UK UK - Andrew Gosden, 14, Doncaster, South Yorks, 14 Sept 2007

[Farley]

Great first post, Farley, and welcome!!

I agree with much of what you have said, it all makes the most sense. He would have taken all his savings money (left in his room) if he was running away, so with that and the one way ticket the clues suggest he was planning to come back soon. I agree someone he trusted has enticed him down there and I wouldn't be surprised if it was planned 2 weeks in advance.

So was he sold / drugged / exploited for some nefarious purpose?
Did the other person try it on with him and there was a fight in which Andrew died?

It seems unlikely he's alive and well, sadly. Thanks for looking into this case, every now and then we need a good refresh!!

PS see my sig link below for other UK cases.

Thank you!

For some reason Andrew's story has really touched me. I just hope against hope that his family get some answers. Any answers.

No, he must have planned it but I was more wondering how the person who made the video was able to make that claim. What evidence is it based on? I've not seen it mentioned anywhere else that it was known he planned the trip.

I would absolutely love to think Andrew is alive and well somewhere but sadly I don't think that is likely.

As awful as it may sound I hope whatever happened happened quickly. I would absolutely hate to think he was being held captive against his will for any length of time. Or that he suffered.

I still think it is someone known to the family. I have no idea what they had planned once they got so London (more I don't want to think about it) but I think Andrew very quickly found out that all wasn't what it was supposed to be.

It's coming up to nine years since Andrew's disappearance. It angers me that someone out there knows exactly what happened and how. Yet has left Andrew's family in hell.

 

[MrAdamJames]

I had remembered reading that Andrew chose to walk home from school, instead of taking the bus, on two occasions and that the bus journey was four miles. I just found this interesting because he had always got the bus but twice (I believe it was the two days leading up to his disappearance) he decided to walk instead.

I completely agree with Farley's theory that Andrew had met up with someone he personally knew, and what better time to talk to that person and arrange to meet up than walking home from school. That would really be one of the only times the person could arrange the meetup with Andrew, because I remember reading that Andrew spent most of his time indoors and hardly ever hung out with friends outside of school.

I was able to find the article online that this was mentioned in, but it said you have to Subscribe to the Times to read the full article. I'll leave a link to the article anyway, but I'll also post the quote from the article: "Looking in vain for an explanation, the family wonder why Andrew twice chose to break his normal routine, walking home from school instead of making the four-mile journey by bus."

http://http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/life/families/article1757703.ece

 

[Farley]

I had remembered reading that Andrew chose to walk home from school, instead of taking the bus, on two occasions and that the bus journey was four miles. I just found this interesting because he had always got the bus but twice (I believe it was the two days leading up to his disappearance) he decided to walk instead.

I completely agree with Farley's theory that Andrew had met up with someone he personally knew, and what better time to talk to that person and arrange to meet up than walking home from school. That would really be one of the only times the person could arrange the meetup with Andrew, because I remember reading that Andrew spent most of his time indoors and hardly ever hung out with friends outside of school.

I was able to find the article online that this was mentioned in, but it said you have to Subscribe to the Times to read the full article. I'll leave a link to the article anyway, but I'll also post the quote from the article: "Looking in vain for an explanation, the family wonder why Andrew twice chose to break his normal routine, walking home from school instead of making the four-mile journey by bus."

http://http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/life/families/article1757703.ece

Wow. That's interesting (couldn't read the whole article as you have to pay to subscribe).

I wonder if the police ever looked into that. Given how badly they've handled the case to be honest I would be surprised if they have done. But it seems a massive coincidence for Andrew to change his routine like that twice then of he goes to London. Are they absolutely sure he wasn't being bullied?

I don't think that's 'looking in vain' at all. I think that's sensible. The police should have done some door to door around the town, asked the school kids and anyone else if they saw Andrew with anyone at all during the times he decided to walk home.

 

[shadowdancer]

The walking home thing is very interesting indeed. It raises all sorts of questions.

1) What time did Andrew arrive home after walking home (if he took a very long time, then he might have gone somewhere/met someone somewhere on the way home)?

2) Are they completely sure that he walked home? Could he have gone somewhere or met someone and then took a later bus and said he walked to explain away his lateness?

3) Could he have had his bus money taken off him by bullies?

 

[Farley]

The walking home thing is very interesting indeed. It raises all sorts of questions.

1) What time did Andrew arrive home after walking home (if he took a very long time, then he might have gone somewhere/met someone somewhere on the way home)?

