconscious, the 2am bed shaking could have been an attempt to wake her. Or she could have been having convulsions. If he had drugged her into unconsciousness, he wouldn't want to call 911. Probably wouldn't want to just keep her at his place and see what happens, either.

 

[kuriouser]

Or urine--if he choked her to death in the bed. I also wonder if he could have washed her clothes and then forgot about them. They asked the neighbor lady if any of the clothes were hers.

But it was a whole week between the night Zuzu was at RF's apartment and when the police searched it. If RF had washed anything he thought might be suspicious (instead of just destroying it)...he would have just left it in the shared laundry room? Why even use that laundry room?! Go to the laundromat.

 

[sunsetbeach]

Didn't the neighbor say he wasn't suppose to give details about what he heard/saw as a curtesy to LE? Why is he talking now?

Maybe APD ok'd it (behind the scenes) to put the squeeze on RF?

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[ToodieWorm]

He said his gf heard a thump and asked him to go check. It could have been the thump of his car door, parking is very close to the house and the neighbor lives on the bottom floor. Or the thump of the door to the house closing. Maybe the screen door has a spring and slammed shut? If RF had to carry her out, he may have done it before whatever caused the thump sound.

After a person dies, the muscles relax and internal waste is excreted (to be blunt, pee and poo). Rigor mortis (stiffening) can happen in a couple of hours. If she were deceased and he left her in his apartment for very long, would he have been smart enough to put her in a position that would be easily movable after rigor mortis sets in? Would he have thought ahead to put her somewhere where he could thoroughly remove traces of waste later? I suspect he didn't consider those things and just got lucky by moving her out right away.

Or she may have been alive when he moved her. What if he gave her some rohypnol (roofie)? Too much could put her into a coma (as well as kill her). Had he realized she was unconscious, the 2am bed shaking could have been an attempt to wake her. Or she could have been having convulsions. If he had drugged her into unconsciousness, he wouldn't want to call 911. Probably wouldn't want to just keep her at his place and see what happens, either.

Considering that I believe this was a crime of passion and not well thought out...No, I don't believe the lay person would know about rigor mortis timeframes or what happens to a person after they die and/or posing a body before this sets in to be able to put them into an object to carry. I don't think he even considered this at all.
I totally agree with your last paragraph! Although I don't think he drugged her. I think he got angry with her and killed her and then realized what he had done and tried to "fix" it by waking her up/shaking her.

 

[kuriouser]

I'm not sold on RF drugging her, either. My reason for suspecting rohypnol stems from his job as a pharmacy tech and their on/off relationship. Maybe Zuzu had wanted to be "just friends" (no sex). She could have come over to hang out for dinner and he was jealous of her potentially seeing other people...and had other plans for her that night.

If it was rage/violence, it was pretty quiet and quick (smothering, strangling). The neighbor would have definitely heard a struggle. Even a quick blow to the head would risk blood on the hardwood floors.

 

[ToodieWorm]

I'm not sold on RF drugging her, either. My reason for suspecting rohypnol stems from his job as a pharmacy tech and their on/off relationship. Maybe Zuzu had wanted to be "just friends" (no sex). She could have come over to hang out for dinner and he was jealous of her potentially seeing other people...and had other plans for her that night.

If it was rage/violence, it was pretty quiet and quick (smothering, strangling). The neighbor would have definitely heard a struggle. Even a quick blow to the head would risk blood on the hardwood floors.

Agreed on the second paragraph. I don't think he thought this through at all though.

 

[Steleheart]

Or urine--if he choked her to death in the bed. I also wonder if he could have washed her clothes and then forgot about them. They asked the neighbor lady if any of the clothes were hers.

BBM:
Do you have a link to that? I would love to read it. TIA

 

[Gardener1850]

BBM:
Do you have a link to that? I would love to read it. TIA

"They took me into the laundry room and asked me if any of the clothes were mine and did I recognize any of the other clothing and I said 'no, none of them were mine and I didn't recognize any of them," said Bloomer.


Bloomer is still puzzled as to why investigators dedicated so many resources to the laundry room.



"It was just interesting to watch the CSI team that came in," Bloomer said. "They seemed really focused on the laundry room. They've had dogs in there and it's not a big laundry room by any stretch."

http://www.yourbasin.com/news/zuzus...vily-on-laundry-room-in-his-apartment-complex

 

[Steleheart]

http://www.yourbasin.com/news/zuzus...vily-on-laundry-room-in-his-apartment-complex

Thanks so much! So from that, having dogs in the laundry room you can bet they were looking for clothing, either his or hers that were washed to remove evidence.
Plus, if I have the facts correct he used the Mustang and the Pick-up truck. You can move a body in a car. The truck would be needed for a mattress, IMO.
If LE noticed a missing mattress /box spring they would know to look for clothing and evidence in the drains.

 

[NewMama]

On another note, CBS 7 has obtained four redacted search warrants. I have attached two of the four warrants. The other two will be uploaded later but this will give you something to chew on until they are.

A big Thank you to CBS7
http://www.cbs7.com/

Interesting. The Verizon warrant says ZuZu's phone hadn't had service since 6:30am Wed. RF told police he last spoke to ZuZu Wednesday. I wonder what time he said he talked to her? Perhaps he slipped up not knowing/remembering exactly when her service went off?


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[Philigumbo]

I've read some of the details, and given the circumstances regarding Zuzu's dissapearance, I believe she may be deceased. I really hope I'm wrong and that she's hiding from her boyfriend.

Sadly, I don't believe she's hiding...

 

[skibaboo]

Interesting. The Verizon warrant says ZuZu's phone hadn't had service since 6:30am Wed. RF told police he last spoke to ZuZu Wednesday. I wonder what time he said he talked to her? Perhaps he slipped up not knowing/remembering exactly when her service went off?


