GUILTY UK - Katie Rough, 7, killed by teen, Woodthorpe, York, 10 Jan 2017

[Diamba85]

1999 http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/p_to_r/reporting_restrictions/#an04

Legal jargon :scared:

Thanks for the clarification. Interesting read.


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[SaberTooth]

It's difficult, it seems somewhat planned. Children don't just carry around Stanley knives. It was also in a somewhat secluded area. But of course we don't know exactly and just have to wait for more details. <modsnip>

 

[Cherwell]

Is this a new law because we knew the names of James Bulgers killers

No, it is not a new law. The Bulger killers were referred to as Child A and Child B throughout their arrest and trial.
The judge made the decision to name them publicly after they were convicted.

 

[Nobodyinparticular]

I can't bieve people can come to confusions of restraining a child hiding her down to stab to ki or cut her throat that aporsny it wasn't. I'm certain that the 15 yr old lost her temper and snapped but did not intend to kill. There's not another charge the police can charge her with. A child died at the hands of another child, a 15 yr old is still a chd in the eyes of the law. The only option is to charge her with murder at this stage until later court hearings when it will be scaled down to manslaughter. I wish people who know nothing about mental health children's services, and the laws in our country would try refrain themselves from making idiotic comments such as holding a chd down to Intentionally kill without knowing the options to the police and cos under current law where a child or an adult dies in circumstances of violence. The charge is always murder until approx 7-8 months down the line if crown courts and please bargaining. It will without doubt be scaled down. <modsnip> sane as NHS underfunding drs same and local government adult social care. People dying at high rate everyday of no adult social care,, no mental health services adult and chdren, disabled and old dying at home and at hospital because lack of funding. All these add up to many thousands each year but that's not shocking as it wasn't someone use a weapon on another.

 

[KT76]

I work in a primary school and unfortunately children bringing weapons to school is not as uncommon as you would think.

Mental health is also becoming an issue- whether its increasing or we're more aware and understanding of it now, I can't say. I deal with children with very complex needs and as sad as this case is, I can't say, nor do any of my colleagues, that we're shocked.

I did see that the police were examining a black Peugeot car at the scene. My initial thought was I wondered if they had got a lift with an older male (boyfriend) of the 15 y/o who she was forbidden to see and Katie said she would tell...then totally summising here- if the 15 year old did have mental issues (which is likely) she may have had a knife for self harming, little Katie might have discovered it and threatened to 'tell' which resulted in this tragedy.

<modsnip>

It will be interesting to see what unfolds.

My thoughts are with the family.

 

[SaberTooth]

Nobodyinparticular I respect you made some good points however this post isn't specifically directed to talk about mental health services and the NHS.<modnsip>If you wish to start a discussion on mental health and the NHS you can start your own thread. <modsnip>

Yes she may very well receive lesser or no charges. As many have stated they are a variety of reasons as to why she has committed this act. It could be pre mediated or simply an outburst . But why did this happen? Maybe you are correct and her family sought help from the nhs but did not receive the support required and if this is so hopefully she can receive the help she needs to be rehabilitated. Also many have offered their condolences and have stated sympathy for what this mother and her family are going through to have lost possibly two precious family members.

 

[Diamba85]

No, it is not a new law. The Bulger killers were referred to as Child A and Child B throughout their arrest and trial.
The judge made the decision to name them publicly after they were convicted.

Aaah ok that makes sense. Thanks.


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[jessie]

No, it is not a new law. The Bulger killers were referred to as Child A and Child B throughout their arrest and trial.
The judge made the decision to name them publicly after they were convicted.

Have they now kept the original names or changed them?

 

[Hexenb]

<modsnip> I know someone who is still waiting for a ADHD support group and they have been waiting a year! Too many cut backs especially in the mental health sector. Where I live there are a few care in the community homes and clearly some of them should not be out alone one recently came into a shop and dropped his trousers to me, he is known in the area and is not supposed to be out alone, I did report it to the police as if he had done that to a child who was with the father I could imagine it ending badly but, he is however still wandering and at night on his own its just a disaster waiting to happen!