2) Are they completely sure that he walked home? Could he have gone somewhere or met someone and then took a later bus and said he walked to explain away his lateness?

3) Could he have had his bus money taken off him by bullies?

I did read a thread (possibly on Reddit can't remember exactly) that had a screen shot from a news article. It was not long after Andrew had disappeared so has long since been taken town.

But the comments section was very interesting. Some of Andrew's school fruends had commented that he was actually being quite badly bullied at school (the article claimed he wasn't being bullied to anyone's knowledge).

I'm not sure how recent they came in but my best friends 14 year old daughter has a child's bus pass as it's a lot cheaper than paying every day. So if it was a regular trip I'd have thought most kids would have had the same?

But if not maybe his bus money had been taken by bullies or maybe be just didn't want to get on the bus with them. But then you'd just wait for the next bus wouldn't you not walk 4 miles home.

I just think it's really strange that he does something out of character twice in the few weeks before he dissapeared.

Maybe he was confiding in someone about the bullying and sadly for Andrew he picked the wrong person. Or maybe it has nothing to do with it at all.

 

[ekardh]

Great first post, Farley!

There's an article on a Doncaster news website that mentions a sighting of Andrew at Pizza Hut. The link has expired but courtesy of Google cache:

MISSING teenager Andrew Gosden has been spotted in the South Bank area of London, his father said today. Andrew, 14, failed to go to school on Friday and was then spotted getting on a train to the capital.

Today his father Kevin said there had been several sightings of his son in an area of the capital that he knows well. "He's safe and well. I am hoping it is just a waiting game now," said Kevin Gosden of Littlemoor Lane, Balby.

Andrew had around 300 with him - some of which he appears to have spent on warmer clothes - and Mr Gosden is hoping that once his money runs out Andrew will return home.

Andrew was spotted in Pizza Hut on Oxford Street on Monday, sleeping in a park in Southwark the following day and getting off a local train in the Waterloo area this morning.

Andrew's mum Glenys and sister Charlotte are in London - where they have family and friends - looking for Andrew.

Andrew's disappearance is still mystifying his parents. Mr Gosden said: "He's the kind of boy who leavves you a note if he goes to the corner shop."

One theory was that Andrew, a gifted student, had decided to take in some of the museums in London.

Mr Gosden praised the police for their help and support since Andrew went missing.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Great find Ekardh - I hadn't heard of any of these sightings but given its come from his dad it lends credibility, and if true it changes things significantly. So that's almost a week of Andrew being alive and well (but sleeping rough?) after leaving home. Maybe he DID intend to go after all. Just so, so weird.

 

[ekardh]

Eyewitnesses need to be taken with a truckload of salt, of course. We have no idea how reliable those sightings were, and it would be understandable for the parents to cling to the hope that he was still alive and well.

 

[Farley]

I had read that article. But didn't really take it as written because non of those sightings are on the web page run my Andrew's father.
Perhaps they were found to be false etc.

I think if they were confirmed 100% then they'd be on the site as it really does change things a lot. But I go back to my earlier thinking of if he was running away why didn't he take all the money available to him?

It's for that reason that I tend to take them with a pinch of salt.

The amount he had also changes a lot. Some reports say he had £200 some say £300 some say he drained his account. Others say he withdrew £250 (implying there was more in there) etc.

£200 minus the price of a train ticket wouldn't get you very far in London would it. I know we don't know what goes on behind closed doors but Andrew's family will have been under a lot of scrutiny by the police when Andrew first vanished so I think if anything was less than normal it would have come out. So I would say they're your average loving family and I just can't conceive that a bright 14 year old boy would find the thought of living rough in London preferable to his perfectly lovely home life with parents who love and support him. I just can't believe that.

 

[alreetlike]

I've never heard of any of those sightings before. Also, it's a bit sad to think that a young lad was seen sleeping in a park and nothing done to help. I suspect the sightings may have been investigated and ruled out which is why we've never heard more about them in the coverage since.

If he did feel like taking off for an adventure and sleeping rough, I would think he'd have some sort of knowledge that there are places where his money would go further than London.

 

[shadowdancer]

My head says that Andrew is more likely to be dead, but my heart (and my friend's possible sighting) says that he is alive.

I had a thought just now - If the Gosdens (or anyone else) go searching for Andrew in London again, it would be worth signing up to the dating apps that rely on location data to give matches. They could use filters to only give matches that fit Andrew's age. They should use both Gay and Hetrosexual apps. Its a long shot, but you never know...