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He told LE he last saw her between 3 am and 4 am Wed. It's on the warrant

 

[Philigumbo]

He told LE he last saw her between 3 am and 4 am Wed. It's on the warrant

OT, Skibaboo, but I read you Mr. Skibaboo thread last night. I'm so sorry for your loss of your best friend and beloved. Thank you for sharing and hugs from Texas.

 

[NewMama]

He told LE he last saw her between 3 am and 4 am Wed. It's on the warrant

I vaguely remember reading that. This warrant says "last spoke" with ZuZu. So I'm wondering if there was a last spoke to vs a last seen. Does that make sense?


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[skibaboo]

OT, Skibaboo, but I read you Mr. Skibaboo thread last night. I'm so sorry for your loss of your best friend and beloved. Thank you for sharing and hugs from Texas.

Thank you xx

 

[GigTu]

“You could hear him moving their stuff around, playing music, and then she (Zuzu) shows up,” said John Franco, who lives in the apartment below Robert. “They make dinner like at 9 p.m. or 10 p.m., you could smell their food, and you can hear their conversation and then laugh a little bit. Then, it got quiet like after 11 p.m."

That silence didn't last long.

"We just heard one, like you know, shut the ‘F’ up and that was it," Franco said.

At around two that Wednesday morning, Franco heard Robert’s bed shake multiple times.

"We can hear him pacing back and forth, like all over the house,” Franco said. “Maybe around 3 o'clock in the morning, we hear him jump in the shower."

Then, one hour later Franco's girlfriend hears a loud thump and quickly wakes him up.

"She wanted me to go check, so I went to go check, and it was just Robert,” Franco said. “Robert was leaving, but his girlfriend's car was still parked out there."

Neither Franco nor his girlfriend saw Zuzu leave and say her car was gone by Friday -- the day police began their investigation into her disappearance.

I stand corrected. It is not clear from this interview when the STFU occurred but this makes it sound like it happened after some short time of quiet:

http://www.cbs7.com/content/news/Ne...rd-the-night-Zuzu-disappeared--398978991.html

It would be very interesting to know what kind of a drinker, and drunk he was. Was he amorous, angry, or happy when drinking? My money's on hostile. I also wonder if he took steroids?

On his FB account, there is a pic of him taking a selfie in a bathroom mirror (from 2014) and one of the comments is "is that the drug bathroom?", which indicates that drug use is not foreign to him.

All that because I was trying to play out a scenario that might make sense. It sure sounds like not too much time passed between the cooking, eating and laughing and the 11pm silence. I can see the following happening:

Is it possible that they ate, both got a little drunk and fell asleep by 11pm? Zuzu probably didn't need much alcohol since she was small and probably got drunk easily. And there was no mention of them having sex, which is actually very surprising, but fits into my scenario if they had drank too much. Anyway, maybe a little bit later Zuzu woke him up and it irritated him, so when the neighbor heard STFU, RF also held a pillow over her face (or something like his arm) at that moment, then fell back asleep. Maybe he then awoke again at 2am, realized she wasn't breathing so shook her to wake her up, and freaked from there.

Maybe in a drunken state he did these really stupid things that resulted in her accidental death. Not making excuses, just trying to figure it out.

Also, somewhere I read that he had called CE twice and snapchatted him once all in a very short timespan around 3:00am. I can't find that link now. But if so, the only times that make sense for CE to tell his friend he couldn't get blamed for anything had to occur at 1:00pm later that day, or 1:00am later that night (which is technically the next day).

 

[Gardener1850]

It would be very interesting to know what kind of a drinker, and drunk he was. Was he amorous, angry, or happy when drinking? My money's on hostile. I also wonder if he took steroids?

On his FB account, there is a pic of him taking a selfie in a bathroom mirror (from 2014) and one of the comments is "is that the drug bathroom?", which indicates that drug use is not foreign to him.

All that because I was trying to play out a scenario that might make sense. It sure sounds like not too much time passed between the cooking, eating and laughing and the 11pm silence. I can see the following happening:

Is it possible that they ate, both got a little drunk and fell asleep by 11pm? Zuzu probably didn't need much alcohol since she was small and probably got drunk easily. And there was no mention of them having sex, which is actually very surprising, but fits into my scenario if they had drank too much. Anyway, maybe a little bit later Zuzu woke him up and it irritated him, so when the neighbor heard STFU, RF also held a pillow over her face (or something like his arm) at that moment, then fell back asleep. Maybe he then awoke again at 2am, realized she wasn't breathing so shook her to wake her up, and freaked from there.

Maybe in a drunken state he did these really stupid things that resulted in her accidental death. Not making excuses, just trying to figure it out.

Also, somewhere I read that he had called CE twice and snapchatted him once all in a very short timespan around 3:00am. I can't find that link now. But if so, the only times that make sense for CE to tell his friend he couldn't get blamed for anything had to occur at 1:00pm later that day, or 1:00am later that night (which is technically the next day).

BBM. I think they were asking if he was in the bathroom of the drug store he works in. JMO.
Everything else you said could be true though. When we first heard he lawyer-ed up I thought possibly he was not involved in Zuzu going missing but his alibi involved drugs and he didn't want to talk about it. Now we know just a little of what the neighbors heard it seems less likely he is innocent, IMO.

 

[Coquette]

If the account is verified as Estrada’s; Then I'm sure we can mention what he is stating in regards to this case that he is a poi in.

Especially since it is public statements by him . Idk

So cant we just link to his actual comments on FB?

The mods have made it very clear we cannot quote, refer to or list screen shots of comments by CE. I know this because my posts were removed inquiring about this and in the previous thread they made an announcement about it.