 

[Cherwell]

Have they now kept the original names or changed them?

Changed them, although one of them has been outed more than once and has been in more trouble.
The other as far as I know has succeeded in living quietly within the law.

 

[Diamba85]

Have they now kept the original names or changed them?

They've been changed twice now since their release if I remember rightly. Which beggars belief if the judge specifically wanted them named and known.


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[tlcya]

Share your thoughts and theories - but do not personalize. It's okay to agree to disagree.

That is the beauty of a forum like this. Getting different perspectives. How terribly boring if we all just sat around thinking and believing the same things and patting one another on the back about how clever we are.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

What the heck?!

"There are currently 507 users browsing this thread. (21 members and 486 guests)"

Never have I ever seen that many users on a UK thread!! Welcome, all!

 

[Eileen730]

It's difficult, it seems somewhat planned. Children don't just carry around Stanley knives. It was also in a somewhat secluded area. But of course we don't know exactly and just have to wait for more details. But you have a point, siblings fight it's normal, it's just wondering what made it escalate to where she slashed her throat? Even at 15, that's an excessive solution.

Do u remember Alyssa Bustamante?
She murdered her little neighbor Elizabeth Olten she wanted to know what it felt like to kill someone. She even dug a grave days before. That was awful ... so is this.
RIP little one.

 

[Ellmau]

The knife probably belonged to dad for household things.

 

[atm9533]

This is the only place I can find comments about this case. I have been looking at all the UK sites and there are no comments that I can find.

 

[Cherwell]

The knife probably belonged to dad for household things.

It's a type of knife favoured by self-harmers, so that is worth considering.

 

[SaberTooth]

Do u remember Alyssa Bustamante?
She murdered her little neighbor Elizabeth Olten she wanted to know what it felt like to kill someone. She even dug a grave days before. That was awful ... so is this.
RIP little one.

Yes ive heard of the case, however this case reminded me of the Becky Watts case. More in the sense of the family dynamic. She could have killed her to purely kill someone. I'm sure as it goes to trial we will find out more. At this point we know very little on her history. <modsnip>

 

[sar2them1984]

I did see that the police were examining a black Peugeot car at the scene. My initial thought was I wondered if they had got a lift with an older male (boyfriend) of the 15 y/o who she was forbidden to see and Katie said she would tell...then totally summising here- if the 15 year old did have mental issues (which is likely) she may have had a knife for self harming, little Katie might have discovered it and threatened to 'tell' which resulted in this tragedy.

<modsnip> ...

Hi all - I'm back after an extended break from websleuths (dad dying, work hectic etc) but when I saw this I just had to come back to put my thoughts forward.

I assumed the car was what the mom/dad arrived in. I need to look back through everything I've read but I'm sure it's been stated that one or both of the parents pulled up haphazardly at the entrance to the alley. Why police would pay any particular interest to it though I'm not sure.

Press are reporting it as a Stanley knife. As someone else has said, is it a Stanley knife or a craft knife. 15 year olds doing GCSE Graphic design would most likely be carrying a craft knife after school, normally in one of those clear art folders. Easily mistaken to call it a Stanley knife, I know I did when I did graphics and the teacher was always correcting me.

<modsnip>

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[Bohemian]

Teenage girl appears in UK court charged with murder of seven-year-old girl
ABC News Australia
THU JAN 12 00:57:13 AEDST 2017

'A 15-year-old girl has appeared in court accused of murdering a seven-year-old girl in the northern English town of York, in a case that has shocked the nation.

The suspect, who cannot be named because she is a minor, is charged with murder and possession of an offensive weapon, North Yorkshire Police said.

Police had earlier named the victim as Katie Rough and released a picture of a smiling girl in a light blue school uniform dress clapping her hands.

After an eight-minute appearance at York Magistrates Court during which she did not speak, the suspect was remanded in custody in secure accommodation, local media reported.

She is due to appear on Friday before Leeds Crown Court, which handles serious crimes.'

Related:


Family of Katie Rough, 7, thank public following outpouring of sympathy
The Northern Echo