I still very much get the vibe that Andrew was a worrier, who 'felt' things very deeply. This could have led him to have a great deal of anxiety and even possibly depression. If he really was being bullied and/or struggling with his sexuality, then maybe he just couldn't cope anymore. He may have got himself into a state of mind where he was convinced (wrongly) that his parents would be disappointed with him and disapprove of the life choices he wanted to make.

I don't feel that we can rule out him running away based upon leaving some of his money behind and not taking his clothes. He was a very clever boy, and gifted at mathematics (a sign of an analytical and logical mind). He would have known that taking all of the money and his clothing would leave too much of a trial (by confirming that he was a runaway and still alive), which he wouldn't have wanted to do if his aim was to break all ties to his past. He may have formulated a plan that he believed (rightly or wrongly), would earn him money that he could use to live on and buy new clothes etc.

I just wish that Andrew would send a postcard to his parents (if he can) saying that he is alive, but does not currently feel ready to establish contact with them. At least it would relieve some of the pain that they are currently going through. I feel very sorry for all families of missing people, but Andrew's Dad and Ben Needham's Mum both particularly get to me. I hope that they both get the answers they seek as soon as possible.

 

[Farley]

My head says that Andrew is more likely to be dead, but my heart (and my friend's possible sighting) says that he is alive.

I had a thought just now - If the Gosdens (or anyone else) go searching for Andrew in London again, it would be worth signing up to the dating apps that rely on location data to give matches. They could use filters to only give matches that fit Andrew's age. They should use both Gay and Hetrosexual apps. Its a long shot, but you never know...

I still very much get the vibe that Andrew was a worrier, who 'felt' things very deeply. This could have led him to have a great deal of anxiety and even possibly depression. If he really was being bullied and/or struggling with his sexuality, then maybe he just couldn't cope anymore. He may have got himself into a state of mind where he was convinced (wrongly) that his parents would be disappointed with him and disapprove of the life choices he wanted to make.

I don't feel that we can rule out him running away based upon leaving some of his money behind and not taking his clothes. He was a very clever boy, and gifted at mathematics (a sign of an analytical and logical mind). He would have known that taking all of the money and his clothing would leave too much of a trial (by confirming that he was a runaway and still alive), which he wouldn't have wanted to do if his aim was to break all ties to his past. He may have formulated a plan that he believed (rightly or wrongly), would earn him money that he could use to live on and buy new clothes etc.

I just wish that Andrew would send a postcard to his parents (if he can) saying that he is alive, but does not currently feel ready to establish contact with them. At least it would relieve some of the pain that they are currently going through. I feel very sorry for all families of missing people, but Andrew's Dad and Ben Needham's Mum both particularly get to me. I hope that they both get the answers they seek as soon as possible.

The reason I don't think he ran away is because it just makes no sense for me there's many things that point away from that. He can't have been as bright as is thought if he really thought a 14 year old boy would be able to just make a new life for himself in London. And there's a difference between being academically advance and street smart, the two don't go hand in hand very often. To survive in London (or any big city, alone, broke and homeless and 14) Andrew would have had to be very very street smart. He wasn't.

He wasn't stupid. His parents wouldn't have noticed right away that he had taken all his money. They would have checked after they realised he was missing. Giving him the exact same amount of time to make his escape and leaving no more of a trace than him taking money out of his account. But at least a few more days worth of money. Same with clothes. They would have only checked when they realised he was missing.

He didn't take his PSP charger. By all accounts gaming was his favourite thing to do. If he wasn't intending to come back then he would have taken his charger. He was at the end of the day a child and his PSP was by all accounts very important to him.

Why didn't he put a coat on? If you're running away in mid September you put on a coat. Or at least a jumper (if you don't want parents to notice your coat missing).

Andrew wasn't some troubled kid hooked on drugs or alcohol who thought his parents were interfering in his life etc. His parents have said they had no problem at all when their children decided not to go to church because they wanted them to be supported in whatever path they decided to take. Even if he was struggling with his sexuality I don't think he would have just upped and moved to London without at least trying to broach the subject with his parents (as someone who came out age 19 I very much understand that struggle).

Obviously we all have our own opinions and I respect yours but I don't think Andrew decided to run away. There is imho too many things that don't point to that. Leaving money, no charger, no coat etc.

I can't believe he's been missing 9 years. Like you I just hope his family get some answer and soon.

 

[ekardh]

Absolutely. I'm not buying that Andrew runaway from home. Like Farley said, the typical signs simply aren't there.

I agree that he went to hang out for the day with someone he knew, be it IRL or online. Someone who agreed to drive him back up from London afterwards. And unfortunately Andrew was met with foul play by this individual.

 

[flutterby]

Ok, I realise that this woman was a lot older than Andrew, but people do disappear and not contact their parents. She disappeared at 25 and was only found 36 years later. I think as there's no proof to confirm either way that he's alive or not, then we should assume he's alive.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-36-years-told-She-doesnt-want-meet-you.html

 

[AndrewGosresearch]

The man at Leominster never did get back in touch with the police, Jackalyn? I know that someone wrote into the One Show and said that they had tried, albeit, unsuccessfully, to talk to some Missing Person organisations about Andrew. Well, that makes no sense at all. Any credible lead would have been followed up and passed on. And also, why are we told nothing about the full content of this letter to the BBC? If you wanted to give info about Andrew, you would have written something down that would have made your claim, credible. Any ideas?

And I have been doing research for some considerable time on this story and have about 50 pages of my own notes, so if you would like to speak with me directly, please do. Many thanks.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

The man at Leominster never did get back in touch with the police, Jackalyn?

Welcome, AndrewGosresearch - your name suggests you're quite into this case, is there anything important we've missed?!

 

[AndrewGosresearch]

I have conducted many interviews with people who knew Andrew. My gut instinct after research is that he was bored with school (He was a maths genius as you probably know) and wanted to move to London. I think he was meeting someone that he knew well and that he was promised a lift home at some stage over the weekend, or a phone call later to his parents explaining why he traveled to London and bunked school for the first time, on Friday.

Doncaster held little interest to him. He loved London, it's museums, and let's not forget, the endless possibilities for someone as clever as Andrew. I have been in contact with the family on many occasions. They are obviously baffled and distraught that nothing of any significance has come to light since he went missing 14th Sept 2007.

In the CCTV, as Andrew is exiting Kings Cross station, he is heading in the direction of the taxi's parked outside. Incidentally, it is also the only place where someone could pull a car up outside if they were meeting him. In my opinion, he DEFINITELY knew who he was meeting, and they had his trust. My gut instinct is that they also lived in London.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I have conducted many interviews with people who knew Andrew. My gut instinct after research is that he was bored with school (He was a maths genius as you probably know) and wanted to move to London. I think he was meeting someone that he knew well and that he was promised a lift home at some stage over the weekend, or a phone call later to his parents explaining why he traveled to London and bunked school for the first time, on Friday.

Doncaster held little interest to him. He loved London, it's museums, and let's not forget, the endless possibilities for someone as clever as Andrew. I have been in contact with the family on many occasions. They are obviously baffled and distraught that nothing of any significance has come to light since he went missing 14th Sept 2007.

In the CCTV, as Andrew is exiting Kings Cross station, he is heading in the direction of the taxi's parked outside. Incidentally, it is also the only place where someone could pull a car up outside if they were meeting him. In my opinion, he DEFINITELY knew who he was meeting, and they had his trust. My gut instinct is that they also lived in London.

Thank you. What are your thoughts on the recent posts where Andrews dad said there had been some sightings - park bench etc? An the Leominster man, could that have been who Andrew was meeting?

 

[AndrewGosresearch]

There is nothing solid at all on the sightings and there is no way of following them up. The man in Leominster could have something to do with Andrew, but we just don't know. Any serious person who took the trouble to write into the BBC and yet give no concrete information to make his letter, credible, leads us nowhere.

Recent posts sadly add nothing to the investigation. Andrew has quite simply 'disappeared' since he left. And without any further leads, there is little more that can be done with the case for now. What makes me so angry is how negligent South Yorkshire Police were in the initial search.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

There is nothing solid at all on the sightings and there is no way of following them up. The man in Leominster could have something to do with Andrew, but we just don't know. Any serious person who took the trouble to write into the BBC and yet give no concrete information to make his letter, credible, leads us nowhere.

Recent posts sadly add nothing to the investigation. Andrew has quite simply 'disappeared' since he left. And without any further leads, there is little more that can be done with the case for now. What makes me so angry is how negligent South Yorkshire Police were in the initial search.

Yes, a closer look at CCTV early on could well have cracked this at the time.

Dare I ask, what's your gut feeling on what became of Andrew?